-kev- Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Is it ok for someone to shoot with me on my permissions and borrow a gun, if they dont have section 2 licence them selves? He would be in the same hide as me and i will be transporting the guns to and from the fields. The farmer is ok with me bringing people on with me just wanted to check if its legal or not. Thanks in advance Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfletch Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Im almost %100 its OK Ive took my missus before and she has no licence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit_stu Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I just had my interviw last week, and had to sign something saying I would not let anyone without a licence use my guns... Not sure if this is just a local thing though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mfletch Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Another way to shoot shotguns and even rifles without a certificate is when you are accompanied by the landowner or his agent, (e.g. game warden), shooting on his land, using his weapons within the limitations of the authorities on the certificate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 (edited) Only the "occupier" can lend a sect 2 gun without an 11(6) exemption. As for signing to say you let anyone else use your gun then thats odd, but like the "Ian Coley" instructor clause the police seem to be making it up as they go along........... Edited February 11, 2012 by HDAV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 (edited) You must have permission from the land owner for your mate to shoot with you . You can then act as the landowners agent and supervise your mate shooting . I have done it many times over the years with rifle and shotgun . The guns that you use with this arrangement with the land owner can then be classed as estate guns .Harnser . Edited February 11, 2012 by Harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveK Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Im almost %100 its OK Ive took my missus before and she has no licence Marriage license??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-kev- Posted February 11, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 Thanks for the replys lads, still confused.com though, dont think i will risk it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Beretta28g Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 I just had my interviw last week, and had to sign something saying I would not let anyone without a licence use my guns... Not sure if this is just a local thing though Erm, I think thats very heavy handed........... What do BASC say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
leeds chimp Posted February 11, 2012 Report Share Posted February 11, 2012 personally would only want 1 gun in the hide unless its someone i know very well and has his or her own gun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Iced Tiger Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 Another similar question, can you take someone clay shooting who has not got a SGC and let them use your shotgun under your supervision? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
humperdingle Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 Thanks for the replys lads, still confused.com though, dont think i will risk it. Email your force area's firearms dept for clarification. Then you'll have evidence that you're either good to go, or otherwise. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1957 Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 I just had my interviw last week, and had to sign something saying I would not let anyone without a licence use my guns... Not sure if this is just a local thing though That is what they call 'ultra vires' and should be stamped out as quickly as possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D_No Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 Another similar question, can you take someone clay shooting who has not got a SGC and let them use your shotgun under your supervision? I did Sunday but they had to sign a declaration to say they're not prohibited under such and such! and the Clay ground has to hold some sort of exemption from the police Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OddJob Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 This seems to grey area in the legislation: http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/index.php?/topic/191829-clay-site-legalities/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vulpicide Posted February 14, 2012 Report Share Posted February 14, 2012 If you are carrying out pest control at the landowners request you are acting as his agent and you can supervise someone with one of your guns on that basis. Do not phone your police firearms dept they will tell you the "law" as they want it to be phone SACS / Basc etc they will tell you how you should proceed. PM me if you want and I will explain it. The document they got that chap to sign is a here sign this and dont ask questions document. They do'nt have one of those with my signature on it . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
-kev- Posted February 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 If you are carrying out pest control at the landowners request you are acting as his agent and you can supervise someone with one of your guns on that basis. Do not phone your police firearms dept they will tell you the "law" as they want it to be phone SACS / Basc etc they will tell you how you should proceed. PM me if you want and I will explain it. The document they got that chap to sign is a here sign this and dont ask questions document. They do'nt have one of those with my signature on it . Hi it is pest control mainly pigeon, the other thing i forgot to add is that some of the land i shoot on is only rented from other farmers, but he has Oked it with them. Does this change anything? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 It has to be said that this thread is a prime example of the reason that you should never ask a legal question on an internet forum. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FarmerSim Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 It has to be said that this thread is a prime example of the reason that you should never ask a legal question on an internet forum. +1. You would be better, IMHO, to get to know the law yourself, and yes I know this may not be "easy", but it won't do you any harm!! words on paper won't hurt you etc... If you are in a shooting organisation, then take their advice! If you aren't, then join one! ATB Sim Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Canis Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 Iced Tiger -A section 11(6) exemption certificate allows non certificate holders to shoot shotguns at a clay ground or game fair - most grounds will have this and a simple telephone call to a ground should confirm if that is the case. there's Its normal In addition many grounds may want to insist on formal lessons/instruction or accompamyment by their staff for non cert holders (rather than letting you train your friend) but that is a matter for of health & safety/buisness policy of the ground itself. People who are prohibited from shooting ( ex prisoners etc ) are not allowed to shoot under this exemption -so many grounds to cover their ***** will insist on non cert holders signing a declaration that they are not prohibited from handling firearms. With regard to the OP's question about a section 11(5) exemption- you can be seen to be the ocupier of the land for the purposes of the act if you have formal shooting rights to the land in question. and under this exemption your friend could borrow your gun under your supervision. I would be inclined to suggest that you doulble check the farmer is happy with you taking someone else on your permission- some farmers may take exception to this - you dont want to loose your permission and in law your friend may be seen to be comitting armed trespass if he is there without the landowners permission? Personally though i would suggest you phone your shooting organisation to check the advice that we are all spouting and to check if you are insured for your friends outing with you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
evo Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 it is legal providing he is with a sgc holder at all times he can even be in a different hide as long as he is in sight and hearshot of you and has permission,,i,m in the same boat with my shooting buddy as i wait for my sgc to come through,,i have checked this to be safe myself,,but you must have the permission off the landowner and i quote he must be accompanied by a sgc holder at all times,,good luck with ya shooting Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 it is legal providing he is with a sgc holder at all times he can even be in a different hide as long as he is in sight and hearshot of you and has permission,,i,m in the same boat with my shooting buddy as i wait for my sgc to come through,,i have checked this to be safe myself,,but you must have the permission off the landowner and i quote he must be accompanied by a sgc holder at all times,,good luck with ya shooting The OP asked a question and although he has said he is not going to risk it, another OP may just have acted on your answer as it appears quite categoric. Are you sure your answer is correct? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
guest1957 Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 No one knows what the definition of occupier is for the purposes of the Act because no one has been to court to test the law; as a result there is no categoric answer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
s.wray Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 it is legal providing he is with a sgc holder at all times he can even be in a different hide as long as he is in sight and hearshot of you and has permission,,i,m in the same boat with my shooting buddy as i wait for my sgc to come through,,i have checked this to be safe myself,,but you must have the permission off the landowner and i quote he must be accompanied by a sgc holder at all times,,good luck with ya shooting this is true as i used to shoot this way when i went with my dad before haveing a licence Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wymberley Posted February 17, 2012 Report Share Posted February 17, 2012 (edited) No one knows what the definition of occupier is for the purposes of the Act because no one has been to court to test the law; as a result there is no categoric answer Yep. The answer to which I referred appeared to be giving a reply more associated with a firearm than shotgun; it being "easier" to borrow a firearm than a shotgun. Although as yet the specifics of the term "occupier" are untried, you can bet your boots they would be a tad more stringent than relating to Joe Bloggs who has permission to shoot pigeon. Edit: Typo Edited February 17, 2012 by wymberley Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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