tighter gun laws on the way ?

[rodp]

a sky news report is saying the un has sanctioned the destruction of IS by the rest of the world.lets hope they get their act together and destroy this evil for good.

Let's hope Putin doesn't translate that as midnight sun

[spanj]

a sky news report is saying the un has sanctioned the destruction of IS by the rest of the world.lets hope they get their act together and destroy this evil for good.

UN sanctions, bet they are quaking in their boots

[bostonmick]

UN sanctions, bet they are quaking in their boots

Maybe.But there was also a second motion to have armed pigeon watch members on the streets but this was deemed to extreme.

[Scully]

Trolltastic Mick.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

:lol:

[bostonmick]

Trolltastic Mick.

Are you following me.

[STOTTO]

Lets hope so, linstead of bringing in stricter controls on law abiding citizens firearms that will do nothing to stop attacks.

 

The government in its infinite wisdom, have with various articles of legislation and other legal disincentives rendered the individual totally defenceless in the face of armed terrorist aggression. Whilst at the same time mobilising a battery of ineptitudes for managing/combating the terrorist threat to the country.

 

Passing effective legislation that immediately and directly affect the known activists/terrorists that actually stops them in their tracks and not unjustly targeting the activities of the law abiding general public one might assume would be the way forward.

 

But there again at what price to their ‘Human Rights’? Yeh, no chance!

 

UN = Universal Nonentity

Edited November 22, 2015 by STOTTO

[Scully]

Are you following me.

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion Mick, but I find it boring in the extreme ( and I'm not the only one ) when instead of contributing their opposing view in a mature and reasoned debate, the same people person each time comment on a topic they are obviously opposed to with derision, sarcasm and sheer bloody minded ignorance in a seemingly deliberate attempt to ridicule and attract responses of the type which get the topics locked, so to that extent you've probably succeeded; well done, you must feel very proud. It's called trolling. Google the term Mick. You'll find a description of you.

To describe it in terms you can understand Mick, it's akin to people shouting over and over at Farage, the term 'racist' whenever he tries to speak, in a deliberate attempt to stifle debate so that no other point of view is heard.

As for following you Mick, as much as I try I can't think of anything less worthy of my time, but with ridiculous responses such as yours I'll try and make the effort. atb.

[bostonmick]

 

Everyone is entitled to their opinion Mick, but I find it boring in the extreme ( and I'm not the only one ) when instead of contributing their opposing view in a mature and reasoned debate, the same people person each time comment on a topic they are obviously opposed to with derision, sarcasm and sheer bloody minded ignorance in a seemingly deliberate attempt to ridicule and attract responses of the type which get the topics locked, so to that extent you've probably succeeded; well done, you must feel very proud. It's called trolling. Google the term Mick. You'll find a description of you.

To describe it in terms you can understand Mick, it's akin to people shouting over and over at Farage, the term 'racist' whenever he tries to speak, in a deliberate attempt to stifle debate so that no other point of view is heard.

As for following you Mick, as much as I try I can't think of anything less worthy of my time, but with ridiculous responses such as yours I'll try and make the effort. atb.

 

if you look back over this thread you may detect a few posts hinting that armed public could have a positive effect against attacks such as the paris one.and one suggesting that the usa does not see as many of these attacks and that could be down to ccw yet when the UN give agreement for the combined armed forces of the western world to join together to wipe the scurge of IS from the face of the earth the post I answered was hinting(in my interpretation) that the terrorists would not be to bothered about the might of several armed forces coming for them.so my response was no more sarcastic than the one answered.but as you say everyone is entitled.

Edited November 22, 2015 by bostonmick

[Scully]

 

if you look back over this thread you may detect a few posts hinting that armed public could have a positive effect against attacks such as the paris one. So if you disagree then fair enough, but you can disagree without reference to Dirty Harry or Rambo can't you?

and one suggesting that the usa does not see as many of these attacks and that could be down to ccw yet when the UN give agreement for the combined armed forces of the western world to join together to wipe the scurge of IS from the face of the earth the post I answered was hinting(in my interpretation) that the terrorists would not be to bothered about the might of several armed forces coming for them. I can see your point, but rather than reply to that suggestion (until now) you chose to ridicule those who had suggested CCW does, to a certain extent, work.

You could well be right, but I must admit I doubt they would be too bothered; they don't seem to care who they pick a fight with nor the consequences. As far as I'm aware they blew a Russian plane out of the sky. If they don't care about incurring the wrath of the Russians then I doubt the UN will faze them much; they want a Holy War.

so my response was no more sarcastic than the one answered.but as you say everyone is entitled.

[scotslad]

So wot happens when 1 of these armed civilains actually shoots someone? And it then turns out he mis interepted the situation.

If trained AR officers can shoot that brazilian on the train with all there training and intellegance wot woud happen if some 'rambo' type opened up every time some jumped barriers with a beard and back pack?

The security services have a thankless job and have to be lucky everytime, the terrorist don't.

 

A civilian will never have the full info, there could be under cover officers involved, could be some sort of sting, so many possibilities.

 

Wot happens in the million in 1 chance u actually end up in a terrorist attack and miss the terrorist and kil someone behind him? Coud u live with that?

Actually hit the terrorist and accidently blow up his vest kiling a few folk round him.

 

While i believe may some folk could shoot as well on paper as some highly trained marksmen, its all the other things that a civilian would fall down on, the adrenaline, stress, fear etc. Thats why soldiers and firearms officers train

I doubt the majority of folk could deal with the aftermath of killing a human, no matter wot they were doing and there is the risk of killing an innocent in the area.

Not a risk i'd like to take.

 

I have no problem if handguns were allowed again but not for protection absolutely no need, we are fortunate to live in a relatively safe place, know i've never really felt 'unsafe' in my life.

Even the terrorist attack i was involved in years ago does come in to my top ten of stupid/life threatening things i've done

 

Even if by some miracle cc was allowed i would not intrest me as i don't feel there is a problem, and unlike americains and some on here who seem to think more guns is the answer to everything, more unsecured guns will mean more guns in general in the area and criminals then have to arm themselves. Its a vicous cirlce and the more guns involved the more chance of 1 being in the wrong hands

The very fact u have to find cabinet keys unlock it find keys to ammo cupboard stops 99.9% of folk from doing something stupid in a fit of rage. If u had a gun on ur belt it could be drawn for all sorts of random reasons. Even just for a power trip, many bouncers do exactly that still despite all the training police checks (and even some police officers are on power trips sometimes)

People and power often do not mix, giving random civilians no matter how well screened would end up causing potential problems, just not a good idea.

All for more armed police both uniformed and plain clothes, even carrying off duty and possible plain clothes army on streets but u simply will never have guns in the right places unless u have a serious ammmount of guns on the street which causes problems in itself

[ordnance]

 

So wot happens when 1 of these armed civilains actually shoots someone? And it then turns out he mis interepted the situation.

If trained AR officers can shoot that brazilian on the train with all there training and intellegance wot woud happen if some 'rambo' type opened up every time some jumped barriers with a beard and back pack?

I assume they would get away with it like the police did just a unfortunate mistake.

 

 

While i believe may some folk could shoot as well on paper as some highly trained marksmen, its all the other things that a civilian would fall down on, the adrenaline, stress, fear etc. Thats why soldiers and firearms officers train.

 

I would say the most stressful situation a lot of firearms officers get into is what to have for lunch, or weather to shoot an injured deer or bludgeon it to death. Or maybe how to deal with a dangerous dog. If police reacted to a dangerous dog the same here they would be a laughing stock.

 

 

The very fact u have to find cabinet keys unlock it find keys to ammo cupboard stops 99.9% of folk from doing something stupid in a fit of rage. If u had a gun on ur belt it could be drawn for all sorts of random reasons. Even just for a power trip, many bouncers do exactly that still despite all the training police checks (and even some police officers are on power trips sometimes

 

Funny i have never heard of that happening here with armed civilians, have you. ?

 

More than 30 police officers in riot gear surround a suburban house. Some are carrying rifles.

But this was not a deadly stand-off with an armed gang or a lone gunman.

Instead the huge police operation was aimed at two dogs. It went on for 30 hours and is estimated to have cost £30,000.

Edited November 22, 2015 by ordnance

[Scully]

So wot happens when 1 of these armed civilains actually shoots someone? And it then turns out he mis interepted the situation. ​We can't seem to progress beyond this scenario can we? Can you not get it into your head that the arming of the general public isn't going to happen, and certainly not to the extent they form an orderly queue where firearms are dished out to all and sundry. For the arming of the general public to take place with the approval of the government, matters would have had to have degenerated to a dramatic extent.

It is a totally unanswerable question; you may as well ask that given all the stabbings which occur on a daily basis in this country, how many lives could have been saved if law abiding people were allowed to carry even a basic form of self defence like a pepper spray? No one knows.

If trained AR officers can shoot that brazilian on the train with all there training and intellegance wot woud happen if some 'rambo' type opened up every time some jumped barriers with a beard and back pack? ​And here we go again! It is absolutely futile to even contemplate sensible debate when there are those who can't see past the 'rambo' stereotype. It is not only pathetic it is very insulting to all those who carry concealed firearms on a day to day basis ( and that includes those in the UK ) who are obviously to be commended for resisting the overwhelming urge to mow down swathes of people in the streets. Ye Gods!

The security services have a thankless job and have to be lucky everytime, the terrorist don't.

​Correct, but what is your point?

 

A civilian will never have the full info, there could be under cover officers involved, could be some sort of sting, so many possibilities. At the risk of repeating myself, they wouldn't be civilians in the sense you're implying.

 

Wot happens in the million in 1 chance u actually end up in a terrorist attack and miss the terrorist and kil someone behind him? Coud u live with that? Could anyone, whether trained or not?

Actually hit the terrorist and accidently blow up his vest kiling a few folk round him.

 

While i believe may some folk could shoot as well on paper as some highly trained marksmen, its all the other things that a civilian would fall down on, the adrenaline, stress, fear etc. Thats why soldiers and firearms officers train

I doubt the majority of folk could deal with the aftermath of killing a human, no matter wot they were doing and there is the risk of killing an innocent in the area.

Not a risk i'd like to take. It isn't a risk anyone is asking you to take.

 

I have no problem if handguns were allowed again but not for protection absolutely no need, we are fortunate to live in a relatively safe place, know i've never really felt 'unsafe' in my life.

Even the terrorist attack i was involved in years ago does come in to my top ten of stupid/life threatening things i've done This post must rank up there with them surely.

 

Even if by some miracle cc was allowed i would not intrest me as i don't feel there is a problem, No one is suggesting it would be compulsory. and unlike americains and some on here who seem to think more guns is the answer to everything, more unsecured guns will mean more guns in general in the area and criminals then have to arm themselves. Criminals are very often already armed. Are you suggesting the way to deter violent crime is to disarm the law abiding? Its a vicous cirlce and the more guns involved the more chance of 1 being in the wrong hands So what do you propose is the answer ?

The very fact u have to find cabinet keys unlock it find keys to ammo cupboard stops 99.9% of folk from doing something stupid in a fit of rage. Really? This statement beggars belief. If all that is preventing law abiding firearms owners from going on a rampage is a set of keys and considering licensing insist we are the only ones who know of the whereabouts of the keys, then licensing have got it very wrong. Have you informed your FEO how you feel? If u had a gun on ur belt it could be drawn for all sorts of random reasons.Incredible Even just for a power trip, many bouncers do exactly that still despite all the training police checks (and even some police officers are on power trips sometimes) With firearms? Going around shooting innocent people for no other reason than a 'power trip'? I think we've lapsed into the world of fantasy now.

People and power often do not mix, giving random civilians no matter how well screened would end up causing potential problems, just not a good idea.

All for more armed police both uniformed and plain clothes, even carrying off duty and possible plain clothes army on streets but u simply will never have guns in the right places unless u have a serious ammmount of guns on the street which causes problems in itself The only sensible sentence you have written throughout your entire post.

[scotslad]

I really give up. Thank god it will never hapen. Scully i'm not even sure wot exactly u are proposing??

Civialians carrying concealed weapons but not in the sense i was meaning???

There is so many contradictions in ur reply i don't even know where to start.

 

Just i shame i can't get the time i wasted reading/posting this back.

 

We are are complete oppisate beliefs and i kno i won't change my view. well atleast not by any of the nonesense posted.

[Scully]

I really give up. You and me both. Scully i'm not even sure wot exactly u are proposing??Obviously.

Civialians carrying concealed weapons but not in the sense i was meaning??? Untrained 'rambo' types?

There is so many contradictions in ur reply i don't even know where to start. From this I gather you're not too sure what is meant by 'contradiction'.

 

Just i shame i can't get the time i wasted reading/posting this back. I know exactly how you feel.

 

We are are complete oppisate beliefs e'd i kno i won't change my view. I could possibly agree (or not) if I understood what you were talking about. well atleast not by any of the nonesense posted. I bow to your superior knowledge and experience regarding the use of posting nonsense.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

:lol:

[69chris]

well that got busier than i ever thought it might - and it didnt get locked either which was a bonus

 

thanks for all your input, perhaps i (hopefully) just read the article and saw the usual doom and gloom (read - ban ban ban) which we are used to in this country !!

 

fingers crossed eh guys

 

anyhow, have read the replies with interested - its amazing how opinions can differ so much when we all have so much to lose !!!!

 

thanks again

Edited November 23, 2015 by 69chris

[Jaymo]

Here is a rough translation of an email that I received in my inbox this morning from my shooting association....

 

FFTir

 

Link to view the attachment

 

Press release of William Tell Committee November 24, 2015

 

 

Terrorism and arms trafficking: the European Commission is wrong still target

 

The Committee approves the William Tell extreme firmness reaction of the French government in its fight against terrorism and supports the national plan against the illegal weapons presented last Friday by Bernard Cazeneuve.

 

Conversely, the Committee members denounced amalgams that the European Commission is trying to do between terrorism, crime and legal possession of firearms.

 

Instead of focusing on the fight against terrorism and illegal practices, the European Commission has put forward proposals that seek to question the legal possession of firearms by hunters and marksmen, as if that could preventing terrorists from committing atrocities and curb the trade in arms traffickers.

 

If the proposals of the European Commission were implemented in 2016, these are considerable human resources that will be used to control the legal owners of firearms, while obviously the police and gendarmerie would be more useful if they were focused on the fight against terrorists and arms dealers.

 

The Committee wishes to recall that there is no link between the legal possession of civilian firearms for hunting and sport shooting, and criminal or terrorist behavior. It is therefore normal that the European Commission takes this international mobilization against terrorism to undermine the legitimate interests of hunters, sport shooters and other legal users of firearms already subject to cumbersome procedures and thorough controls ensure freedom antecedents. European citizens can not be considered a "domestic enemy" or a "fifth column" merely because he has access to legal weapons legally!

 

Challenging the current classification of weapons, including that of semi-automatic weapons "like" automatic weapons to prohibit the detention, prohibit mail order, these are the first measures proposed by the European Commission. They are not acceptable!

 

The William Tell Committee would, on the contrary, that the EU supported the French request to adopt in the coming months a common European standard for neutralization of firearms that is truly irreversible.

Similarly, a European standard for CE marking of weapons would be useful, as the harmonization of prohibited weapons files is a necessity.

 

In the interests of efficiency the Committee William Tell took the audience granted by the President of the Republic to the National Federation of Hunters, Monday, November 23, 2015, to inform Hollande support the world of hunting national plan fight against weapons trafficking Bernard Cazeneuve. The Committee took the opportunity to denounce the amalgam as the European Commission tries to make between terrorism, crime and legal possession of weapons.

 

The President of the Republic confirmed that the Interior Minister would meet with the members of the Committee William Tell in the next few days to avoid all initiatives that are missing the mark.

 

For the Committee William Tell, it is regrettable that some European initiatives undermine all the reforms undertaken since 2012 in a climate of trust with the legal owners of firearms.

 

 

 

To contact:

Thierry Coste - 06 80 87 77 05

Secretary General of the Committee William Tell

E-mail: thierry.coste@accesyst.com

 

 

NB: The William Tell committee groups together the Hunters' National Federation (FNC) chaired by Bernard Baudin, the French Archery Federation (FFTir) chaired by Philippe Crochard, the French Federation of Skeet (FFBT) chaired by Denis Julien, the National Association for the Defence of shooters Amateurs and Collectors Arms (ANTAC) chaired by Eric Bondoux, the National Union Chamber of Gunsmiths Professionals (CSNAP) chaired by Yves Gollety and the National Union Chamber of Manufacturers and Distributors of Weapons, Ammunition, Equipment and Accessories Hunting and Sport Shooting (SNAFAM) chaired by Dominique Billot.

 

This is an automatic email, thank you not to respond.

[mossberg-operator]

https://ukshootingnews.wordpress.com/2015/11/23/as-paris-and-brussels-reel-londons-met-police-say-hand-over-your-bb-guns/

[Scully]

https://ukshootingnews.wordpress.com/2015/11/23/as-paris-and-brussels-reel-londons-met-police-say-hand-over-your-bb-guns/

Brilliant! You really couldn't make it up. They wont be getting mine.

[achosenman]

The trouble is you could make it up and it's already been in the UK. I was a lawful practical pistol shooter back in the day. I lined up with everyone else at Winchester nick, to hand over my firearms...and I can assure you, there was nothing voluntary about it.

 

How are you going to stop them?

 

 

 

Atb

Edited November 24, 2015 by achosenman

[mossberg-operator]

Brilliant! You really couldn't make it up. They wont be getting mine.

 

Are You sarcastic?

[Scully]

The trouble is you could make it up and it's already been in the UK. I was a lawful practical pistol shooter back in the day. I lined up with everyone else at Winchester nick, to hand over my firearms...and I can assure you, there was nothing voluntary about it.

 

How are you going to stop them?

 

 

 

Atb

I know, I was a lawful handgun owner also, but as far as I'm aware BB guns haven't been banned, although I'm pretty sure it will only be a matter of time. But until then they wont be getting mine, and even then not without compensation.

 

Are You sarcastic?

 

No. Like I said, they wont be getting mine.

[achosenman]

I think the days of compensation are over. They will just outlaw them, and you will just hand it over.

 

The ill informed sheeple need protection from the likes of us. Everyone knows that all gun owners are sociopathic axe murders, just waiting for the right moment

Atb

[Scully]

They will just outlaw them, and you will just hand it over.

 

They would have to be registered before banning them otherwise they wouldn't know where they are or who owns them, just like the airgun ban in Scotland.