Totally unacceptable

[Wharf Rat]

+1 I always ask the farmer as he occasionally wants 1 or if no one asks me for 1 I don't shoot them unless I want 1 for myself , I find it a huge waste not preparing edible quarry.

Spot on. The nurses where I work take any excess game I shoot. If you just want to kill lots of things, go work in an abattoir.

 

Everything from crows to rabbits to ducks to squirrels gets eaten as far as I am concerned. The guts etc gets left as fox bait where I can spot the blighters from my office window.... Unless they took them to their local food bank it's wrong.

[Nikk]

Who needs antis with post like these.

[Penelope]

The British Isles host the entire Pinkfoot breeding populations of Greenland and Iceland, most of the world's population, with the only other population breeding on Spitzbergen, and we cannot control their breeding success, that is why excessive bags are not on.

 

We, as harvesters of the surplus have an international duty to ensure that the population comes to no harm.

[Scully]

The question must surely be,was this done as pest control,and how often does it occur? If its done as pest control then sustainability isn't a factor,but there still has to be a line drawn somewhere to prevent numbers being depleted beyond the point where recovery is threatened.I don't know a lot about wildfowling but it would seem seasons are the only regulation determining numbers shot.You have to ask yourselves is this guide taking the pee and simply making a fast buck and ******** to the consequences,and is this a perfectly legit practise?

If it's sustainable and there's a market for this number then fine,if it's pest control then surely it would be done all year round.The fact it would seem to have taken place under the guise of sport within the season would rule out pest control,so the only conclusion an outsider can draw is that it was done for financial gain.Unless this is illegal then there's nothing anyone can do without further interference in the name of legislation from governing bodies.Only you can decide if this is what you want.

Edited October 11, 2013 by Scully

[Kes]

Who needs antis with post like these.

If we are not reasonable shooters and respect quarry, taking care to put in as much as we take out, then we do not conserve. Anti's would not exist if we could properly and actually convey the message that wildlife is benefiting because of the respect of those who keep it under control.

Cover crops feed birds during the hard months, land set aside for game rearing (rough areas) is not sprayed and has insect life for all birds, habitat enrichment etc all are positives then yes, naturally, go and kill 700 geese in a week. Who feeds the anti-shooting movement more ?

If this carnage doesn't stop, it will become a target for those who wish to stop shooting altogether so your comment is a little **** about face

[strangford wildfowler]

Just to put Its out there, I coulnt shot 700 geese in 10 years mybe more, let alone in 7 days, was It? Correst me if I'm wrong

[The Croc]

The British Isles host the entire Pinkfoot breeding populations of Greenland and Iceland, most of the world's population, with the only other population breeding on Spitzbergen, and we cannot control their breeding success, that is why excessive bags are not on.

 

We, as harvesters of the surplus have an international duty to ensure that the population comes to no harm.

 

 

[Nikk]

If we are not reasonable shooters and respect quarry, taking care to put in as much as we take out, then we do not conserve. Anti's would not exist if we could properly and actually convey the message that wildlife is benefiting because of the respect of those who keep it under control.

Cover crops feed birds during the hard months, land set aside for game rearing (rough areas) is not sprayed and has insect life for all birds, habitat enrichment etc all are positives then yes, naturally, go and kill 700 geese in a week. Who feeds the anti-shooting movement more ?

If this carnage doesn't stop, it will become a target for those who wish to stop shooting altogether so your comment is a little **** about face

 

No need to try and teach me about conservation mate but since the OP decided not to furnish us with any real facts I ask you what a bag limit would do in this situation...700 geese is 10 a day, maybe there's a team of 5 guys come over from Italy or something so it's two birds a day each person. What good would a bag limit do in this situation where tourists have come over to shoot for 7 days consecutively? Then maybe the guy gets 7 different groups of clients who come and shoot ten each over 7 days same number of geese get shot but without the headlines. If the numbers are healthy then they can be shot, maybe not always in the way everyone likes (one man and his dog). That guide might have had zero business for the following couple of weeks or the numbers shot might be significantly lower so I'd imagine they would even out. Population numbers are recorded year on year and if the numbers start to drop significantly then guidelines can be put in place like they were during the bad weather over the last couple of winters.

[scotslad]

The British Isles host the entire Pinkfoot breeding populations of Greenland and Iceland, most of the world's population, with the only other population breeding on Spitzbergen, and we cannot control their breeding success, that is why excessive bags are not on.

 

We, as harvesters of the surplus have an international duty to ensure that the population comes to no harm.

 

Ur totally right and we should consider how succesfully the geese have bred before we shoot or set bag limits in the UK as we are really harvesting another countries surplus

 

But numbers seem to be going up and up so populations don't seem to be under great pressure, even the rarer breeds like the Barnacle populations have increased 10 fold if not more in last 30 or so years.

 

These big bags have happened for years even generations, i know of 2 keepers (dead and gone now) from near me used to go up north 2 or 3 times a season on the geese and when they drove bag the front wheels off there estate car was almost lifting off the ground they had so many geese packed in the back. This is mibee 30+ years ago althou they were calming down then, prob 40 to 50 years ago they would really be hammering them.

 

Fortunately i'd say this thing is relatively rare now and when it does happen is kept fairly quiet, for obvious reasons. I have no doubt this thread could have alerted some people to this when otherwise they would have no idea.

 

I think Nikk has sunmmed it up pretty well above.

It's definately not something i'd ever want to do but if there not breaking any laws and the numbers are sustainable and the geese can cause some ammount off damage to a field esp young grass or arable as tend to rip the plant out by root not niddle the top like other farm pests so that plant won't grow come spring

If ur happy going down marsh and shooting 1 or 2 fair play to u, just enjoy wot u do and don't worry wot a few rogues get up to as u can't change them. Been happening for years and will probably cary on for years

Edited October 11, 2013 by scotslad

[wildfowler.250]

 

No need to try and teach me about conservation mate but since the OP decided not to furnish us with any real facts I ask you what a bag limit would do in this situation...700 geese is 10 a day, maybe there's a team of 5 guys come over from Italy or something so it's two birds a day each person. What good would a bag limit do in this situation where tourists have come over to shoot for 7 days consecutively? Then maybe the guy gets 7 different groups of clients who come and shoot ten each over 7 days same number of geese get shot but without the headlines. If the numbers are healthy then they can be shot, maybe not always in the way everyone likes (one man and his dog). That guide might have had zero business for the following couple of weeks or the numbers shot might be significantly lower so I'd imagine they would even out. Population numbers are recorded year on year and if the numbers start to drop significantly then guidelines can be put in place like they were during the bad weather over the last couple of winters.

Surely it's 100 a day and not 10? 10 a day would be 70 Or I've really missed something

[Dekers]

Just heard from a mate of mine in Aberdeenshire that a guide from Banff let his FOREIGN clients shoot roughly 700 geese last week I go up that way a couple of times a year myself but only ever shoot a maximum of 5 each morning

 

Roughly 700

 

So that will be about 5 per each of his 20 clients every day for the week.

 

I simply do not understand how so many can react in such a way to total hearsay.

[Nikk]

oops right been up all night. But my point is the same just add a naught Maybe its a big team that had a bumper week or does this guide regularly manage this? Or maybe the numbers have been exaggerated or possibly it didn't even happen.

 

I would be very worried about all this self enforced regulation if I were you guys. It's gone this way in Salmon fishing where it is now frowned upon for taking fish after people have paid thousands of pounds to fish some of the better rivers in Scotland.

[JDog]

There is something in what Dekers and Nikk are saying about the number of clients, the number of days shooting and these as yet unsubstantiated claims of the actual number shot.

 

What I find very distasteful are the pictures showing lots of geese shot by two or three guns from a lake or reservoir. I understand about the vermin control argument and can see the reason for it at times, but why if vermin control was the object would you pose with your 'prize' or 'trophies'?

[Tony G]

Dekkers,no responsible guide would take out 20 guns at a time for safety reasons if nothing else Plus you need to check your maths,you can only shoot 6 days a week in Scotland Or is this another rule you think it would be ok to abuse ?

[Wildfowler325]

Just heard from a mate of mine in Aberdeenshire that a guide from Banff let his FOREIGN clients shoot roughly 700 geese last week I go up that way a couple of times a year myself but only ever shoot a maximum of 5 each morning

I believe this as im from Gownhill in Aberdeenshire and Banff is only 20 miles from me. The farm near me had 6 guns shoot 130 pinks for a days shooting. This is a bit much as mostly all the birds shot were dumped!

So far this season iv had 11 geese and 6 mallards and i think im doing well this season! They shot more geese in one day than i shoot all season!

[Dekers]

Dekkers,no responsible guide would take out 20 guns at a time for safety reasons if nothing else Plus you need to check your maths,you can only shoot 6 days a week in Scotland Or is this another rule you think it would be ok to abuse ?

 

Ok what's wrong with 10 guns and 10 birds, or 5 guns and 20 birds, then?

 

A TOTALLY unsubstantiated OP and you are concerned about responsible guides, rules and maths?

 

It said ROUGHLY 700, if that is the proverbial then it is an exaggerated 600, (probably and exaggerated 50) you don't seem to get it, if you believe that tosh then believe Elvis is alive and living on the moon, a mate of mine told me that once, so it must be true!

 

4 Pages of rhetoric based on Pub Talk!

 

But even if it is true, so what, paying customers expect results, #65 is interesting!

 

 

EDIT

 

Even if true.

 

TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE can be a VERY personal term.

 

I shoot copious quantities of Canada Geese under the GL, on the ground with a rifle and out of season because they cause untold grief and are taking over MANY inland areas, the Thames between Maidenhead and Sonning is alive with them (probably other stretches as well), so are MANY other Inland areas.

 

Norfolk (etc) Wildfowlers have a fit, make all sorts of righteous noises, and complain they never see any. They would change their minds if they were knee deep in Canada **** and seldom saw any other Wildlife!

 

Any Wildfowlers who want some Canada shooting (unlimited numbers) feel free to contact me, I am considering providing accommodation, sites and guaranteed birds for very reasonable rates, you can even use a shotgun if you want!

 

Edited October 11, 2013 by Dekers

[jonnybgood]

like dekers has said, up to now. NO ONE, in all 65 posts can confirm that this is even true!! If it is, then yes, i agree, completely unexceptable. But if goose shooting round there, is anything like round here, rumours soon spread. jelousy is rife. some years ago i shot 6 pinks on my farm, borderin a nature reserve. within a week the story around the village was i had shot 18, on the reserve, using lead. I had also told a reserve warden to "xxxx off". all complete rubbish. i wouldnt be surprised if this "700" turned out to be half as much. Still 350 geese is still far to many.

[Dekers]

Perhaps I am going a bit OTT, the point I am trying to make is CAUTION!

 

ATB!

[tlennox]

I think what we can take from this is, some of us think it's unacceptable because 700 geese cannot be possibly harvested and processed properly and some on here would shoot them and don't care.

 

Personally I wouldn't shoot 100 pigeons or 100 rabbits without a use for them never mind 100's of geese. That's just the way that I respect my quarry and the way I want to ensure the future of our sport.

[Dekers]

I think what we can take from this is, some of us think it's unacceptable because 700 geese cannot be possibly harvested and processed properly and some on here would shoot them and don't care. Why not? Even if this figure of ROUGHLY 700 in a week, is accurate, what is the problem processing them, we have fridges and freezers these days and it is daft to hide behind this "you can't sell geese" malarkey, there are plenty of places/people that are always happy to take them, even if the shooters don't!

Personally I wouldn't shoot 100 pigeons or 100 rabbits without a use for them never mind 100's of geese. That's just the way that I respect my quarry and the way I want to ensure the future of our sport. This is Business with a guide, allegedly, it is not "sport" in your sense, but what do any of us know about the specifics here or reality of this?

 

There is "sport" as you put it, "business" and "Pest Control".

You cannot apply the standards and expectations of one against the other.

 

Edited October 12, 2013 by Dekers

[tlennox]

Is there enough people on Orkney to eat 700 geese?

 

I'm just saying that I personally wouldn't feel comfortable been part of shooting geese in this way and I don't feel it promotes shooting in a very good light, only my opinion.

[wildfowler.250]

Still no proof of this, no picture ect. Only what someone has typed on a forum,(not having a go..). So it's fairly unsubstantiated

Edited October 12, 2013 by wildfowler.250

[Kes]

The point of large bags has been discussed irrespective of truth or fiction. I disagree with those who say its Ok or can be explained or its pest control.

Large bags of this suggested type will kill our sport, period.

The average person who goes to Sainsburys, Tesco, Asda, would find this appalling and without justifiable excuse.

If you need to CULL - do just that but dont call it sport, dont let it be done by other than locals who know the area and the scope of whats to be done. Making money from goose guiding DOESNT depend on big bags, a couple is all anyone needs. If its true then that goose guide should be prevented from ever doing this again.

 

Sorry for me there is no compromise on big bags and no excuses. Those days are gone, or should be and good riddance.

[Rexcernui]

With regards to the sporting issue I feel that just because you can doesn't mean that you should. It's just my opinion though.

[scotslad]

While no one actually knows tha facts and i agree that a big wad of money should not buy wot ever size of bag u want. But sadly that happens.

 

Why should big bags be a thing of the past, goose numbers are up pretty much everywhere, they need to be culled moved on from farmers fields.

 

As long as the populationis rising or stable i don't see wot the problem is, not something i'd ever want to do so i won't but if someone wants to or the farmer needs them shot let them get on with it. Pretty sure the geese won't mind who's holding the gun that the shot comes from. And while in an ideal world it would be good for local guns to have all the shooting locally. But do local guns pay for hotels, bar bills extra fuel etc, esp when coming into some fairly rural parts of scotland in the middle of winter when there is very little other passing tourist or any other trade

 

As deekers hinted earlier, most off the meat (well breast's anyway) will find a home