Rst1990 Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 I have obtained another permission 250 acres of wilderness totally over grown and rabbits have just been left to multiply for years. Upon having a walk around the new site, I noticed that a flight line for pigeon was constant. The neighbouring lands are all farmed wheat peas etc they have not been cut and the pigeons for some reason are all landing on my permission (perhaps waiting for the fields?) Now I would love to grab the sg and be over there but can I? I have no crop to protect. My permission is being turned into a field for cows in the next 6 month so I'm clearing the rabbit and the farmer is filling the warrens up with dirt although that's not working lol Thanks in advance guys Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Sounds like heaven! Just get on with it. They are only there as it is quiet. I doubt you are going to be responsible for making them an endangered species! So when I pot hunt a few woodies I may be committing a crime? Lol like that's going to stop me! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bakerboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Yes you can shoot the pigeons as you will be protecting the crop they are flying to. It is a little like roost shooting. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
superspark Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Or you could call it flighting, either way you are protecting crops so enjoy yourself and fill your boots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Yes you can shoot the pigeons as you will be protecting the crop they are flying to. It is a little like roost shooting. It's not that simple , you cannot just go out and shoot the pigeon to protect crops you have no permission to protect . You need to find the farmer who owns the fields who owns the crop on which the pigeon are feeding ask him if you either A shoot them on his land or B ask him if you can shoot them on your permission to protect his crop ( to which he would almost certainly agree) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 So when I pot hunt a few woodies I may be committing a crime? Not according to the stance taken on the GL by most organisations, including NE, which is that preventing crop damage is a pre-emptive, proactive exercise that is undertaken all year round, and not just at the point of actual damage. As with all legislation, the important bit is in the interpretation. If it were only at the point and time of actual damage, activities such as flightling, roost shooting, ferreting would have come under the cosh already. Fenboy, I've never heard of any advice from anyone saying that you would have to gain permission to protect crops indirectly to be within the terms of the GL - do you have a link to some guidance or is that your interpretation? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 It's not that simple , you cannot just go out and shoot the pigeon to protect crops you have no permission to protect . Where exactly in any legislation does it expressley state this. As far as I know you only need permission from the and I quote ...........(a) the owner or occupier, or any person authorised by the owner or occupier, of the land on which the action authorised is taken Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 IMO, if you have permission to shoot on the land and the quarry you are shooting at is on , or over, the land, then you can shoot it. The fact its eventually going somewhere else is not relevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Yes correct, you can shoot pigeons as pests - specific details here: http://basc.org.uk/shooting/general-licences/ David Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Not according to the stance taken on the GL by most organisations, including NE, which is that preventing crop damage is a pre-emptive, proactive exercise that is undertaken all year round, and not just at the point of actual damage. As with all legislation, the important bit is in the interpretation. If it were only at the point and time of actual damage, activities such as flightling, roost shooting, ferreting would have come under the cosh already. Fenboy, I've never heard of any advice from anyone saying that you would have to gain permission to protect crops indirectly to be within the terms of the GL - do you have a link to some guidance or is that your interpretation? That is my own interpritation , yes you can protect by flighting , roosting or even by shooting on a different field to that on which is being damaged but you still need "permission to protect that crop " Take this scenareo , there is a farmer in my village who is dead against shooting , we will call him Mr Bloggs, be it pigeons ,rabbits or anything else. So you are happily shooting away at pigeons that are returning from Mr Bloggs fields when you approached and told you are breaking the law as you are not complying with the GL ( yes in theory its never going to happen ) So you say yes I am they are feeding on Mr Bloggs crop so , off they pop to see Mr Bloggs and he tells them he has given nobody permission to control the pigeons feeding on his crops and infact has planted it so pigeon may feed on it . Where do you stand legally then ? , Perhaps if you had permission of Mr Smith up the road you could say yes but they are also feeding on Mr Smiths , you would then be ok , but if you had no other permissions you may be on dodgy ground . Of course this is all hypothetical , has anyone in reality ever been prosecuted for shooting pigeons against the terms of the GL ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 That is my own interpritation , yes you can protect by flighting , roosting or even by shooting on a different field to that on which is being damaged but you still need "permission to protect that crop " Take this scenareo , there is a farmer in my village who is dead against shooting , we will call him Mr Bloggs, be it pigeons ,rabbits or anything else. So you are happily shooting away at pigeons that are returning from Mr Bloggs fields when you approached and told you are breaking the law as you are not complying with the GL ( yes in theory its never going to happen ) So you say yes I am they are feeding on Mr Bloggs crop so , off they pop to see Mr Bloggs and he tells them he has given nobody permission to control the pigeons feeding on his crops and infact has planted it so pigeon may feed on it . Where do you stand legally then ? , Perhaps if you had permission of Mr Smith up the road you could say yes but they are also feeding on Mr Smiths , you would then be ok , but if you had no other permissions you may be on dodgy ground . Of course this is all hypothetical , has anyone in reality ever been prosecuted for shooting pigeons against the terms of the GL ? Looks like your strict() interpretation has put you a long way out on a limb there old chum. Not to worry eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 How would you know what field they were flighting to when they passed over your head . They may not be flighting to Mr blogs field ,who doesn't want them shot ,but may be flighting to Mr Browns field who dos want them shot ,or to Mr greens field who dos want them shot ,or to Mr greys field who doesn't want them shot . We could go on and on . No pedants comments please . Harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Looks like your strict( ) interpretation has put you a long way out on a limb there old chum. Not to worry eh? I am happy to be out on a limb , thanks for your very enlightning post , seems about normal for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 (edited) How would you know what field they were flighting to when they passed over your head . They may not be flighting to Mr blogs field ,who doesn't want them shot ,but may be flighting to Mr Browns field who dos want them shot ,or to Mr greens field who dos want them shot ,or to Mr greys field who doesn't want them shot . We could go on and on . No pedants comments please . Harnser Yes the could , but my interpritation would mean you would need the permission of one of those to control the pigeon if you are actually shooting them on their land or not. The GL give permission to the owner or occupier to control certain wild birds that are causing damage to crops , however if the owner or occupier has no crops to protect , then my interprutation is you would be going against the GL , I may be wrong , I may be right and that is the problem with the GL's they are too much open to interpritation . Edited July 20, 2015 by fenboy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Blimey, here we go again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
belly47 Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Yes correct, you can shoot pigeons as pests - specific details here: http://basc.org.uk/shooting/general-licences/ David i would have thought that the post by David above would have ended this thread! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neutron619 Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 i would have thought that the post by David above would have ended this thread! Obviously my hint in this direction was too subtle for some. Never mind. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 David has put a link to the GL The GL states the owner or occupier can protect crops , I take that to mean their crops , now they could be protecting their crops by shooting birds that are feeding elsewhere but are then flying over theirs , but if they had no crops then they have no need to shoot for crop protection so would be going against the GL As it is open to interpritation you are all welcome to make your own minds up , I have made mine up as is my right. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malantone Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 David has put a link to the GL The GL states the owner or occupier can protect crops , I take that to mean their crops , now they could be protecting their crops by shooting birds that are feeding elsewhere but are then flying over theirs , but if they had no crops then they have no need to shoot for crop protection so would be going against the GL As it is open to interpritation you are all welcome to make your own minds up , I have made mine up as is my right. Fen boy, it is my interpretation of your posts ( to which I am entitled) that you are nuts, it is free to see a consultant psychiatrist on the NHS. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Fen boy, it is my interpretation of your posts ( to which I am entitled) that you are nuts, it is free to see a consultant psychiatrist on the NHS. Can you reccomend a good one Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harnser Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Fen boy, it is my interpretation of your posts ( to which I am entitled) that you are nuts, it is free to see a consultant psychiatrist on the NHS. OH, Harnser Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malantone Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Can you reccomend a good one There`s a good one at my local NHS he sorted me out , I think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David BASC Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 There is not, nor to the best of my knowledge ever been a condition on the OGL to seek the permission of other landowners to shoot pigeons as pests over other land that you have lawful authority to shoot. You simply have to follow the OGL If you are satisfied that scaring or other non lethal methods are not sufficient to control the pigeons, then, as you will see if you read the licence and not just the summary, you are acting within the law. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CharlieT Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 David has put a link to the GL The GL states the owner or occupier can protect crops , I take that to mean their crops , now they could be protecting their crops by shooting birds that are feeding elsewhere but are then flying over theirs , but if they had no crops then they have no need to shoot for crop protection so would be going against the GL As it is open to interpritation you are all welcome to make your own minds up , I have made mine up as is my right. But it is not upto interpretation. Read the GL again, it is quite clear and specific. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fenboy Posted July 20, 2015 Report Share Posted July 20, 2015 Again I will repeat righty or wrongly that is my interpritation ( I have read the GL ) . Anyway for clarification purposes I have emailed Natural England for their take on the matter , I will be sure to post up the response what ever the outcome. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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