Fisheruk Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Oi, referee...... disrespecting the beliefs of others! straight red card! Amen brother Amen Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Tell you what - and I'm not grinding an axe here - but the term 'homophobic' ain't half bandied about these days by seemingly everyone. It reminds me of the time when people had only to mention 'race' to be shouted down as a 'racialist' (as it was often then called). I think a lot of people who are expressing opinions about gay marriage don't necessarily deserve to be shouted down in some kind of witch hunt. Neither do I think they are all afraid of gay people, as the term would suggest. I do think that a few who protest - a little too much - are perhaps in secret fear of the revulsion they feel about their own darkest desires. Just saying. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 I wouldn't expect people who don't like it to be involved. To be honest if there really is an exclusion that allows the church to carry on with it's beliefs without the next step being them having to go along with it too I'm a lot less bothered. Shooting is an issue because animals are killed. If farms could no longer kill animals the whole planet would come to a standstill. You can hardly say the same for gay marriage! There is clay shooting,and people do not like it because you are shooting,by your argument you should stop shooting if it upsets others. I think i have made my point that your argument is flawed,we could have started with the "all people are equal,but some people are more equal than others" because that is what you insinuated. As to the church having the right to opt out,how many vicars and priests do you think are gay? it will happen soon enough that a gay couple get married in a church,and i hope that they have a great day,and live a long and happy life,because it will not have affected me in any way,or hurt me. Who knows your gay friend might get married,and then invite you to be his best man,that could be an interesting conversation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Harry Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 (edited) No you don't. One of my very oldest friends is gay and I don't see him any differently to you. But I don't think he should be allowed to marry because that disrespects the wishes of others. Should I go to the local mosque in my shorts and a string vest? No, it's disrespectful. It's just the same, apart from for some reason the homo's think they're something special! Like most minority groups I should add. njc110381, some of the comments on here are very homophobic. Ignoring the marriage thing some people obviously have an issue with gay people. I also have some very good friends who are gay. Some have had civil partnerships, one is going through fertility treatment and one couple have just got pregnant and I'm over the moon for them. Knowing them as I do I just don't see why they should be descriminated against if that's what they want. One of my neighbours is gay and my Mrs has been best friends with him for the last 35 years. We went to some other friends wedding last year and my Mrs was a bridesmaid. That meant I spent the day with Mark while my Mrs was performing bridesmaid duties. Some of the people thought we were a couple. Raised a few eyebrows when I was seen kissing the bridesmaid! FYI if you turned up at a mosque in shorts and t shirt they probably wouldn't mind as long as you were respectful and took your shoes off. It's the women who have to be coverd up. Every time I've been to one they are very welcoming. Harry Edited February 6, 2013 by Dirty Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 henry..not being of the religious following..who wrote the second greatest commandment ? i bet it was a man... No it was spoken, thats why people shouldn`t speak out on what they don`t understand, sorry if it sounds pompous but you said that the "religious" people did it, which was incorrect and then you could not understand the reasoning why. and on the 2nd point..i did not make a generalisation..i just pointed out that two men loved each other (in the same way as my wife and i do ) and i have no right to say they could not get married .. Go back and re-read it, you said that you had seen a male female marriage split in less time than the gay couple, which is a huge GENERALISATION. Yes...no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Some of the people thought we were a couple. Raised a few eyebrows when I was seen kissing the bridesmaid! Hang on, everyone kisses bridesmaids at weddings. Everyone kisses everyone! You must mean you snogged the bridesmaid, and you have a Mrs too. Shame on you. PS And you obviously look gay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenwolf Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 What about vicars and priests that don't want to preside over gay ceremonies? I find it more worrying that a vocal minority (gay rights advocates) feel the need to get the Church of England to change their stance on something they feel strongly about. If gay people are so religious and want to get married in church what is to stop them in making their own gay Christian sect and their own church and marry there. It's a bit like a white person trying to join the Black Police Officers association and then suing them when they fail to change their laws to suit him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 ... it will happen soon enough that a gay couple get married in a church,and i hope that they have a great day,and live a long and happy life,because it will not have affected me in any way,or hurt me. Not the best ethical argument, how many abhorrent things that don`t hurt you are abhorrent and hurtful to others? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzthompson Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Vicars and priests Dont have to marry people. Its up to them, as it should be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 If gay people are so religious and want to get married in church what is to stop them in making their own gay Christian sect and their own church and marry there. Then they have to be celibate or they are at risk of being heretical. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dirty Harry Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 (edited) Steppenwolf white police officers can join the black police association as associate members not full members. Harry Edited February 6, 2013 by Dirty Harry Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 its all about gay rights forcing their way of life on those who have religious beliefs and it won't stop there, we've already seen you can't refuse to have it going on under your roof if you run a B&B from your house this is the next step till all rights of people who don't believe in it are eroded. Much like most things in this country our religious rights count for nothing. How is someone who is gay enforcing their way of life on your religious beliefs? Surely, if the law dictates what they may do based on your religious beliefs then your religious beliefs are forcing their way into those peoples lives? Why is one acceptable yet the other isn't? I don't believe in religion but the fact that I don't os hardly 'eroding' your belif in it, surely? If you choose to run a business then you are bound by the same law as everyone else, including discrimination law. If you don't want to be then don't run a business. If you are of the opinion that a business owner can say 'no gays' then surely you are of the opinion that they can say 'no blacks' or, 'no religionists'? J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenwolf Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Hold on there is no saying that you can't make your own Christian sect. Look at the middle ages, there were some interesting "Christian sects", Fra Dolcino's Army who were basically Christian mercenaries and thugs who embraced orgies and all sorts, Waldensians, who were basically Satanist worshippers masquerading as Christians, there have been numerous questionable Christian sects lately such as Children of God who were into chidl molestation, so who is to stop someone making their own sect up? Me, I abhorr all religion personally, it's nothing more than supporting some political party. Steppenwolf white police officers can join the black police association as associate members not full members. Harry Supposed that person then went on to say that white people should have special priviledge in that association, wouldn't that be inflamatory and wanting to bend over an organisation just for your needs? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenwolf Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 If you choose to run a business then you are bound by the same law as everyone else, including discrimination law. If you don't want to be then don't run a business. If you are of the opinion that a business owner can say 'no gays' then surely you are of the opinion that they can say 'no blacks' or, 'no religionists'? Why not it's thier own bloody property! If I ran a bar and got rowdy customers I would tell them to clear off not try to welcome them for fear to be sued as "discriminatory". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Alice Arnold, Claire Balding's CIVIL partner announced that they will now get married, as it is their CIVIL RIGHT. She wrote an article about it in the Telegraph today. I still fail to see her point, really. A civil partnership is in everything but name, a marriage. The only difference is a name change. People in civil partnerships already refer to themseves as 'married'. Straight people often refer to people in civil partnerships as 'married'. I fail to see the pressing need to use Parliamentary time and lots of money to change a name. J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steppenwolf Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 She wrote an article about it in the Telegraph today. I still fail to see her point, really. A civil partnership is in everything but name, a marriage. The only difference is a name change. People in civil partnerships already refer to themseves as 'married'. Straight people often refer to people in civil partnerships as 'married'. I fail to see the pressing need to use Parliamentary time and lots of money to change a name. J. Exactly, waste of time if you ask me, rather they spend some times trying to cut the red tape in business to actually stimulate the economy, reduce our deficit, but no we have to ponce around with gay marriage. These MPs are so out of touch when peopel are losing jobs and houses. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 I heard a wonderful guy speak on the local radio yesterday on this very subject.... i wish i could remember word for word what he said...basically he said people are so wrapped up in their christian and religious beliefs they have forgotten their belief in humanity .... Bizzare considering that only a tiny minority of people ever set foot in a church these days. The UK is not a christian country and has not been in many, many years. J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 I don't see why you'd call me that? Lets go back to the whole mosque thing - should I be allowed to walk in there in my shorts and t-shirt just because I feel that I should be allowed to? I wouldn't consider having to cover up a breach of my rights, I'd consider it me breaching theirs by not doing so. It's the same thing! As a person he's no different to anyone else but what he does could cause upset to some. For that reason the person who is upset also needs to be considered. That's not really a logical argument though. How can someone be 'upset' get upset because someone they've never met wants to do something which has absolutely zero effect on them? It's irrational. J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JonathanL Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 Why not it's thier own bloody property! If I ran a bar and got rowdy customers I would tell them to clear off not try to welcome them for fear to be sued as "discriminatory". There is no law preventing you barring people who are causing trouble. What about addressing the question I put? The law says that if you run a business then you must abide by discrimination legislation. If you should be allowed to say 'no gays' then surealy you should be allowed to say 'no blacks'? I fail to see the difference. J. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gimlet Posted February 6, 2013 Report Share Posted February 6, 2013 going at it from a slightly different angle ooeerr mrs (or mr), it would be very interesting if darwin could give an opinion on the whole matter ?, i wonder if he would see gay marriage as a natural thing to do and just part of evolution ?. several years ago i watched some documentary type programme on tv , they filled a huge tank with rats and let them breed , when the tank became overpopulated the female rats started killing the young rats and the male rats turned gay ,the conclusion was that it was natures way of controling the rat population so as not to overstretch food and living space . could it be that the apparent explosion in the gay population is natures way of saying that the world is full and humans need to stop breeding ? , is gay marriage just a natural part of the human being that wants to have a life long partner but nature is stopping the breeding process and overpopulation of the planet. before you jump on me , im not comparing homosexuals with rats , im just looking at things from another (and i feel more natural and likely) angle Oh if only that were true. Nature has not reckoned with the black arts that can be performed with a lesbian and a catheter. More surplus humanity to swarm across the planet, and humanity with an added sense of entitlement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted February 7, 2013 Report Share Posted February 7, 2013 Oh if only that were true. Nature has not reckoned with the black arts that can be performed with a lesbian and a catheter. More surplus humanity to swarm across the planet, and humanity with an added sense of entitlement. i totally agree with you on that score , but , im still looking at it from a evolutionary angle , is the fact that humans are intelligent enough to outwit nature , actually just a part of nature and evolution ? , maybe im just a dinosaur because my late wife and i had children the old fashioned way ? , or , are humans evolving as a species and males and females will no longer need each other to breed ? , could it be that over the next million years or so that males and females will split into separate species ?. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildtrax Posted February 7, 2013 Report Share Posted February 7, 2013 so many on here have talked about not defiling a church wedding and the being married in the eyes of god, i consider myself lucky to be an atheist so i beleave in evolution and not in my oppinion a 2000 year old fairy tale, but if so many feel men women church marriage is as intended by god why such high divorce rates and where does god stand on this when said persons have stood in a church and declared until death us do part.? im straight got married in a registry office and like many others 20 years later ended up divorced, cost me a fortune left me with sod all, if gay couples want to be able to do the same and offend god the same way straight couples have been doing for hundreds of years let em, it makes no difference to me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted February 7, 2013 Report Share Posted February 7, 2013 Evolution is a funny concept with regard to homosexuality, you could propose that if it was in the genes then Darwin would reckon it wouldn't get very far Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wildtrax Posted February 7, 2013 Report Share Posted February 7, 2013 evolution is indeed a funny old thing a bit like god working in mysterious ways, evolution creates and can destroy cancer is in our genes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gimlet Posted February 7, 2013 Report Share Posted February 7, 2013 i totally agree with you on that score , but , im still looking at it from a evolutionary angle , is the fact that humans are intelligent enough to outwit nature , actually just a part of nature and evolution ? , maybe im just a dinosaur because my late wife and i had children the old fashioned way ? , or , are humans evolving as a species and males and females will no longer need each other to breed ? , could it be that over the next million years or so that males and females will split into separate species ?. I doubt if we'll outwit nature. We may evade it for a while but it will catch up with us, and the longer we delay the reckoning the heavier the price will be. If we really were defying evolution we would be using our ingenuity to reduce our own numbers; instead we strain every resource to increase the population as quickly and as extensively as possible. Nature's 'gay' card hasn't worked. It will need to come up with something better. I hope it succeeds. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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