Modified LED lamping torches.

[Dave-G]

Hi Dave - just read through all this thread - some terrific work been done here! will definitely be trying some of the mods you have suggested.

If you still are machining copper, then you may be interested to know that the old timers used to use milk as the cutting fluid, to aid machining. Honestly! I'd use the full fat variety, since that's all that was available before 1960.

I've never tried this myself, since I've not used much copper in the lathe, but to be honest I wouldn't have thought the slightly better heat transmission would be worth the extra hassle?

Cheers, yep, knocked the copper ones on the head and made a few ali ones that work just as well for a while.

Still not really viable so now just use the standard brass pills and machine the correct length focal spacers so I can adjust the focal length to suit various LED focal lengths.

I know the thread drags on a bit but it's a good learning curve for some of us. For those who didn't read it all here is how Mr. Ahorton shows us how to focus them to best effect - and making sure the LED base is glued to the brass:

 

[Dazza9t9]

Dave, I have ordered 2 x wf-501b (one of which the red from Hong Kong)

 

I have then ordered

 

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/glass-optics-for-flashlights-28mm-5297?item=2

And

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/26-5mm-aluminum-reflector-drop-in-module-set-without-emitter-5955?item=10

 

However I have just noticed on the video, a black spacer ring. Do I need one of those?

I had to watch the video without sound

[Dave-G]

no

 

Dave, I have ordered 2 x wf-501b (one of which the red from Hong Kong)

I have then ordered

http://www.dealextreme.com/p/glass-optics-for-flashlights-28mm-5297?item=2
And
http://www.dealextreme.com/p/26-5mm-aluminum-reflector-drop-in-module-set-without-emitter-5955?item=10

However I have just noticed on the video, a black spacer ring. Do I need one of those?
I had to watch the video without sound

No, just sand and paint either your existing reflector or the new one and swap the flat lens for the aspheric one (that you might need to sand down a touch). You won't be able to focus that option very much though because the base of the reflector will inhibit focal travel.

 

The thicker lensed Ahorton system uses a spacer to locate the lens closer to the LED so it gathers a wider section of the emitted light cone, and it has more focal adjustment.

[Dazza9t9]

Brilliant thank you and thanks for all the advice

[Dave-G]

I can't edit posts more than a day or so old so will put this up in red.

 

Unprotected cells can be dangerous when recharged if they were over discharged.

 

In light of recent advice regarding laptop batteries and a lack of a protection circuit at their base: It seems that whilst they may be advantageous for those who know how to use them, problems can arise when recharging over discharged cells.

 

For that reason I have decided that it is better to be safe than sorry and will not leave them in my torch conversions unless anyone advises me they are aware of the over discharge issues and asks me to leave one in theirs.

[activeviii]

Be careful if posting them Dave. Royal mail and a few others will not take batteries any more. I have stopped issuing batteries unless they collect the torch.

[Dave-G]

Be careful if posting them Dave. Royal mail and a few others will not take batteries any more. I have stopped issuing batteries unless they collect the torch.

Yes, I've heard that recently too. I can''t believe how hard they try to push business towards their competitors.

[welshwarrior]

Ok got my lens and reflector yesterday fitted last night ready for an evening out.

 

I've a different torch in a Ultra Fire WF-501C that has 3 CR123 batteries and runs at higher voltage. Dave thanks for your patience as I found a red pill.

 

Well the torch was easy to set up and focus. The beam or square of light is larger than I expected that makes scanning easier. The set up worked well to my self imposed limit of 150m I had the 22lr so only shot to 90 yards last night but I think this could be extend considerably.

[Dave-G]

Cheers Daf, The size of the square is partly dictated by the size of the LED. Most ebay red LED's are significantly larger than the XP-E red - which would produce a tighter beam, but as you point out too tight is not too good for scanning.

 

I took a look on the royal mail prohibited list and here is the battery bit:

 

Batteries

Batteries that are classed as dangerous goodsClassified in the latest edition of the International Civil Aviation Organisation’s Technical Instructions. by the latest edition of the International Civil Aviation Organization’s (ICAO) Technical Instructions are prohibited. This includes wet spillable lead acid/lead alkaline batteries (such as car batteries), used alkaline metal, nickel metal hydride (NiMH), nickel cadmium (NiCd), zinc-air batteries, and damaged batteries of any type.

 

Lithium ion/polymer/metal/alloy batteries when not sent with, or contained in/connected to an electronic device, are prohibited.

 

Lithium ion/polymer/metal/alloy batteries are allowed when sent with or contained in/connected to an electronic device, but are subject to packaging, volume and quantity restrictions.

 

Please see Restricted Goods page.

 

For more information on lithium batteries please see the IATA Lithium Battery Guidance Document.

Sealed lead acid batteries are allowed in the UK, but are also subject to packaging, volume, quantity and labelling restrictions. Please see Restricted Goods page.

Alkaline metal, nickel metal hydride (NiMH) and nickel cadmium (NiCd) batteries may only be sent when new and in their original packaging. Please see Restricted Goods page.

 

That'll do for me, but I will require anyone taking one put in writing that they understand the issues.

Edited October 30, 2013 by Dave-G

[Deiseboy]

Torch finally came today after ordering it on the 2nd... the batteries, scope mount and lens came last week. WIll hopefully try it out tonight if the rain stops.

 

Does the new lens work if you don't spray the housing black?

[Deiseboy]

Why cant it be dark out!!

 

 

 

[evo]

Torch finally came today after ordering it on the 2nd... the batteries, scope mount and lens came last week. WIll hopefully try it out tonight if the rain stops.

 

Does the new lens work if you don't spray the housing black?

it will work but will Not be as good as there will be too much spillage, all you want is the light from the led hitting the aspheric lens NOT the reflected light off the reflector aswell

 

hope this helps Evo

[Deiseboy]

it will work but will Not be as good as there will be too much spillage, all you want is the light from the led hitting the aspheric lens NOT the reflected light off the reflector aswell

 

hope this helps Evo

Sprayed it black before testing it anyway. weathers bad so was shining it into the field out the back. Dont think you'd get 100 yards out of it or even much past 50 by the looks of things?

 

It seems to be a very dark colour red if that makes sense.

[Dave-G]

Unfortunately ebay ones are very hit and miss, the spec a vendor had when he sold out one batch and bought in another has quite often changed.

 

Also some people see red a lot clearer than others, I have taken two guys out lamping who could not even see forty yard eye-shine from lamps that I can see 200+ yard eye-shine from.

[Deiseboy]

Unfortunately ebay ones are very hit and miss, the spec a vendor had when he sold out one batch and bought in another has quite often changed.

 

Also some people see red a lot clearer than others, I have taken two guys out lamping who could not even see forty yard eye-shine from lamps that I can see 200+ yard eye-shine from.

I went out last night when it had gotten a bit clearer out and seemed to be darker and i could see a lot better with it. will have to properly field test it tonight.

[colin lad]

Anyone got an old laptop battery pack? Next time you have some spare time put it too good use and pull it apart. They are perfect for many of the small pocket rocket torches such as the Ultrafire 501b.

 

They contain premium 18650 cells that are much better than the budget ones you find on the likes of ebay etc and all have good capacities up to 4.4 amp hour. They have to be decent because the lappy makers won't be wanting to replace them under three year warranties. Most will likely be in perfect condition with perhaps just an odd one being faulty which reduces the capacity of the whole pack. I found one dead one out of one of five packs I have dismantled so far. Most of them have nests of two three or four cells and I found that each cell in a nest has almost exactly the same voltage in them, suggesting the reason for the problem was maybe temperature sensors or some sort of balancing issue.

 

I will be using these to test my torch conversions prior to despatch and will be leaving the battery in them unless the buyer asks me not to.

 

hi Dave just a quick heads up i got some of these ex laptop batteries of mungolee put them in my car to go home layed them side by side in the center consol of my car but one of them fell with positive end facing the others and it sparked and pop and started to smoke and in only a couple of seconds was smoking and almost too hot to touch,

so for me i shall stick with the normal batteries

 

be careful if you have them in your home a few seconds longer and it would of been in flames

 

colin

[telf]

just a quick update on modified torches and the yukon photon

 

i have a 501b torch with a 850nm ir in it with ahorton spacer kit and lens, but the image through the photon seemed to be bright and whiting out so after contacting dave G i bought a 700 mah pill off him {very helpfull and knowlegable chap}

 

put it in the 501 and bingo, the image is alot better,no whiting out not as bright but still as clear with no loss of distance

 

if you have a photon i would recommend this modification,it would seem to me that the 850nm is a bit to pwerfull for the photon and would possibly be better suited to rear add on nv rigs,but the 700mah is spot on for the photon

 

many thanks for your help dave

Edited November 3, 2013 by telf

[Dave-G]

just a quick update on modified torches and the yukon photon

 

i have a 501b torch with AN OSLON BLACK 850nm IR in it with ahorton spacer kit and lens, but the image through the photon seemed to be bright and whiting out so after contacting Dave-G i bought a LOWER POWER 700 mah 850NM pill off him {very helpfull and knowlegable chap}

 

put it in the 501 and bingo, the image is alot better,no whiting out not as bright but still as clear with no loss of distance

 

if you have a photon i would recommend this modification,it would seem to me that the OSLON BLACK is a bit to powerful for the photon and would possibly be better suited to rear add on nv rigs,but the 700mah is spot on for the photon

 

many thanks for your help dave

Cheers that bloke from Telford.

 

I know your not too good on the technicalities of LED's speak so I have taken the liberty of correcting a couple of bits in my quote of your post because they are both 850nm wavelength. I have put the corrections in upper case to help clarify them.

 

Basically the Photon is very responsive to low light levels because the camera in it is allowed to work as it was designed to - rather than struggle for an image through the small exit pupil of a day scope which has several lenses in it, each having daylight wavelength AR coatings instead of Ir coatings. It can often be used with no artificial illumination until you want to see the quarry detail. For that reason the Photon user only needs a low power Ir for use within it's practical shooting range of sub 200 yards. Some High power IR Illuminators made for rear add on NVD's are too much for the photon and wash out the image as well as having a shorter run time because they use more power.

 

I make three different specification IR module upgrades for 501b torches - and two visible red upgrades - and still advise on DIY options

 

Edited November 3, 2013 by Dave-G

[telf]

thanks dave,i was close though

[Muddy Funker]

Update,

 

The 1W IR drop in and lens/spacer combo from DX arrived today.

 

A couple of questions.

 

I've sanded down the edge of the lens and it seems to drop in as far as it will go, the collar is tightened up as much as I dare. When I try and screw this assembly back onto the torch body it will only go so far and then stop, this is before the o ring on the torch body is covered, is this normal or is there a way around this?

 

And secondly, probably a daft question but how much of the 850nm light does the human eye see? I wanted to check the drop in works but I haven't started on the camera yet so just shined it in my face and it's just a very faint red glow, is this also what you'd generally see from an IR thrower?

 

Thanks in advance for any help

[evo]

so just shined it in my face

 

DO NOT shine an infrared light into your face or eyes as the beam is very strong and although it looks like a little red glow it is a powerful beam and can cause serious damage to your eyes

Edited November 6, 2013 by evo

[evo]

Update,

 

The 1W IR drop in and lens/spacer combo from DX arrived today.

 

A couple of questions.

 

I've sanded down the edge of the lens and it seems to drop in as far as it will go, the collar is tightened up as much as I dare. When I try and screw this assembly back onto the torch body it will only go so far and then stop, this is before the o ring on the torch body is covered, is this normal or is there a way around this?

 

And secondly, probably a daft question but how much of the 850nm light does the human eye see? I wanted to check the drop in works but I haven't started on the camera yet so just shined it in my face and it's just a very faint red glow, is this also what you'd generally see from an IR thrower?

 

Thanks in advance for any help

as long as the pill is tight to the torch body to dissipate the heat then it is fine but it should screw on over the o ring as you say,

 

yes you should only see a very light red glow but read above post as it is bad for the eyes to look directly into an infrared torch

 

cheers Evo

[Dave-G]

Update,

 

The 1W IR drop in and lens/spacer combo from DX arrived today.

 

A couple of questions.

 

I've sanded down the edge of the lens and it seems to drop in as far as it will go, the collar is tightened up as much as I dare. When I try and screw this assembly back onto the torch body it will only go so far and then stop, this is before the o ring on the torch body is covered, is this normal or is there a way around this?

 

And secondly, probably a daft question but how much of the 850nm light does the human eye see? I wanted to check the drop in works but I haven't started on the camera yet so just shined it in my face and it's just a very faint red glow, is this also what you'd generally see from an IR thrower?

 

Thanks in advance for any help

 

That's a new one on me TBH, could you have put the lens retainer back in backwards? The reflector should locate inside it.

The light is bright - but your eye is not receptive to much of it.

[Muddy Funker]

Oops lol,

 

I didn't stare into the beam for any great length of time literally just a flash,

 

I had a play with different combos of pills, springs and reflectors and it all seems good now.

 

I take it painting the reflector/spacer matt black will clear up all the horrible spill I'm seeing around the beam?

 

Thanks guys, another step closer to night vision :-)

Edited November 6, 2013 by Muddy Funker

[Dave-G]

Oops lol,

 

I didn't stare into the beam for any great length of time literally just a flash,

 

I had a play with different combos of pills, springs and reflectors and it all seems good now.

 

I take it painting the reflector/spacer matt black will clear up all the horrible spill I'm seeing around the beam?

 

Thanks guys, another step closer to night vision :-)

 

Another step closer to scopeless/dedicated night vision devices such as the Photon/N550 etc that only need a little IR because the low light camera is working within it's design parameters. Minimal light signature is of course beneficial to night hunting - so dedicated rigs are more covert, especially to light shy quarry.

 

 

A rear add-on type of NVD needs more light so is less covert than scopeless rigs, and bigger or brighter IR illuminators are need to bang more light out to compensate for the dayscope losses. The 1 watt ebay jobbie will not provide sufficient light for a cheap low light camera mounted behind a rifle scope eyepiece at rim-fire ranges for example - if that's what you are hoping to acheive?

 

That is because so much light has been throttled back by each lens in a riflescope having daylight wavelength anti reflective coatings - before it gets optically compressed to squeeze through its tiny scope exit pupil, a typically 7mm diameter 'hole' - or smaller as you increase the scope mag.

 

As a ballpark figure that i'm experienced with - a Watec 902H camera will acheive low air rifle ranges with that module in your DX aspheric torch. You'd get 100 yards usable range with an Oslon black 850nm drop-in module in it using an Ahorton lens set up.

 

Yes, scuff up and paint the standard reflector which then becomes a focal length spacer to approximatley suit the thin DX lens, to minimise or totally remove the spill.

Edited November 6, 2013 by Dave-G