snow white Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 Hi lads can some help out how quiet can you make 17hmr.i now 22lr are very quiet can you get moderator as quiet for 17hmr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mad1 Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 I might be wrong but I was lead to believe you won't make too much of a difference as the round is supersonic and the crack is just that ?? But I might be wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beanieboy Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 I had a HMR and, despite what many claim, the moderator made little difference. Some folk will no doubt state that a particular type of mod will work well - all I can say is I spent some time trying many mods at my local RFD and there was no great difference....none of them were particuarly effective. I was considering buying a .17 Mach2 and was hoping it was less noisy, and easier moderated than the HMR........if it isn't, I will give it a miss and stick with my .22lr. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jamie g Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 you can silence the blast at muzzle abit with better mod. but over all the crack is still going to be loud due to the speed of the round. its the same with any centrefire.unless you use sub ammo in 308 that is 22lr is never going to be beaten so dont waste your time and dosh with all these different mods. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beanieboy Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 Is the sonic crack louder, depending on the speed, or is it the case that once a round goes supersonic, the actual crack is the same regardless? - would the sonic crack from a Mach 2 at approx 2100fps be as loud as that from a HMR at 2600fps? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixhills 69 Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 Hi lads can some help out how quiet can you make 17hmr.i now 22lr are very quiet can you get moderator as quiet for 17hmr. Easy answer no mate a 22lr is sub sonic and a 17hmr is like a centre fire as the round breaks the sound barrier you get that crack and it can not be moderated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 Hi lads can some help out how quiet can you make 17hmr.i now 22lr are very quiet can you get moderator as quiet for 17hmr. NO! Not until they produce a sub sonic HMR (hardly likely to happen). Any mod will reduce the propellant crack, as with centrefires, so it's worthwhile. And the difference between a £30 mod and a £200 mod on a HMR isn't worth the bother. So stick with minimum outlay. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
snow white Posted June 27, 2013 Author Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 (edited) Thanks lads for info I will stick with 22lr.thanks again Edited June 27, 2013 by snow white Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dougy Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 The noise that's heard down range is considerably less that what you hear whilst firing the rifle moderated. Down range with the mod off you will certainly know the difference. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadioles Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 You have got two sources of sound with an hmr. Three if you consider the thud as it hits the rabbit or whatever. The first is the "bang" as the powder ignites and the bullet gets pushed out of the barrel. That can be effectively moderated. Louder than a .22 but still fairly quiet. The second is the sound of the bullet going supersonic and generating a pressure wave. This happens a couple of yards or more beyond the end of the barrel and cannot be moderated in any way. Try firing the hmr into soft earth (dung heap?), whatever is safe, with the end of the barrel only about 1 or 2 feet from the "target". By shooting so close there is no opportunity for the bullet to generate the shock wave and you will just hear the moderated "bang" rather similar to a .22lr Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
walt1980 Posted June 27, 2013 Report Share Posted June 27, 2013 Not had a big prob with noise on hmr, shot plenty of bunnies n their mates sit 2 feet away n hardly move! The look at their mate n wonder why he fell over n that's about it! Some get spooked n run but had that with the .22lr as well! It's a trade off the way I see it, .22lr, close n quiet, or .17hmr, bit of noise but more distance! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dadioles Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 Not had a big prob with noise on hmr, shot plenty of bunnies n their mates sit 2 feet away n hardly move! The look at their mate n wonder why he fell over n that's about it! Some get spooked n run but had that with the .22lr as well! It's a trade off the way I see it, .22lr, close n quiet, or .17hmr, bit of noise but more distance! Yes, I agree with that entirely, different tools for slightly different jobs, basically a distance advantage with the hmr. The .22 excels at night. It has been said, and there does seem some logic to it, that the rabbits cannot work out the direction that the hmr "bang" comes from as it is supersonic and perhaps lacks directionality. One thing I have found is that rabbits can hear the bang of a .22 and then react to it by ducking down, causing me to miss a headshot now and again. It is surprising how slowly that subsonic bullet travels, you can watch it through the scope sometimes. With hmr they are dead before they can hear it as the bullet gets to them before the sound of it does! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 Yes, I agree with that entirely, different tools for slightly different jobs, basically a distance advantage with the hmr. The .22 excels at night. It has been said, and there does seem some logic to it, that the rabbits cannot work out the direction that the hmr "bang" comes from as it is supersonic and perhaps lacks directionality. One thing I have found is that rabbits can hear the bang of a .22 and then react to it by ducking down, causing me to miss a headshot now and again. It is surprising how slowly that subsonic bullet travels, you can watch it through the scope sometimes. With hmr they are dead before they can hear it as the bullet gets to them before the sound of it does! What are you on? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffo223 Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 I am in the process of trying a new moderator at the weekend for my 17hmr it's fully stainless steel inc internals. I have had it custom made and if not happy with it the company will be modifying it to suit my needs but I have high hopes given there first example I used. I will keep people posted. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traztaz Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 What are you on? Deckers what he describes is quite plausible. Its more a flinch from the rabbit than a duck but as the round he is describing is SUB sonic, the sound will arrive at the rabbit before the round. The greater the distance of shot the more pronounced the effect. Man you bite people very quickly my friend. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traztaz Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 I am in the process of trying a new moderator at the weekend for my 17hmr it's fully stainless steel inc internals. I have had it custom made and if not happy with it the company will be modifying it to suit my needs but I have high hopes given there first example I used. I will keep people posted. Paul Jeffo, moderating firearms is an interesting science, but the basics are this. Subsonic ammo can be made through the use of a moderator virtually silent. Standard ammo, will make a bang,most center fire rifles produce between 150 and 165 Db, this is loud and will damage your unprotected hearing.The HMR also comes into this bracket. A moderators job for these types of caliber is to bring the Db level down to an acceptable , ie non damaging to the hearing of the shooter, level.This means moderating the peak level of sound to less than 137Db, its still quite a bang. Some moderators will get you as low as about 125Db, but more than that without subsonic ammo you can forget. Any further questions please feel free to ask as I develop and test moderators for a living. Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenhunter Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 Jeffo, moderating firearms is an interesting science, but the basics are this. Subsonic ammo can be made through the use of a moderator virtually silent. Standard ammo, will make a bang,most center fire rifles produce between 150 and 165 Db, this is loud and will damage your unprotected hearing.The HMR also comes into this bracket. A moderators job for these types of caliber is to bring the Db level down to an acceptable , ie non damaging to the hearing of the shooter, level.This means moderating the peak level of sound to less than 137Db, its still quite a bang. Some moderators will get you as low as about 125Db, but more than that without subsonic ammo you can forget. Any further questions please feel free to ask as I develop and test moderators for a living. Scott There you go, straight from the horses mouth as it were. There seems to be quite a few people who are put off by the noise from an HMR even though they have never used one. All I can say is 'don't be'! I shot 3 rabbits within 10 yds of each other the last time out and 2 within 2 yds before that so as far as I can see the rabbits don't care. There are times when the noise from an HMR is going to be a problem, such as close to houses or animals, and a .22 would be better then. Its still a trade-off because a bouncing .22 round could be more of a problem than any noise generated by a .17. And you know the old saying....don't knock it till you've tried it....... GH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 (edited) Deckers what he describes is quite plausible. Its more a flinch from the rabbit than a duck but as the round he is describing is SUB sonic, the sound will arrive at the rabbit before the round. The greater the distance of shot the more pronounced the effect. Man you bite people very quickly my friend. Yes, I am not arguing with that, BUT it is still BS. Most sub sonic travel at around 1050-1070ft sec...no rabbit has the time to hear the noise and duck before they get hit, unless they were a serious distance away, in which case they would not hear the bang anyway! CCI 40g Subs 1050ft sec, by 100 yards 938ft sec, so average over 100 yards 989ft sec, that means the sound reaches the bunny 0.040sec before he gets his brain removed. In that 0.040 sec he has to hear, understand and tell all his muscles to react and duck, and that is with a .22lr at 100 yards, few take them at that distance so bunny has progressively less time to duck the closer the shot! What are you on? Edited June 28, 2013 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 I am in the process of trying a new moderator at the weekend for my 17hmr it's fully stainless steel inc internals. I have had it custom made and if not happy with it the company will be modifying it to suit my needs but I have high hopes given there first example I used. I will keep people posted. Paul Just what do you expect of it, you can spend £1,000,000 and at best you will get a fraction of a dB better sound reduction than £35 of SAK! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Deiseboy Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 I dont see how people are saying it doesnt make much of a difference... It takes a huge brunt of the bang away, there is still the subsonic crack but its not half as bad.. And also when you're down range its a heck of a lot quieter. I wudnt go without one on mine again Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dekers Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 (edited) I dont see how people are saying it doesnt make much of a difference... It takes a huge brunt of the bang away, there is still the subsonic crack but its not half as bad.. And also when you're down range its a heck of a lot quieter. I wudnt go without one on mine again What's a subsonic crack? Edited June 28, 2013 by Dekers Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffo223 Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 Dekers, have had a bad at the office? You seem to be a bit argumentative. I DON'T expect it to make the 17hmr silent but I do expect it to be longer lasting than the saks I have had before and a LITTLE BIT quieter, I don't expect the world but I think the sak can be bettered. Paul Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
turbo33 Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 (edited) I've had a Sak, wildcat whisper and on the new rifle an Atec. TBH, I can't detect a difference, downrange might be different. I would back up others in saying that the rabbits seem to hang around after the first shot, so you can often pick off another. I've had the same with crows. Rarely had that with the .22 though. On rabbits, as soon as that thuds home they're off. Edited June 28, 2013 by turbo33 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traztaz Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 Yes, I am not arguing with that, BUT it is still BS. Most sub sonic travel at around 1050-1070ft sec...no rabbit has the time to hear the noise and duck before they get hit, unless they were a serious distance away, in which case they would not hear the bang anyway! CCI 40g Subs 1050ft sec, by 100 yards 938ft sec, so average over 100 yards 989ft sec, that means the sound reaches the bunny 0.040sec before he gets his brain removed. In that 0.040 sec he has to hear, understand and tell all his muscles to react and duck, and that is with a .22lr at 100 yards, few take them at that distance so bunny has progressively less time to duck the closer the shot! What are you on? I am on real time testing with thousands of pounds worth of equipment..............you? I did not say the target will duck I said flinch! You ever walked into something unexpectedly and had your body move so fast that you cricked you neck? There is no hear and understand, its reaction, no more no less. Maybe I am wrong , but I really really do not think so. I can prove what I say, can you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Traztaz Posted June 28, 2013 Report Share Posted June 28, 2013 What's a subsonic crack? no such thing I am afraid. Subsonic flight can not be heard. Its slower than the speed of sound, hence sub sonic...............do I need to expand? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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