Air bottle test problems !

[arjimlad]

My Webley 3l 300bar bottle was out of test so I asked the gunshop who said they would have it tested. After it had been tested & returned to the gunshop, I picked it up and it has not been stamped with anything new.

 

I was given a printed test certificate from a local garage equipment company certifying that a bottle numbered ***** has a working pressure of 300 bar and has been tested to 450 bar on 9th October 2013.

 

The gunshop could not fill it to 300 bar so I took it to my local dive shop who have filled it in the past. They won't fill it because it has not been stamped. I called the local garage equipment company to ask about this and they said that they test loads of cylinders for airgunning and have never had a problem like this before. (As it happens I couldn't find the number given on the certificate on my bottle but it was the lack of a stamp which was the main objection).

 

The gun shop is closed this afternoon but I will be calling them tomorrow to ask where I can get this bottle filled, as it seems dive shops won't go near it.

 

I wondered if anyone could shed light on the legal requirements for testing ? Is a stamp mandatory ? Do other airgunners' bottles get stamped on re-test ?

 

 

 

[evo]

I have only just had mine done, the bottle has been stamped with oct2013 and they have also put a blue sticker on the bottle telling me when the next test date is due ,, its 2 1/2 years april 2015 , if it has not been stamped and does not have a blue sticker on then take it back to where you had it tested and get them to do it otherwise ask for your money back because no one will fill it unless it is stamped and has the next test date on a blue sticker,

 

the cost to have mine done was £40 and that included filling it up also

 

hope this helps

 

atb Evo

[arjimlad]

Thanks, that does help. The testing company is saying that they never stamp the bottles !

[bighit1985]

Get your money back and go else where, won't the dive shop do the test as well as fill it

[NIGHT SEARCHER]

Some Air Cylinders should not be stamped has it can cause a weak spot in the Cylinder.

This is mostly on Fibreglass. Carbon fibre. And some Aluminium Cylinders.

They should put a new date sticker on it at least.

What Air valve is on your Cylinder if it is a surface only valve.
It only needs testing every 5 years.

If it has a under water valve on it it`s test is every 2 1/2 years.

Edited October 16, 2013 by NIGHT SEARCHER

[malkiserow]

ON a related matter, given who did the test and refill, is the air properly dried as moisture in there under pressure will rust the inside faster than you can drive home! you may end up with a higher charge next time for cleaning/de-rusting if it is still in wall thickness spec allowing for shot blasting.

 

Best to ensure you use a company that is assuring the air quality going in. As this is for a PCP, you will not your want wet high pressure air in your gun!

 

What type of cylinder is it?

Edited October 16, 2013 by malkiserow

[arjimlad]

It's a Webley 3l 300bar cylinder, dumpy little thing I think made of steel, with a surface only valve. It's six years old and I've had it sat in a cupboard for a while so it needed the proper hydraulic test. I'm sure that is what it got, but the certification process seems somewhat lacking. I will call the gunshop tomorrow morning and ask them to tell me where I can get the damn thing filled up and if they can't come up with a sensible answer I will ask for a refund and get the diveshop to get it done properly.

[arjimlad]

The shop is going to get the bottle properly stamped for me, and fill my S10 buddy bottle to 232bar in the interim, so it sounds like all will be well after all.

[Clubshot]

There are Not many Air bottle testing stations able to test preasure

 

Normally pays to get a Dive Shop to do it - as aware of what's required and easier to sort and fill

 

In the window of my local dive Shop - there is a bottle that exploded on filling -

 

Lucky Shop had a sealed Test area - Not so much a issue with Air Gunners as they do not normally empty

 

All the Air out and allowing in water to rust the Bottle

 

BOB/R

[webber]

Some Air Cylinders should not be stamped has it can cause a weak spot in the Cylinder.

This is mostly on Fibreglass. Carbon fibre. And some Aluminium Cylinders.

They should put a new date sticker on it at least.

What Air valve is on your Cylinder if it is a surface only valve.

It only needs testing every 5 years.

If it has a under water valve on it it`s test is every 2 1/2 years.

Agreed

 

I have filled and offered a testing facility to airgunners for many years.

I use a UKAS Approved testing station, the job is done correctly.

 

I fill cylinders with NITROGEN, its clean and dry, but does cost more than a standard fill of air which may not be clean and may not be as dry as you would think.

 

webber

[robbiep]

(I asked SWMBO about this, she is a IDEST cylinder tester, so does know what she is talking about)

 

Steel cylinders MUST be stamped with the testing data

Aluminium ones MAY be stamped with the test data, or

Aluminium MAY, fibreglass, carbon fibre, any others MUST have a sticker placed on the cylinder, to be under AND overglued into place.

 

In terms of testing, if it has a contents guage then it is viewed as not suitable for diving, so is on a 5 year test regime

Diving-suitable cylinders have a visual inspection every 2.5 yrs, and a full hydrostatic test every 5 years.

[evo]

ok can someone clear this up for me,,

 

my 300bar 15ltr steel cylinder is only used for air rifle use, it has just been tested , it has never been used for diving purposes so does this mean my test should last for 5 years or 2 1/2 as it is on the blue ticket

 

might sound a daft question but if its 5 years then I will take the bottle back and get them to change the date, I can understand the 2 1/2 yrs for a diving bottle if its being used for diving but seems a short life span on the test if its only 2 1/2 yrs.

 

or is this another money making scam

 

cheers Evo

[silver pigeon69]

ok can someone clear this up for me,,

 

my 300bar 15ltr steel cylinder is only used for air rifle use, it has just been tested , it has never been used for diving purposes so does this mean my test should last for 5 years or 2 1/2 as it is on the blue ticket

 

might sound a daft question but if its 5 years then I will take the bottle back and get them to change the date, I can understand the 2 1/2 yrs for a diving bottle if its being used for diving but seems a short life span on the test if its only 2 1/2 yrs.

 

or is this another money making scam

 

cheers Evo

think it depends on what valve is on the cylinder

[robbiep]

Correct, the valve is what makes the difference.

If it has a valve that is suitable for SCUBA, then it is possible for it to be used as such, and it is on a 2.5 year cycle. Doesn't matter if it goes in the water or not

[NIGHT SEARCHER]

Has above i have a 10 lit 300 bar with a surface valve on it test every 5 years.

I also have a 3 lit 300 bar cylinder that has an under water valve on it test is every 2.1/2 years.

I asked the dive shop that i use could he put me a surface valve on it.

Yes no problem but the new valve is £65.

No **** leave it has it is. Now I tend to fill the 3 lit off the 10 lit no problem.

Edited October 17, 2013 by NIGHT SEARCHER

[NIGHT SEARCHER]

It`s very easy to get had over.

I bought a mint looking Cylinder from a gun shop that was out of test.

I took it for test and the dive shop said it needs an hydraulic test £45.

When i went back for it i was shown my Cylinder it was red rusty inside total failure.

And by law they cannot let you have the Cylinder back great.

I told the gun shop what had happened and they said we can`t give you your money back without the cylinder.

So in all the gun shop has lost all my business i wouldn`t buy a tap washer of them.

I give £30 for the cylinder and £45 for the test. And all i am left with is a valve and gauge for £75.

[evo]

It`s very easy to get had over.

I bought a mint looking Cylinder from a gun shop that was out of test.

I took it for test and the dive shop said it needs an hydraulic test £45.

When i went back for it i was shown my Cylinder it was red rusty inside total failure.

And by law they cannot let you have the Cylinder back great.

I told the gun shop what had happened and they said we can`t give you your money back without the cylinder.

So in all the gun shop has lost all my business i wouldn`t buy a tap washer of them.

I give £30 for the cylinder and £45 for the test. And all i am left with is a valve and gauge for £75.

how bad is that,, certainly would not get my trade either

[robbiep]

Much as I hate to say it, but you bought a cylinder that was out of test.

What exactly did you expect you were buying ?

If they had sold you a good, working cylinder, which you then discovered was a pile of rusty ****, then you'd have an argument.

 

But what you've done is nothing different to buying a car for £50 as 'spares or repair' on the bay, and then complaining when it fails the MOT.

Edited October 17, 2013 by robbiep

[NIGHT SEARCHER]

Yes i took a chance and give £30 for it but i and the shop just expected it to pass a test.

So the cylinder should have stud me at £75 £80 tested and filled.

Some you win and some you loose.

But the trade that shop has had of me over the years they could have took some of the cost.

I have bought thousands of pellets and three PCP Rifles. Scopes. Silencers. of them in the past.

So i find your post 18 Derogative and pointless. MUCH HAS I HATE TO SAY IT. Then why did you.

[Andy H]

If it is rusty why was it not shotblasted , any resulting pitting is measured and together with the wall thickness checked against the cylinder manufactures drawing before failing it.

Edited October 17, 2013 by Andy H

[NIGHT SEARCHER]

It was very badly rusted inside big flakes of rusted steel falling out of it.

Outside it looked mint. The dive shop had to send it away for hydraulic testing.

It just came back with paper work saying it`s to badly rusted inside total failure.

It had a big sticker on it saying condemned Destroy.

I dont even know if it was hydraulic tested or just failed on the rust.

I must say i was very surprised at the chunks of rust coming out of it when i turned it upside down with no valve on it.

Even the dive shop where surprised at how bad it was one of the worst they had ever seen.

[Andy H]

It would not have been hydro tested with that corrosion in it also the test centre should have cut it into pieces or crushed it before letting it leave their premises.

[NIGHT SEARCHER]

Andy if you read my post 16 By law they cannot give you the cylinder back.

[Rupert]

They can return the cylinder to you but MUST render it useless.My Dive shop drills a couple of holes in it or cuts the neck with an angle grinder.#

It is not unknown in the diving industry to fail cylinders and then recondition and sell them.

I was a diver for years and had a portfolio of over 20 cylinders.

[holly]

ok can someone clear this up for me,,

 

my 300bar 15ltr steel cylinder is only used for air rifle use, it has just been tested , it has never been used for diving purposes so does this mean my test should last for 5 years or 2 1/2 as it is on the blue ticket

 

might sound a daft question but if its 5 years then I will take the bottle back and get them to change the date, I can understand the 2 1/2 yrs for a diving bottle if its being used for diving but seems a short life span on the test if its only 2 1/2 yrs.

 

or is this another money making scam

 

cheers Evo

are you sure about your bottles capacity ? 300 bar only go up to 12ltr max , also not many dive shops can fill to 300bar depends on the compressor (ask when filling)