vampire Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 So you were shooting in a public place were you ,because thats the only time these dogs should of been under control,ie on a lead. I can tell you that a fully grown intact male german shepard would take you out without any problem and they dont bite ankles they want to get your face,use their claws to bring you down,trust me it was surprised to see you and wanted to let you know it was there with its pack and for you to go away,shooting in the air must have scared them away backed up by the owner calling em back. A previous post got it right when they said to fire a warning shot.......LONG BEFORE anyone gets near you,then break open your gun and wait for them to pass. Never shoot anyones dog unless human life depends on it,i can assure you that you will get more than you bargained for........i would protect my dog with my life regardless of consequence if someone threatened to kill him,so think on next time you get scared by a big dog. You ought to reconsider pocessing, a sgc for even thinking about shooting a dog even if it bit you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Thought we were talking about a shotgun ? If left to the point that the 2 big german shepherds are latched onto you then surely It'd be too late to shoot them in self defence ? As you'd pretty much be dragged down by them :look: I believe we were, just chucking a bit more into the equation, this crops up all the time for FAC/SGC!! This subject always get excitable, if you shoot a dog just have a very good reason and argument ready for when plod comes calling, because trust me, YOU will be in the wrong until you can show otherwise! I would be reasonably confident that if you could show plod great missing gaps of flesh you would be in the clear! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
working dog Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Interesting topic and one that is in my mind when I take my dogs out. Shepherds are big, intimidating dogs to some people. I can see why they worry some people and respect that. I wont let mine off lead if I know that there are people shooting in the fields as one of mine is protection trained and does spark up if he hears a gun. A couple of videos to illustrate that you dont need a big dog to do damage. This is a mates small bitch (about 28kgs)who could do serious damage in the wrong hands. Bite work initilly with a gun attack at around 1 min 36 seconds The dog is trained to target the left arm Then sending the dog to bite and recalling from the bite at the last second(serious amount of control here. Anyone letting big dogs off lead should have a bullet proof recall. Lots of other videos on there for anyone interested Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vipa Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) You ought to reconsider pocessing, a sgc for even thinking about shooting a dog even if it bit you. I have to say, you have a very skewed opinion of the value of human life and safety. Whilst I can appreciate the emotional attachment to a dog (my wife still refers to our late dog as 'her first baby') In no way or under any circumstances would it come before the safety, security or life of a human unless that human was attacking it/it's owner. Farmers have the right to shoot a dog for worrying livestock, I'm damned sure I'd have the right to shoot one if it had it's teeth sunk into me! Whether or not it would be possible to shoot a dog once it had got to that point is debatable. Also, if a dog bit me and I went to the Police, I'm pretty sure it would be destroyed anyway! My FAC has words on it to the effect of "For killing animals for the protection of other animals or humans" Edited August 30, 2011 by Vipa Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) I feel you did the right thing, It seems the warning shot did the trick. I'd report it straight away and explain EVERYTHING and get a reference number. This covers you off the bat. Before shooting the dog, which should always be a last resort (which could possibly get you into a whole world of trouble), take your mask, balaclava, cap, hood off etc and square up to the dog - don't turn or chances are it will bite you. If that still didn't work, like you did, give a warning shot. If it didn’t work I'd then would have given it a good kick in the head. If It came back I'd have shot it - I’d rather a pet die then a human. For thoes to say you shouldn't shoot it, even as an absolute last resort - have fun sitting in hospital with a muled face (If you can even make it there) Edited August 30, 2011 by Beretta Italy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vampire Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 (edited) I have to say, you have a very skewed opinion of the value of human life and safety. Whilst I can appreciate the emotional attachment to a dog (my wife still refers to our late dog as 'her first baby') In no way or under any circumstances would it come before the safety, security or life of a human unless that human was attacking it/it's owner. Farmers have the right to shoot a dog for worrying livestock, I'm damned sure I'd have the right to shoot one if it had it's teeth sunk into me! Whether or not it would be possible to shoot a dog once it had got to that point is debatable. Also, if a dog bit me and I went to the Police, I'm pretty sure it would be destroyed anyway! My FAC has words on it to the effect of "For killing animals for the protection of other animals or humans" Vipa,the statement was aimed directly at the op and not a general view and i did say shoot it IF human life was at stake....at which point you make that decision is up to the individual and conseqently the courts. I cannot understand how you can decide IF a dog is going to bite/attack you (threatened/scared you)and you should shoot it before it bites you,other than it HAS attacked you and you are still able to get to your gun,in which case i would assume that the dog has stopped attacking you and that you are shooting it out of revenge. Either way you would be in trouble in any court. Edited August 30, 2011 by vampire Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poontang Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 square up to the dog - don't turn or chances are it will bite you. If it didn’t work I'd then would have given it a good kick in the head. That's perfect advice.............. if you want the dogs to attack you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tigger Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Interesting topic and one that is in my mind when I take my dogs out. Shepherds are big, intimidating dogs to some people. I can see why they worry some people and respect that. I wont let mine off lead if I know that there are people shooting in the fields as one of mine is protection trained and does spark up if he hears a gun. A couple of videos to illustrate that you dont need a big dog to do damage. This is a mates small bitch (about 28kgs)who could do serious damage in the wrong hands. Bite work initilly with a gun attack at around 1 min 36 seconds The dog is trained to target the left arm Then sending the dog to bite and recalling from the bite at the last second(serious amount of control here. Anyone letting big dogs off lead should have a bullet proof recall. Lots of other videos on there for anyone interested Some cracking videos there buddy my dad used to train dogs at Marham when he was a MP in the RAF love the one in the car Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdSolomons Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 I've got to say if I felt my life was in danger I'd have no problem laying a dog out. No different to someone breaking in to my house and threatening my life. If it's my life/welbeing or a dog, then bad luck dog. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 That's perfect advice.............. if you want the dogs to attack you LoL, Ok try turning side on/away from an angry dog, I wont be picking up your *** cheeks. Keep your ground, Look to the side of the dog - obviously don't keep eye contact and then I'd walk backwards, I wouldn't turn away. Dogs are predatory, giving chase is built in, as it is with any pack animal: Wolves, lions, tigers and cheaters etc.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Always the way.... you touch my dog, even if it just eaten the baby out of your pram and I will kill you, then there are the dog trainers who tell you to stare it down and it will turn and run with it's tail between it's legs, then there are those that will shoot the dog half a mile away just in case! Come on guys.... ..... haven't we done this all before! ATB! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Always the way.... you touch my dog, even if it just eaten the baby out of your pram and I will kill you, then there are the dog trainers who tell you to stare it down and it will turn and run with it's tail between it's legs, then there are those that will shoot the dog half a mile away just in case! Come on guys.... ..... haven't we done this all before! ATB! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TaxiDriver Posted August 30, 2011 Report Share Posted August 30, 2011 Where was the Yeovil Ninja when he's really needed ?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Budice Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 Where was the Yeovil Ninja when he's really needed ?? He was there mate, they just couldn't see him Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 So you were shooting in a public place were you ,because thats the only time these dogs should of been under control,ie on a lead. I can tell you that a fully grown intact male german shepard would take you out without any problem and they dont bite ankles they want to get your face,use their claws to bring you down,trust me it was surprised to see you and wanted to let you know it was there with its pack and for you to go away,shooting in the air must have scared them away backed up by the owner calling em back. A previous post got it right when they said to fire a warning shot.......LONG BEFORE anyone gets near you,then break open your gun and wait for them to pass. Never shoot anyones dog unless human life depends on it,i can assure you that you will get more than you bargained for........i would protect my dog with my life regardless of consequence if someone threatened to kill him,so think on next time you get scared by a big dog. You ought to reconsider pocessing, a sgc for even thinking about shooting a dog even if it bit you. Maybe you should keep control of your precious dog, and reconsider possessing a shotgun licence yourself if you feel the need to come out with over emotional ******** about protecting your uncontrolled dog with your life. Take responsibility for your animals actions and the situation wont come about in the first place. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miroku4399 Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 I agree that the shots fired in the air was probably the right thing to do, however there are other factors that need to be considered: If you tried to shoot a dog that had attached itself how would you shoot it your holding roughly four foot of gun which couldnt be controlled properly Where would you shoot it its mouth is attached itself to you somewhere so going for a body shot is probably the only option only wounding it How are you going to deal with an angry owner whether you were right or wrong he wouldnt be happy with you cant shoot him in self defence Only a few thoughts Shane Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houlsby Posted August 31, 2011 Report Share Posted August 31, 2011 iv gotta be honest here... i really wouldnt be shooting a dog if it attacked me. most dogs will ****** off if you make them aware your there.. and, on the offchance it try'd attach itself to my ancle (has happened once on a farm) i booted it under the chin and it ******** off. suppose its all about how you react. big dogs really arnt interested in mauling you. it may have come to say hello or even have a play! theres more chance of a yorkshire terrior coming over for a fight! if your aggressive towards it, obviously your openiung your own can of worms. however... why your shooting that close to dog walkers with a shotgun is another question? if its dog walking ground, i wouldnt be anyware near? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sako751sg Posted September 1, 2011 Report Share Posted September 1, 2011 (edited) So you were shooting in a public place were you ,because thats the only time these dogs should of been under control,ie on a lead. I can tell you that a fully grown intact male german shepard would take you out without any problem and they dont bite ankles they want to get your face,use their claws to bring you down,trust me it was surprised to see you and wanted to let you know it was there with its pack and for you to go away,shooting in the air must have scared them away backed up by the owner calling em back. A previous post got it right when they said to fire a warning shot.......LONG BEFORE anyone gets near you,then break open your gun and wait for them to pass. Never shoot anyones dog unless human life depends on it,i can assure you that you will get more than you bargained for........i would protect my dog with my life regardless of consequence if someone threatened to kill him,so think on next time you get scared by a big dog. You ought to reconsider pocessing, a sgc for even thinking about shooting a dog even if it bit you. Not sure what planet you are on,but thats the worst keech i have read on here for a while.If a dog is worrying livestock,then there is a right for a conditioned rifle to shoot the animal,and rightly so.I had land where two dogs were roaming and attacking sheep,yes attacking,although to you they were probably doing something else,and the farmer asked if we could shoot them.We went to the police and explained the situation,and they said they would tell the owners to keep the dogs under control or they would be shot and they had no problem with that happening.Needless to say,we never saw the dogs again.If a dog went to bite me i would give it an almighty boot and if it came again it would be the last time it did and i wouldnt worry one bit about it. Your telling me if your dog started ripping someones wee old ladies poodle to shreds,and someone was pounding your dog to get it off you would protect it with your life,regarless of consequence? I agree a poodle is a bad choice,it probably deserved it. Edited September 1, 2011 by sako751sg Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TJ91 Posted September 1, 2011 Report Share Posted September 1, 2011 iv gotta be honest here... i really wouldnt be shooting a dog if it attacked me. most dogs will ****** off if you make them aware your there.. and, on the offchance it try'd attach itself to my ancle (has happened once on a farm) i booted it under the chin and it ******** off. suppose its all about how you react. big dogs really arnt interested in mauling you. it may have come to say hello or even have a play! theres more chance of a yorkshire terrior coming over for a fight! if your aggressive towards it, obviously your openiung your own can of worms. however... why your shooting that close to dog walkers with a shotgun is another question? if its dog walking ground, i wouldnt be anyware near? you would be no good shooting for alot of the farmers i shoot for! why the hell wouldnt you shoot near a path? there is paths allover the land i shoot, it doesnt stop me enjoying many good days shooting!! be safe and sensible and there is no problem. i cant see why the idea of shooting near a path or road is so frightening or bad to some people!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BenBhoy Posted September 1, 2011 Report Share Posted September 1, 2011 take your face mask off straight away in that situation, dogs don't know what you are otherwise. Mine gets iffy with kids with hoodies on. Personally I think you should leave it be and not report it due to the shot being fired. so does mine but she's just well trained!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vampire Posted September 1, 2011 Report Share Posted September 1, 2011 Maybe you should keep control of your precious dog, and reconsider possessing a shotgun licence yourself if you feel the need to come out with over emotional ******** about protecting your uncontrolled dog with your life. Take responsibility for your animals actions and the situation wont come about in the first place. My dog is NEVER off the lead,is fully trained at great expense and time and never 'uncontrolled' as you put it,and yes if some stupid **** with a gun threatened to shoot him because he was scared (see original post,in case youve lost track) then he had best be prepared.......,how is that emotional,i would not shoot anyones dog so i dont think i would have my sgc revoked. Not sure what planet you are on,but thats the worst keech i have read on here for a while.If a dog is worrying livestock,then there is a right for a conditioned rifle to shoot the animal,and rightly so.I had land where two dogs were roaming and attacking sheep,yes attacking,although to you they were probably doing something else,and the farmer asked if we could shoot them.We went to the police and explained the situation,and they said they would tell the owners to keep the dogs under control or they would be shot and they had no problem with that happening.Needless to say,we never saw the dogs again.If a dog went to bite me i would give it an almighty boot and if it came again it would be the last time it did and i wouldnt worry one bit about it. Your telling me if your dog started ripping someones wee old ladies poodle to shreds,and someone was pounding your dog to get it off you would protect it with your life,regarless of consequence? I agree a poodle is a bad choice,it probably deserved it. Keech,read your own stuff mate Can you actually read ,what the hell your first paragraph is to do with me i do not know ,so you are in the camp of 'i would shoot someones dog'clever bloke . If my dog started to rip your old ladies poodle to bits then i would help to pound it.What i said was,if the op shot my dog because he was scared then i would protect him at whatever cost. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
houlsby Posted September 1, 2011 Report Share Posted September 1, 2011 you would be no good shooting for alot of the farmers i shoot for! why the hell wouldnt you shoot near a path? there is paths allover the land i shoot, it doesnt stop me enjoying many good days shooting!! be safe and sensible and there is no problem. i cant see why the idea of shooting near a path or road is so frightening or bad to some people!! i just wouldnt do it. i ####ed my mate who took a shot backing onto the prison grounds on my permission last night. always find that if you keep safe and keep your head down then you have no troubles, i know how stupid the general public can be.. they litrally wander onto site sometimes. with total ignorance to their surroundings. and id hate to have an accident. air rifle near g/p is about my limit. maybe is a bit jobsworthy.. i dont care, iv got enough land to avoid the public. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozzy518 Posted September 1, 2011 Report Share Posted September 1, 2011 I agree with Vampires earlier post...A German Shepherd is easily capable of taking a man down. I know this as I have been taken down by them more times than I can remember and still have the scars to this day( Former RAF police dog handler) . A padded suit offers some protection but not 100%. 42 teeth and a bucket load of aggression aint exactly nice to be on the end of, even more so if you are unaccustomed to it and not wearing the kit. Dog walkers cetainly where I shoot care not about footpaths etc, they will happily walk along the headlands/ farm tracks etc on private land and if challenged the standard reply is that they have been doing it for years. If I see anyone approaching walking dogs off lead I will from far enough away discharge a shot so that they know im there. It is also sensible, as already mentioned, to come out of the hide remove face coverings etc. Not going to lose anything, pigeons are'nt going to come in whilst a dog is there anyway. The most dangerous and unpredictable dog is a frightened one. It will attack as a form of defence and in the case of GSDs, Rotties and other breeds with a herding instinct, will also protect the owner. Now, if having done all of the above, poochyface was to still attack me, would I shoot it? NO. No way will you be able to control a gun one handed whilst being bitten by a dog, even more so if it goes into the old head shaking routine. Whilst experience tells me when I'm about to get bitten by a dog, I personally, if all else failed, and the dog was actually going for me , would try to get it to take my left arm (i'm right handed) My right hand would then be free to use the knife I carry on my belt. I must stress, I love dogs and would hate to hurt one, but in the scenario as above, I would defend myself. The dog would have to actually be on me though,causing injury before i could justify killing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted September 1, 2011 Report Share Posted September 1, 2011 (edited) Guys, isn't this going round in circles, yes Dogs can be/are very capable of inflicting serious damage, this is what one did to a Roe I was called upon the despatch, outwardly the deer looked ummarked, yet it had been sat motionless for several hours just waiting to die. Even as I gralloched it the full extent of the damage was not evident, only when I skinned it. You can see clearly the blood damage to the meat, I seem to remember nothing at all was fit to eat! For clarification the holes you can see are totally dog inflicted, they are not bullet/shotgun holes at all, it was all the work of one dog! Edited September 1, 2011 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr_Logic Posted September 2, 2011 Report Share Posted September 2, 2011 (edited) My dog is NEVER off the lead,is fully trained at great expense and time and never 'uncontrolled' as you put it,and yes if some stupid **** with a gun threatened to shoot him because he was scared (see original post,in case youve lost track) then he had best be prepared.......,how is that emotional,i would not shoot anyones dog so i dont think i would have my sgc revoked. Keech,read your own stuff mate Can you actually read ,what the hell your first paragraph is to do with me i do not know ,so you are in the camp of 'i would shoot someones dog'clever bloke . If my dog started to rip your old ladies poodle to bits then i would help to pound it.What i said was,if the op shot my dog because he was scared then i would protect him at whatever cost. You never give your dog off-lead time? I thought you cared about him. Ah well. Edited September 2, 2011 by Mr_Logic Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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