gixer1 Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 I think benefits should be calculated fairly on the house holds joint income,any benefits also be paid on merit ie you ain't paid into the system don't expect to get tidily squat out,that would sort out the system out a lot,leave school with no intention of ever working you won't expect to get any payments,a pretty Victorian system but it cuts out foreign scroungers,and any one that thinks they can ride the system all their lives,at the other end of the spectrum is the fact that benefits can only be paid up to 26k that is still above what many full working couples.I think a little more thought needs to be put in to the benefit system Agree! If they want to do it that way fine by me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lampwick Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 I can IMO see very liitle diffrents in others inculding myself funding and paying for others children be it now or later when leaving home . One I cant see why part of my taxes goes on funding others children like I said before this is truly a choice not a right to have children . Where as getting old or needing the NHS is fact of life for us all and I dont mind paying taxes for the greater good but once again funding your children should not be anybody elses problem other than the parents of the child. Be it some dole collecting CHAV or a millonaire or even a PW forum member THERE YOUR CHILDREN not mine would you like to fund my gundogs and ferrets I dont think so . So why should I and other fund your childs up bringing. Kind regards OTH I presume you will be offering to pay back the money your parents got for you as a child and the money which subsidised your education including the college one? Not everyone on the dole is a sponger! get real. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bluebarrels Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 No point worrying about it, we cant change it. Its the way of the world im afraid. Taxes go up, Liverpool go down. Nowt you can do, so lets all go shooting and have some fun. Peace and Love! Peace and Love! :blink: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 (edited) Agree! I earn way over the proposed cut off, and my youngest is coming up to 16 so I suppose it wont bother me then BUT I would have seriously whined if I had lost it as I have damn well contributed more than enough to consider child benefit my RIGHT. Perhaps if they stopped allowing kids to be used as an income, and stopped supporting non contributory immigrants IE your welcome if you can support yourself,but not if you cant, then maybe we might get somewhere. KW Again I agree totally, if you are of use to the uk then by all means you are welcome but as for false asylum- we are at bursting point! We can do no more to help without damaging our own country irreversibly. - you only jump in the water to help a drowning victim if you are a strong swimmer, if you are drowning yourself all you do is add to the problem! Edited October 4, 2010 by gixer1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 Why do they always go for the easy money? The illegal immigrants are costing us alot more and I bet just about every one of us knows someone who is claiming for something they shouldn't yet nothing is done about this! Stupid stories like immigrants being housed in ridiculously expensive homes etc, it's just the usual of hammering those that actuay work for their money! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 I personally think the proposed implementation is unfair but in the big scheme of things reckon it's small beer compared to the hit that will affect lower income families in the coming months and years. As to "why should I or others fund your childs upbringing" - err hmm - amongst other things - chances are my kids will be part funding your old age and NHS bills in some part in the years to come. Also it's been around I beleive since like 1945 so the chances are you / your parents already "benefitted" from it. Yes, indeedy - you are entitled to your polarised opinion but it's flawed, badly flawed at best and most likely damn right hypocritical! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MM Posted October 4, 2010 Report Share Posted October 4, 2010 I dont agree with a lot that goes on in the world, but i find it raises my blood pressure when i worry about it. The government (maybe) know what they need to do, and are going the right way about it. You cant please all of the people all of the time. Dont lose sleep over these things. Politics and government policy can make turn people into bitter ol farts. Have a read of this, and it might take your mind off child benifits for a while If I could offer you only one tip for the future, sunscreen would be it. The long term benefits of sunscreen have been proved by scientists whereas the rest of my advice has no basis more reliable than my own meandering experienceI will dispense this advice now. Enjoy the power and beauty of your youth; oh nevermind; you will not understand the power and beauty of your youth until they have faded. But trust me, in 20 years youll look back at photos of yourself and recall in a way you cant grasp now how much possibility lay before you and how fabulous you really looked.Youre not as fat as you imagine. Dont worry about the future; or worry, but know that worrying is as effective as trying to solve an algebra equation by chewing bubblegum. The real troubles in your life are apt to be things that never crossed your worried mind; the kind that blindside you at 4pm on some idle Tuesday. Do one thing everyday that scares you Sing Dont be reckless with other peoples hearts, dont put up with people who are reckless with yours. Floss Dont waste your time on jealousy; sometimes youre ahead, sometimes youre behindthe race is long, and in the end, its only with yourself. Remember the compliments you receive, forget the insults; if you succeed in doing this, tell me how. Keep your old love letters, throw away your old bank statements. Stretch Dont feel guilty if you dont know what you want to do with your lifethe most interesting people I know didnt know at 22 what they wanted to do with their lives, some of the most interesting 40 year olds know still dont. Get plenty of calcium. Be kind to your knees, youll miss them when theyre gone. Maybe youll marry, maybe you wont, maybe youll have children, maybe you wont, maybe youll divorce at 40, maybe youll dance the funky chicken on your 75th wedding anniversarywhat ever you do, dont congratulate yourself too much or berate yourself either your choices are half chance, so are everybody elses. Enjoy your body, use it every way you candont be afraid of it, or what other people think of it, its the greatest instrument youll ever own.. Danceeven if you have nowhere to do it but in your own living room. Read the directions, even if you dont follow them. Do NOT read beauty magazines, they will only make you feel ugly. Get to know your parents, you never know when theyll be gone for good. Be nice to your siblings; they are the best link to your past and the people most likely to stick with you in the future. Understand that friends come and go,but for the precious few you should hold on. Work hard to bridge the gaps in geography in lifestyle because the older you get, the more you need the people you knew when you were young. Live in New York City once, but leave before it makes you hard; live in Northern California once, but leave before it makes you soft. Travel. Accept certain inalienable truths, prices will rise, politicians will philander, you too will get old, and when you do youll fantasize that when you were young prices were reasonable, politicians were noble and children respected their elders. Respect your elders. Dont expect anyone else to support you. Maybe you have a trust fund, maybe you have a wealthy spouse; but you never know when either one might run out. Dont mess too much with your hair, or by the time its 40, it will look 85. Be careful whose advice you buy, but, be patient with those who supply it. Advice is a form of nostalgia, dispensing it is a way of fishing the past from the disposal, wiping it off, painting over the ugly parts and recycling it for more than its worth. But trust me on the sunscreen... See, now dont you feel better about the small things? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookiemonsterandmerlin. Posted October 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 Old age and illness is a fact of life that happens to us all I dont mind dipping in foor that . I understand that myself has had children benefit when I was younger and didnt and could not refuse it as I was a kid . Does that make it wrong that later in life when I have wised up to it I can change my thoughts and think that its wrong. For all you child benefit lovers if you can send me a cheque for £5 each for the up keep of my dogs then please PM me . Because that bascally what I am doing for you though taxation . I have not had a holiday for 6 years due to cost me and wife both work 40hrs a wekk plus . It would be nice to get a little bit of money each week for free to put in a savings account to pay for a nice little famliy trip . I know some of you dont agree with my comments but as it seems you will have to earn more than 44k for it to stop that would seem to not affect many on here . Kind regards OTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 It is the thin end of the wedge. There will be plenty more discussions on here in due course because there are a bundle of cuts coming. The Country is skint. Lets get back to blaming the bankers and the fact that the City can't consider anything other than short term gains at long term cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest gloker Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 We put our sons child benefit into his bank account, so when ours is stopped (Our joint income is over the threshold) his bank account is the only thing to suffer. So some would say we dont need it in the first place? ( I personally think that if mrs scrote on the corner in the big house can fiddle the benefit system so that they are paying for her ever increasing brood and her mortgage/cars/satellite tv and her drink/cigs/drug habits then my boy can have £18 a week. I certainly pay more than my fair share in taxes) The country is skint. We are still at war too in case anyone has forgotten (expensive bothersome things wars) We are still lobbing money at the NHS like it is the best thing since sliced bread (prefer uncut malted personally) and paying bankers billions for ******* our money down the drain! My opinion for what its worth (dons tin hat) If you dont pay in to the pot, you shouldnt get anything from the pot! The NHS is a failing business model because of this. (Yes I know its not a business, but you try tellling my manager/directors/primary care trust/strategic health authority/local government) The NHS is possibly the biggest example of throwing good money after bad ever. Weekends spent goint to drunk after drunk after drunk can make you a miserable cynical old #### and start making you having nazi thoughts toward the great unwashed! Drunken/drugged halfwits are leading this fine country of ours to financial ruin. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nial Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 So why should I and other fund your childs up bringing. Fair enough, just as long as you don't expect our kids to treat you in the NHS, or come round to protect you if you've had any troble, collect your rubbish, pay the taxes that cover your pension. The country needs the next generation. Child benefit is a good idea but does anyone on a higher income actually need it? I'd argue the same with the winter fuel allowance, my parents and in-laws definitely don't need it, this could be money saved or it could be targeted at those who _really_ need it. Nial. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sako751sg Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 No point worrying about it, we cant change it. Its the way of the world im afraid. Taxes go up, Liverpool go down. Nowt you can do, so lets all go shooting and have some fun. Peace and Love! Peace and Love! The voice of reason fella.Im the same.No point whinging,just get on with life as we can change nothing.We are just reaping the ***** sown by labour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crosshair Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 A CHILD IS FOR LIFE NOT JUST FOR BENEFITS Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dr W Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 Sounds perfectly reasonable to me although agree should be on household income to make it fair, if you've got say £80k+ a year household income you don't need the extra couple of quid in child benefit. Same with winter fuel allowance should DEFINITELY be means tested Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SimonT Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 I am above the threshold and already pay a stupid amount of tax. I will enjoy having the money taken off me for some BUM who cant be bothered to work, or some refugee who needs a nice 4 bed house in London. I think in order to recieve any benefit you need to have contributed in some way to the British society for at least 7 years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 I am above the threshold and already pay a stupid amount of tax. I will enjoy having the money taken off me for some BUM who cant be bothered to work, or some refugee who needs a nice 4 bed house in London.I think in order to recieve any benefit you need to have contributed in some way to the British society for at least 7 years. Totally agree with the above... OTH - must be nice to have claimed the child benefits via your parents and now turn round and say "lets stop that now"..... Yes i earn over the threshold, as could anyone else on here who wants to bust thier ***** and push limits, my wages are not handed to me because my company has an excess of money....the are EARNED! and i bet in some way or another your dog(s) can be paid for by the taxes - if it was ever to escape and be picked up by a dog warden to prevent it being run over or injuring others - it would then be taken to a holding cage and you will get a call to say - came and pick it up and pay the £20 charge - do you really think this £20 pays for the persons wages who caught the dog and the housing of it for as long as it may be there? I gaurantee the way my son will be raised will ensure he pays more into society and the UK sysytem than he EVER takes out of it.....infact i personaaly think i've already paid in enough to cover me, my wife and up to 2 kids no problem at all..... As a matter of fact the only RTA I was involved in which ended in me being ambulanced away - my insurance company was charged for both the ambulance and the recovery vehicle! Regards, Gixer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman2 Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 (edited) Tripe! I accept it because it may make my Childs future easier and as I don't claim anything else I'm sure as hell that this one small perk (which really is just a reduction in the amount the government already steals from me) is going to be enjoyed by my son, it's there to benefit my child, and I see fit to hold this in an account to gain interest and maybe help them with a car or house in the future, when you usually need it most (leaving the family home maybe?) Regards, Gixer What you are paying for is an insurance against infirmity gixer, your attitude of taking withiut need to take, just because you have paid in as you see it, and withdrawn little means nothing, you or yours could be struck down tommorow with a life changing disease and cost the rest of us for the rest of your/their lives. People taking out without need is why others cannot get life-saving drugs/treatments, when youve banked 10k for him and patted yourself on the back, ask yourself who had to die for it, cos someone did. Edited October 5, 2010 by manxman2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 What you are paying for is an insurance against infirmity gixer, your attitude of taking withiut need to take, just because you have paid in as you see it, and withdrawn little means nothing, you or yours could be struck down tommorow with a life changing disease and cost the rest of us for the rest of your/their lives.People taking out without need is why others cannot get life-saving drugs/treatments, when youve banked 10k for him and patted yourself on the back, ask yourself who had to die for it, cos someone did. Tripe again! what makes you think i am not already paying for an illness on PRIVATE health care...... think again mate.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DSPUK Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 30+ yrs ago child benefit and benefit as a whole was sustainable - most of the adult population was working and paying tax into the system - Then we had start of immigration and slowly but surely it has increased to today level - also in that time the UK as a manufacturing nation has disappeared so now we have less workers paying tax and a lot more getting state handout's - What I can't understand is if I as one of the countries drone workers (someone who keeps the basic system running for not a lot of pay) could see it was getting top heavy why couldn't those in charge ? - now we are in the carp and it needs drastic surgery but everyone is now moaning - The civil servants are moaning - the police and teachers -- I name those three because they have done very well but indirectly my tax and council tax is going to pay their pensions -- pensions that are massively greater than mine and I am paying more from my pension to fund it -- On top of that there are the scoungers on massively more than I have ever earnt so Yes in my opinion there should be massive cut -- I have no kids which was my choice - our first mortgage payments rose to more than my monthly income due to the 15% interest (think it was 15%) and we struggled for years and when we were able to have kids we didn't want them but I have always paid for other peoples -- I was accosted once by woman collecting for kids and I said fine when do I get to screw the mother - the wife dragged me away. As regard from saying should our parents pay it back - remember they never got it for the first child and at time the majority of population was on low incomes. They didn't get tax credits. As an aside can someone tell me what it's like to have 40k a year income - singley or joint -- I supose I should ask a single mother of 9 kids and she would say it's not enough. The people of this country became greedy and lived beyond their means -- credit cards in long plastic cases - re-mortgage because house was worth more etc etc etc and now become used to all the luxuries of life.. -- I have the luxuries of life - I have just bought my first ever tumble drier now I can't afford the electric Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookiemonsterandmerlin. Posted October 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 This is truly nuts I am only complaining about a percentage of my taxes going to others earning as gixer1 says his self alot of money . I am truly in favour of taxes to help myself and you for unforseen situations like illness and old age but I am not willing to fund others children upbringing . I am attacking child benefits not taxes and dog wardens etc comes under taxations as a whole. Yes part of my taxes should go to childrens heathcare and education but it should not go directly to parents for them to put in saving accounts. Kind regards OTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
manxman2 Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 (edited) Tripe again! what makes you think i am not already paying for an illness on PRIVATE health care...... think again mate.... Tripe is it, well wait until its your turn to watch a loved one die in months because both sets of treatments prior that the specialist recommends, that he says would give them a better than 80% ten year survival rate is turned down due to cost, and they are abandoned to die. Dont come back with private medical care etc, as it just shows t even more that you dont need the money, its just greed. 40 years of paying into the system to be refused life-saving treatment, and you think you have a god given right cos youve paid in a few bob. Edited October 5, 2010 by manxman2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 Yes part of my taxes should go to childrens heathcare and education but it should not go directly to parents for them to put in saving accounts. Kind regards OTH whether the money comes from benefit or not, I will still save it for my son, my point is - all this £80 a month does is reduce the money I pay into the system, it's not a plus to me, it just reduces the minus the goverment already take from me!!! what i do with the money does not matter as if i put it in the bank, i use my earned £80 for the nappies etc, if i don't the benefit gets used for the nappies etc.... as i have already said if they want to do it on a percentage in/percentage out then it's fine by me! and also if you haven't bothered to get your **** to an interview in the last 6 month and you do not have an illness then why should you get any benefits at all? you should rot in my book.... Regards Gixer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cookiemonsterandmerlin. Posted October 5, 2010 Author Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 OTH - must be nice to have claimed the child benefits via your parents and now turn round and say "lets stop that now"..... Regards, Gixer. Policy change over hundreds of years just because my parents claimed which they didnt not as I spent 4 years in care . Does not mean I should agree with them in adult life. This is what taxation is for to protect children in need not to go in saving accounts for rainning days of the child or parents. Kind reagrds OTH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gixer1 Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 This is what taxation is for to protect children in need not to go in saving accounts This "savings" account may just protect my son in the future if anything happens to me or my wife....it is my way of setting up as many possible safety nets for my children as possible....financial and other bases, in this climate i could be out of work tomorrow and need to move or look elsewhere...so i make hay while the sun shines.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted October 5, 2010 Report Share Posted October 5, 2010 the funny thing about the argument is one hand is saying we don't want to pay child benefits to people who can afford to have children, what they are missing out on is they are the people paying enough tax to cover themselves. Its a ****ty system the entire benefits one and one that could really wind you up. My other half is a Council housing officer so sees all the dregs and does seem to tell a lot that they are only in over crowded accomodation because they keep breeding and that side of it stinks. Get yourself a council house and it is never reassesed you pay your £80 or so a week rent and thats it, have more kids they will give you a bigger house and won't ever ask you to move out. What she would like to see is means testing for council house rent as she has people in earning 50K a year and still paying their pittance and being subsidised by everyone else, suddenly you would change social housing and make it less attractive to stay in for life. There is a lot needs changing and its got to happen before UKplc goes bust Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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