birdsallpl Posted July 17, 2014 Report Share Posted July 17, 2014 Thought I was having the old déjà vus when reading this post. But realised no it has only just been done to death anyway http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/287439-to-pick-or-not-to-pick-that-is-the-question/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeonblasterian Posted July 17, 2014 Report Share Posted July 17, 2014 I pick up when i want and throw away when i want.Not had one farmer tell me to pick up birds that fall into cereal crops. Had a few farmers get in touch and tell me birds are on the crops.They would not do that if they did not expect me to go and try and shoot a few.Am i bothered about leaving any i cannot pick up of course not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted July 17, 2014 Report Share Posted July 17, 2014 Have you never heard of gas gun, rope bangers or flags? Flags on lay works a treat, if it's rooks etc on lay shoot 1 and hang it on a stick by its legs on sum string, will stop em instantly, the pest controll rubbish won't wash. I've got the feeders the pens the drinkers and I realise double what you do and I get my ammo bought me, I'm not shooting and leaving stuff laying about though!! When birds are insistent, gas guns, rope bangers, flags, kites, scarecrows, etc., only work for a short while, or not at all Its my experience that hanging dead rooks/crows on a stick does not stop other rooks/crows , all it does is create a nasty smell and show the Farmer you have shot something. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
motty Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 yes ! if we didn't we would loose the land ! a farm of 600 acres that we have just gain this year with a nice wood,pen,all feeders,drinkers,electric fence,,all free of charge to use..all weve had to do is a bit of tidying up and strimming and put 200 pheasant down.....on the condition that we as a syndicate carry out the crop protection....now if we turned round and said to him when he is complaining that crows/pigeons are hitting his crops that sorry but our ethics don't allow us to shoot over standing crops...........we wont be there next year he'd find someone else ! ashamed ? lol ..........no ! at the end of the day their classed a vermin along with rats foxes rabbits crows etc ...... were helping the farmer out,and hes helping us out ! if I can pick up I will...got a m8 in work who swaps for eggs..plus I don't mind a few in the freezer..... some must have very understanding farmers...on our main farm we shoot we got good relations with him,,,but we are on egg shells with him !!! Vermin is certainly not a word i use to describe the woodpigeon. A pest, yes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 When birds are insistent, gas guns, rope bangers, flags, kites, scarecrows, etc., only work for a short while, or not at all Its my experience that hanging dead rooks/crows on a stick does not stop other rooks/crows , all it does is create a nasty smell and show the Farmer you have shot something. Cant speak for rooks as I don't shoot them normally but it has hardly any effect on crows they sometimes crows don't like it when you leave the dead out not set up as decoys, we tried keeping crows off specific (sheep feeding) areas with hanging the dead its effect was very slight for a short window in time and in practice ineffective Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 Vermin is certainly not a word i use to describe the woodpigeon. A pest, yes. I can see clearly the point your making, To me vermin is / are a pest species in the wrong place at the wrong time, woodies are safe here they can do no real harm to grazing, what do they become then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
marsh man Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 I pick up when i want and throw away when i want.Not had one farmer tell me to pick up birds that fall into cereal crops. Had a few farmers get in touch and tell me birds are on the crops.They would not do that if they did not expect me to go and try and shoot a few.Am i bothered about leaving any i cannot pick up of course not. There will always be some you cant pick even if you have got a decent retriever , but there is a big difference in cant find some and not being bothered to find what could be picked up , I do lose some but I go home with a clear conscience I have done my best to try and find what I have shot. I have never had a farmer, farm manager, estate manager, or game keeper ever told me I have damaged the crop I was shooting over or told me to leave the birds I have shot and I am sure I am not the only one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 So agree with "not bothered" but this wasn't the case was it not a specific request? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richie10 Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 yes ! if we didn't we would loose the land ! a farm of 600 acres that we have just gain this year with a nice wood,pen,all feeders,drinkers,electric fence,,all free of charge to use..all weve had to do is a bit of tidying up and strimming and put 200 pheasant down.....on the condition that we as a syndicate carry out the crop protection....now if we turned round and said to him when he is complaining that crows/pigeons are hitting his crops that sorry but our ethics don't allow us to shoot over standing crops...........we wont be there next year he'd find someone else ! ashamed ? lol ..........no ! at the end of the day their classed a vermin along with rats foxes rabbits crows etc ...... were helping the farmer out,and hes helping us out ! if I can pick up I will...got a m8 in work who swaps for eggs..plus I don't mind a few in the freezer..... some must have very understanding farmers...on our main farm we shoot we got good relations with him,,,but we are on egg shells with him !!! Over the years many creatures that are classed as vermin and now very rare. Thing is your 'pest control' is only on the back of your game shooting, You do it so you can have a pheasant shoot. Other people class Pigeon shooting as their sport and enjoy shooting and taking the birds home, they dont care about crop protection. I would say neither do you, you do it as a pure selfish reason, no more selfish as other people, so you can have what you want - a game shoot. No one does pure crop protection, they do it for their own reasons. Why do people go round looking for permission because they want to shoot, not because they want to protect crops. I totally agree with Motty and Rich1985, treat Woodies with the respect they deserve. Whether classed as vermin or not I am sure you have your own couple of brain cells to make your own decisions. I pick up when i want and throw away when i want.Not had one farmer tell me to pick up birds that fall into cereal crops. Had a few farmers get in touch and tell me birds are on the crops.They would not do that if they did not expect me to go and try and shoot a few.Am i bothered about leaving any i cannot pick up of course not. You da man! Do you have stirrings when you leave loads of pigeons behind? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ezi bez Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 Never had any problems with the farmers my self and I always pick the birds with dog. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 I pick up when i want and throw away when i want.Not had one farmer tell me to pick up birds that fall into cereal crops. Had a few farmers get in touch and tell me birds are on the crops.They would not do that if they did not expect me to go and try and shoot a few.Am i bothered about leaving any i cannot pick up of course not. A bit disturbing , you often take new shooters out , hopefully they don't go home thinking your ethics are the norm . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
birdsallpl Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 I thought I would ignore this second thread, but as others have decided its worth debating again, so will I. I am quite convinced that to a lot of people that shoot, pigeons are just flying rats. No more no less. I appreciate all the moral thing about respect for quarry and the like. But find it a little astounding that we don't feel the same about poor old ratty. Below is something I found on the Internet and thought it worth sharing. How many of you that insist on picking up Pigeons, Spend any time looking for ratty to make sure he isn't suffering? Rat vs. Pigeon: Rats are more intelligent. But they both outdo humans in some cases: In an experiment designed to test why humans make investment mistakes, researchers proved that rats and pigeons are able to learn an optimal strategy and stick to it—while humans tend to second-guess themselves and show misguided confidence. Rats, however, can go one step further than their feathered friends. In another study where rats where given a choice to opt out of a test if they didn’t know the answer, they did so, “which suggests that rats, like monkeys, but unlike pigeons, may be aware of what they do,” according to the researcher. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cocknee Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 There will always be some you cant pick even if you have got a decent retriever , but there is a big difference in cant find some and not being bothered to find what could be picked up , I do lose some but I go home with a clear conscience I have done my best to try and find what I have shot. I have never had a farmer, farm manager, estate manager, or game keeper ever told me I have damaged the crop I was shooting over or told me to leave the birds I have shot and I am sure I am not the only one. +1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yickdaz Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 There will always be some you cant pick even if you have got a decent retriever , but there is a big difference in cant find some and not being bothered to find what could be picked up , I do lose some but I go home with a clear conscience I have done my best to try and find what I have shot. I have never had a farmer, farm manager, estate manager, or game keeper ever told me I have damaged the crop I was shooting over or told me to leave the birds I have shot and I am sure I am not the only one. +2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted July 18, 2014 Report Share Posted July 18, 2014 This has had two good airings in the last week, or so and its time to close it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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