the bulgarians and romanians

[Beardo]

i don't disagree - but i speak from personal experience.

 

we do need radical reforms on many things from benefits to immigration, but unfortunately no government in power will be willing to tackle those issues.

[ME]

 

 

It amazes me how some think every foreign worker in this country are the hardest working people on the planet and evey British person is a lazy ****

 

 

 

I didn't say "every" about either foreigners or British.

 

I don't necessarily think my cleaner works hard, she just does what is expected. Which is a refreshing change nowadays.

 

There are far too many people trying to find an angle or a dodge to do less or no work. If they concentrated their efforts into actually working the country would be out of recession by now.

[Vince Green]

Well I will say it is a pretty close thing. The foreigners that are over here to work (and not all are, some are here for the benefits) do work hard generally. Trying to find a good British worker is very much more difficult.

[probuck]

 

They are comming dont believe the **** you hear in the media ,same thing was said about the polish,now look at the state of this country,car was on every corner.GREAT BRITAIN not anymore. UKIP got my vote.but i fear it is to late.

Sounds like your a racist mate.. My mississ is czech and shes the hardest working woman youl ever meet. Maybe this is what the Uk is short of. Thing is with UK resident is you moan to much..thats why your bosses would rather get people im from other countrys to do your jobs.

[ME]

Sounds like your a racist mate.. My mississ is czech and shes the hardest working woman youl ever meet. Maybe this is what the Uk is short of. Thing is with UK resident is you moan to much..thats why your bosses would rather get people im from other countrys to do your jobs.

 

 

[955i]

Sounds like your a racist mate.. My mississ is czech and shes the hardest working woman youl ever meet. Maybe this is what the Uk is short of. Thing is with UK resident is you moan to much..thats why your bosses would rather get people im from other countrys to do your jobs.

But the grammar suggests that he is highly educated and struggling to find work because of this surely?

 

Amazing how many people on here are afraid of Europeans taking their jobs but can post here during work hours and go shooting any day they fancy (disregarding retired members)

[Psyxologos]

But the grammar suggests that he is highly educated and struggling to find work because of this surely?

 

Amazing how many people on here are afraid of Europeans taking their jobs but can post here during work hours and go shooting any day they fancy (disregarding retired members)

 

Well said sir. Very well said!

[Mungler]

I have always said you can train, manage and coach for almost every eventually and after a while experience will take over and hone the person..... BUT you can't fix or cure laziness and in some people it is congenital. I'm afraid we're back to the welfare state being too much more than the safety net it was intended.

 

By definition any immigrant has at least got off their backsides, left their friends and family and in pursuit of a better life. Something the 3 generations of long term unemployed in this country might want to consider

[AVB]

The guy in question told me he got just over twelve grand to help him set up,when i asked him how come he said he new loads of polish lads getting it,thats one of the reasons they come here to take advantage of the start up grants,he said if i went to poland to work i could get the same.

 

I am intrigued by this supposed fact that if you are Polish you can come here and get a start up grant (and/or a new car) and yet you can't get the same grant if you are British. Now I am not saying it's not true but I have been unable to find anything related to to this on t'internet. Is it fact or urban myth? Any ideas?

 

An the point regarding a 'migrant worker' not having to pay tax in the UK. How does that work? If they are employed in the UK and paid in the UK then they would pay UK tax automatically (unles it was cash in hand of course). I've been unable to find any facts around this either.

[Hamster]

All I know is that in my line of work newish immigrants are always coming in trying to see if they can buy a car on finance which of course they can't because no one will lend to people without established work/home/credit history/voters register etc etc. This is why even those with relatively good incomes are so often seen driving old bangers.

[Gimlet]

I have always said you can train, manage and coach for almost every eventually and after a while experience will take over and hone the person..... BUT you can't fix or cure laziness and in some people it is congenital. I'm afraid we're back to the welfare state being too much more than the safety net it was intended.

 

By definition any immigrant has at least got off their backsides, left their friends and family and in pursuit of a better life. Something the 3 generations of long term unemployed in this country might want to consider

 

It is disingenuous to continually compare industrious immigrants with idle British dole scum. It is not nearly as simple as that. Migrants are not competing against flacid lager swilling oafs in tracksuits. Take my industry, construction. No British tradesman can get inducted onto a commercial construction site without a CSCS card to prove their competence and validate the contractor's insurance. In my trade, bridklaying, you need at least NVQ level 2 to get that card. (Unless the rules have changed since I took mine). Most, myself included hold NVQ level 3. How do some EU (and it seems to be only EU) migrants manage to get hired when it is blindingly obvious from their work - their speed, work-quality, setting out ability and general knowledge of the trade - that they are not qualified? Are they taking on-site assessment tests to a much lower standard in their home countries? Are they simply getting rubber-stamped through the system when they get here? Are contractors illegally flouting the conditions of their employer's liability cover, which seems unlikely given that claims have been made which involve immigrant workers. Or are financial inducements or poltical pressure being applied to create one rule for us and another for EU migrants and thereby help to force on society the concept of borderless nations?

And if, to stretch credibility and common intelligence to breaking point, there really is a level playing field, and British trades are simply bone idle and greedy, and presumably racist as well (since, after all anyone who doesn't believe an unchecked tidal wave of mass immigration is just a fantastically vibrant and marvellous thing is a goose-stepping racist), are they supposed to give up their families for adoption, return their homes to the mortgage company and sleep on a floor so they can compete in the exciting world of subsistence labouring?

[neillfrbs]

well said ,working for the same wages now as i was 12 years ago,and am not a racist a realest,wake up people ,country is going down the plug hole.

It is disingenuous to continually compare industrious immigrants with idle British dole scum. It is not nearly as simple as that. Migrants are not competing against flacid lager swilling oafs in tracksuits. Take my industry, construction. No British tradesman can get inducted onto a commercial construction site without a CSCS card to prove their competence and validate the contractor's insurance. In my trade, bridklaying, you need at least NVQ level 2 to get that card. (Unless the rules have changed since I took mine). Most, myself included hold NVQ level 3. How do some EU (and it seems to be only EU) migrants manage to get hired when it is blindingly obvious from their work - their speed, work-quality, setting out ability and general knowledge of the trade - that they are not qualified? Are they taking on-site assessment tests to a much lower standard in their home countries? Are they simply getting rubber-stamped through the system when they get here? Are contractors illegally flouting the conditions of their employer's liability cover, which seems unlikely given that claims have been made which involve immigrant workers. Or are financial inducements or poltical pressure being applied to create one rule for us and another for EU migrants and thereby help to force on society the concept of borderless nations?

And if, to stretch credibility and common intelligence to breaking point, there really is a level playing field, and British trades are simply bone idle and greedy, and presumably racist as well (since, after all anyone who doesn't believe an unchecked tidal wave of mass immigration is just a fantastically vibrant and marvellous thing is a goose-stepping racist), are they supposed to give up their families for adoption, return their homes to the mortgage company and sleep on a floor so they can compete in the exciting world of subsistence labouring?

[Twistedsanity]

I dont think its that people are afraid of immigrants taking jobs, its that immigrants will work all the hours for a pittance of money and employers cash in on the fact , is it unreasonable to think that if we weren't flooded with immigrants employers would actually have to pay a fair wage for a days work to be done ? I left school in 1985 and see jobs today advertised for the same salary as I got nearly 30 years ago when I was a 16 year old purely because the employers know full well there is always a desperate immigrant they can take advantage of

[aris]

I dont think its that people are afraid of immigrants taking jobs, its that immigrants will work all the hours for a pittance of money and employers cash in on the fact , is it unreasonable to think that if we weren't flooded with immigrants employers would actually have to pay a fair wage for a days work to be done ? I left school in 1985 and see jobs today advertised for the same salary as I got nearly 30 years ago when I was a 16 year old purely because the employers know full well there is always a desperate immigrant they can take advantage of

 

The laws of supply and demand. Even though Labour introduced a minimum wage, they also opened the floodgates to immigration. It was their way of keeping inflation low.

[al4x]

I dont think its that people are afraid of immigrants taking jobs, its that immigrants will work all the hours for a pittance of money and employers cash in on the fact , is it unreasonable to think that if we weren't flooded with immigrants employers would actually have to pay a fair wage for a days work to be done ? I left school in 1985 and see jobs today advertised for the same salary as I got nearly 30 years ago when I was a 16 year old purely because the employers know full well there is always a desperate immigrant they can take advantage of

 

how much should an employer pay someone to clean the toilets? its minimum wage at the moment as a lot of unskilled jobs are but what would it need to go up to to attract someone on benefits?

[la bala]

But the grammar suggests that he is highly educated and struggling to find work because of this surely?

 

Amazing how many people on here are afraid of Europeans taking their jobs but can post here during work hours and go shooting any day they fancy (disregarding retired members)

[Twistedsanity]

how much should an employer pay someone to clean the toilets? its minimum wage at the moment as a lot of unskilled jobs are but what would it need to go up to to attract someone on benefits?

im not sure on monetary values but if there weren't so many immigrants keen as mustard to do the work for peanuts employers would have to pay whatever employees viewed as a worthwhile amount or do it themselves ? What amount of renumeration would you want to recieve for crawling about cleaning up strangers bodily fluids ? how much money an hour would you expect for doing it?

Does it make sense that people who sit on their butts in air conditioned offices all day long should recieve more money than toilet cleaners knee deep in other peoples carp simply because they went to college and recieved a No Value Qualification?

[overandunder2012]

how much should an employer pay someone to clean the toilets? its minimum wage at the moment as a lot of unskilled jobs are but what would it need to go up to to attract someone on benefits?

probably about 20k give or take a few quid after all he's going to have to give up jeremy kyle and the soaps

Edited April 26, 2013 by overandunder2012

[al4x]

im not sure on monetary values but if there weren't so many immigrants keen as mustard to do the work for peanuts employers would have to pay whatever employees viewed as a worthwhile amount or do it themselves ? What amount of renumeration would you want to recieve for crawling about cleaning up strangers bodily fluids ? how much money an hour would you expect for doing it?

Does it make sense that people who sit on their butts in air conditioned offices all day long should recieve more money than toilet cleaners knee deep in other peoples carp simply because they went to college and recieved a No Value Qualification?

 

well actually yes if they are generating more income for their employer. There will always be the low paid unskilled jobs that anyone can do but very few want to, and the issue is there is nothing to make people want to do them. However if you are an immigrant and you aren't finding it as easy as most would have you believe to get a house and benefits then you have to do what work there is. The issue is once the cleaners, and street sweepers and any manner of others are getting 25K a year then you might get some interest from the dole bludgers here but not much as they can take home more than that tax free off the state. Something is wrong and its going to have to give, where the issue lies is Labour call it picking on the poor

[gemini52]

Well I will say it is a pretty close thing. The foreigners that are over here to work (and not all are, some are here for the benefits) do work hard generally. Trying to find a good British worker is very much more difficult.

Trying to find good british workers to work for the low pay that foreigners wiil work for you mean,i know many good hard working trades men who are taking jobs to just cover the bills,its a situation that cant continue.

[al4x]

the bills usually involve managing to be in the pub at 4 till closing though

[gemini52]

the bills usually involve managing to be in the pub at 4 till closing though

You must move in different circles to me,i am a self employed time serverd decorator with some forty years under my belt i find people expect you to work for peanuts just because of the recession,they still expect a top class job for half the money,this is not progress its stepping back in time.

[Little_Dom]

You must move in different circles to me,i am a self employed time serverd decorator with some forty years under my belt i find people expect you to work for peanuts just because of the recession,they still expect a top class job for half the money,this is not progress its stepping back in time.

 

 

I agree with you there mate, im a self employed farm worker and i've gone to jobs and after saying what i charge ( bearing in mind i have to pay tax and national insurance out of it) i've either been told that im not required or could you do it for less ( one guy i went to told me he could go no higher than 4 quid an hour for work on a potato grader)

[gemini52]

I am intrigued by this supposed fact that if you are Polish you can come here and get a start up grant (and/or a new car) and yet you can't get the same grant if you are British. Now I am not saying it's not true but I have been unable to find anything related to to this on t'internet. Is it fact or urban myth? Any ideas?

 

An the point regarding a 'migrant worker' not having to pay tax in the UK. How does that work? If they are employed in the UK and paid in the UK then they would pay UK tax automatically (unles it was cash in hand of course). I've been unable to find any facts around this either.

I worked with the guy about six years ago,he told me he had been living here over a year,his girl friend was expecting a child so he was happy here he didnt strike me as the type of man to tell lies,and i saw the new car they bought it was a brand new vauxall zafera,i have a friend who owns a garage,a guy he new who sold cars for a living told him one day two polish guys came in and bought a brand new 4 b 4,they told him they had been given the money as a grant to start up a new business,were and how the money was available i havent got a clue.

[AVB]

I worked with the guy about six years ago,he told me he had been living here over a year,his girl friend was expecting a child so he was happy here he didnt strike me as the type of man to tell lies,and i saw the new car they bought it was a brand new vauxall zafera,i have a friend who owns a garage,a guy he new who sold cars for a living told him one day two polish guys came in and bought a brand new 4 b 4,they told him they had been given the money as a grant to start up a new business,were and how the money was available i havent got a clue.

I suspect that these grants would be available to anybody setting up a new business not just somebody from Poland. Happy to be proven wrong.