Are the Belgians up to it?

[andypaint]

We let them all into the country and Europe, and now we're paying the price!

[Hamster]

They were born in Europe.

[Velocette]

They were born in Europe.

 

They may be with us,,,but they are not of us !

[Hamster]

 

They may be with us,,,but they are not of us !

 

It's just that you keep trying to equate this with immigrants and ignoring facts. Facts prove that the war on terror has created terror that didn't exist before. It may suit your predispositions to think otherwise but facts are facts.

 

It has also escaped most peoples attention that Muslims (I mean browns) have by FAR been the biggest victims of these terror attacks, just because you don't all suddenly change your FB profile pic to Turkish/Syrian/Iraqi flags doesn't mean the bombs and bullets aren't killing them in far more greater numbers.

 

You chose to ignore Daesh terror visited upon the ME, it seems it's only real when it happens to Europeans. Anybody who thinks closing borders is going to end this is dreaming, this is never going to end unless you address the cause.

[Velocette]

Its not the immigrants per se that I am troubled by,,its the "Religion of Peace " that they are willing to die for if it achieves the greater aim of a European Caliphate. And yes,,I am predisposed to believe that when ,ultimately Norman Tebbits "cricket test" is applied then the Christian English will lose out.

[timmytree]

 

It's just that you keep trying to equate this with immigrants and ignoring facts. Facts prove that the war on terror has created terror that didn't exist before. It may suit your predispositions to think otherwise but facts are facts.

 

It has also escaped most peoples attention that Muslims (I mean browns) have by FAR been the biggest victims of these terror attacks, just because you don't all suddenly change your FB profile pic to Turkish/Syrian/Iraqi flags doesn't mean the bombs and bullets aren't killing them in far more greater numbers.

 

You chose to ignore Daesh terror visited upon the ME, it seems it's only real when it happens to Europeans. Anybody who thinks closing borders is going to end this is dreaming, this is never going to end unless you address the cause.

I am quite happy with radicalized muslims killing each other in their own countries if that's what they want to do, their mindset allows them to do that without mercy and with a minimum of provocation, usually no more than a slight affront to dignity or a perceived insult. Do we want that barbaric attitude in civilized countries?

Not all pitbull terriers are killer dogs but they are banned as dangerous, yet we allow other animals in with the proven potential of suicide vests and bombs, automatic weapons and wholesale slaughter.

Just how much do our leaders care about ordinary people?

[ordnance]

 

You chose to ignore Daesh terror visited upon the ME, it seems it's only real when it happens to Europeans. Anybody who thinks closing borders is going to end this is dreaming, this is never going to end unless you address the cause.

How do you di that. ?

[Hamster]

Its not the immigrants per se that I am troubled by,,its the "Religion of Peace " that they are willing to die for if it achieves the greater aim of a European Caliphate. And yes,,I am predisposed to believe that when ,ultimately Norman Tebbits "cricket test" is applied then the Christian English will lose out.

 

Why do you chose to ignore the clerics who publicly denounce these bombers ? The term religion of peace is itself a deliberately contrived and inflammatory stick with which to beat browns. Why does the media refer to browns as Muslim when we have no evidence that they are practicing or even religious ? It's plain and simple, it's deliberate demonisation by finding a common link and using it as a catch all.

 

What possible good could come out of these bombings for the brown/Muslim population in the West or elsewhere and why would they support it ?

[rodp]

I am quite happy with radicalized muslims killing each other in their own countries if that's what they want to do, their mindset allows them to do that without mercy and with a minimum of provocation, usually no more than a slight affront to dignity or a perceived insult. Do we want that barbaric attitude in civilized countries?

Not all pitbull terriers are killer dogs but they are banned as dangerous, yet we allow other animals in with the proven potential of suicide vests and bombs, automatic weapons and wholesale slaughter.

Just how much do our leaders care about ordinary people?

Do you really need to ask that ?

[Scully]

 

Lets see,,,,we are looking for an identifying common denominator here,,,,Hmmmm.

 

 

Well, let's not beat around the bush here, and I'm saying this as a logical assumption not racially. If he looks like a youngish Muslim then there's a lot more chance of him being a bomber than some white chav in a hoody isn't there ? In all honesty racial harassment shouldn't be a deterrent to police / security checking possible suspects.

 

Does anyone know the ratio of white male to Asian male bombers by any chance? Are the figures out there?

Ok, so what do we do then, stop every male/female carrying a rucksack and a Muslim appearance? And if so at what point do we stop him/her.....leaving the house? Cos let's face it if they're already on the bus, tube, in the queue for Wimbledon or a football match; in the supermarket or at the school gate with a kid or a pushchair packed with Semtex it's already too late.

Spare a thought for those doing the security checks also.......'excuse me Sir/Madam, would you mind if I just checked your........' BOOOOM!

Seriously, how do you combat that?

[rodp]

 

Why do you chose to ignore the clerics who publicly denounce these bombers ? The term religion of peace is itself a deliberately contrived and inflammatory stick with which to beat browns. Why does the media refer to browns as Muslim when we have no evidence that they are practicing or even religious ? It's plain and simple, it's deliberate demonisation by finding a common link and using it as a catch all.

 

What possible good could come out of these bombings for the brown/Muslim population in the West or elsewhere and why would they support it ?

..............

[Cannon]

Stacking up on one side of the door prevents crossfire. They were expecting a fight, and didn't know what weapons the guy had on him. They left him with what appeared to be a clear exit, presumably to enable them to take a clear shot if needed

[digger]

We were able to get the IRA to the table ( as sickening as it was and is ) as they had an agenda, grounds on which they based their "cause". That led to a peace, the gangsters and idiots over there give themselves silly names "continuity" "the real" etc.

The people who carried out today's attacks are beyond reasoning with, they have nothing to mediate with, no moral compass or powers to reason.

You simply can't prevent bombings carried out by lunatics. As scully said you never know who it is.

As usual and too often uttered in the last few years RIP to those who lost their lives.

[grrclark]

 

Why do you chose to ignore the clerics who publicly denounce these bombers ? The term religion of peace is itself a deliberately contrived and inflammatory stick with which to beat browns. Why does the media refer to browns as Muslim when we have no evidence that they are practicing or even religious ? It's plain and simple, it's deliberate demonisation by finding a common link and using it as a catch all.

 

What possible good could come out of these bombings for the brown/Muslim population in the West or elsewhere and why would they support it ?

It's much easier if you have a convenient label that you can focus your anger and hatred on, or maybe that is better described as ignorance and prejudice.

 

It is the resort of the feeble minded to try and distill things down to the simplest level of religion, skin colour, etc because that is as far ar their self imposed level of ignorance will allow them to go.

 

Even better if the painfully simplistic argument is easily defended with meretricious statements.

 

Keep fighting the good fight Hamster although I regret it might be heavy going for you

[ordnance]

We were able to get the IRA to the table ( as sickening as it was and is ) as they had an agenda, grounds on which they based their "cause". That led to a peace, the gangsters and idiots over there give themselves silly names "continuity" "the real" etc.

The people who carried out today's attacks are beyond reasoning with, they have nothing to mediate with, no moral compass or powers to reason.

You simply can't prevent bombings carried out by lunatics. As scully said you never know who it is.

As usual and too often uttered in the last few years RIP to those who lost their lives.

You could give them a place in government in the UK and give any in jail a pardon.

Edited March 22, 2016 by ordnance

[Hamster]

How do you di that. ?

 

It will take years but it can only happen when you sit down with ME countries and talk to them on an equal and respectful level. Stop interference in the region, stop calling them terrorists and stop demonising them, pull out all combat forces, help each country chose and maintain democratically elected leaders (if they prefer dictators so be it), offer them the hand of friendship instead of constant casual bigotry. It is none of our business whether Assad is a dictator or not, they don't try and change our leaders.

 

Help them in the fight against Daesh etc, (where did Isis get their weapons from ?) admit your alliance with Saudi is wrong, your selling arms to them to destroy Yemen is wrong, your alliance with Turkey which opposes Kurds at every level is flawed, your fake and manufactured animosity with Iran is counter productive.

 

Resolve the Palestinian/Israel issue, this is at the heart of a huge amount of resentments, double standards in allowing Israel a free hand with absolute racist/apartheid control and destruction of Arabs and their land is counter productive, America gives billions in military aid to Israel every single day. They are effectively a US satellite static air craft carrier bang in the middle of the trouble spots. Until you see the problem is largely self created there will be no end to this and in truth that is how it is being staged and run on purpose.

It's much easier if you have a convenient label that you can focus your anger and hatred on, or maybe that is better described as ignorance and prejudice.

 

It is the resort of the feeble minded to try and distill things down to the simplest level of religion, skin colour, etc because that is as far ar their self imposed level of ignorance will allow them to go.

 

Even better if the painfully simplistic argument is easily defended with meretricious statements.

 

Keep fighting the good fight Hamster although I regret it might be heavy going for you

 

[timmytree]

 

 

Ok, so what do we do then, stop every male/female carrying a rucksack and a Muslim appearance? And if so at what point do we stop him/her.....leaving the house? Cos let's face it if they're already on the bus, tube, in the queue for Wimbledon or a football match; in the supermarket or at the school gate with a kid or a pushchair packed with Semtex it's already too late.

Spare a thought for those doing the security checks also.......'excuse me Sir/Madam, would you mind if I just checked your........' BOOOOM!

Seriously, how do you combat that?

How about stopping all immigration to Europe? Or if our Government cares stopping all immigration to the UK? every immigrant is a potential terrorist, particularly the young men.

Remember that during ww2 we had camps for undesirables, maybe we should have the same again? The terrorists are muslims, not Christians, Catholics or Hindus, no bombs linked to druids or sun worshippers, just muslims, the so called religion of peace that is killing people around the world in a sick campaign waged by morons.

[vole]

Do you think so.

 

 

 

 

 

I could go but i would be here all night.

Absolutely not to belittle what the IRA did and thankfully I was not at the sharp end . Just refer to the global aims and occupation of countries .Enslavement and rape on large scale . Eradication of peoples and culture . No possible negotiable outcome . Medieval brutality taken to a perverted level completely . Fact that we harbor potentially very large numbers of supporters and more pending . I think they are a bigger concern and threat for many more people not drawing the line at any level of outrage .

Not to mention the suicide culture , big significant difference .

Edited March 22, 2016 by vole

[ordnance]

 

It will take years but it can only happen when you sit down with ME countries and talk to them on an equal and respectful level. Stop interference in the region, stop calling them terrorists and stop demonising them, pull out all combat forces, help each country chose and maintain democratically elected leaders (if they prefer dictators so be it), offer them the hand of friendship instead of constant casual bigotry. It is none of our business whether Assad is a dictator or not, they don't try and change our leaders.

 

Help them in the fight against Daesh etc, (where did Isis get their weapons from ?) admit your alliance with Saudi is wrong, your selling arms to them to destroy Yemen is wrong, your alliance with Turkey which opposes Kurds at every level is flawed, your fake and manufactured animosity with Iran is counter productive.

 

Resolve the Palestinian/Israel issue, this is at the heart of a huge amount of resentments, double standards in allowing Israel a free hand with absolute racist/apartheid control and destruction of Arabs and their land is counter productive, America gives billions in military aid to Israel every single day. They are effectively a US satellite static air craft carrier bang in the middle of the trouble spots. Until you see the problem is largely self created there will be no end to this and in truth that is how it is being staged and run on purpose.

Is that all.

[paul65]

Muslim terrorist attacks on 'The West' have been going on since the early 80s, at least. Way before Bush and Blair. 1983 Islamic Jihad attack on the US embassy in Beirut is regarded as the start of it. I remember it because it was the year I left school and my contemporaries were a bunch of lefty, anti-US types that crowed about it.

 

We could back out of any dealings with the Middle East and we would still be under attack. These people dream of a Muslim world, free of our Western ways.

[Scully]

How about stopping all immigration to Europe? Or if our Government cares stopping all immigration to the UK? every immigrant is a potential terrorist, particularly the young men.

Remember that during ww2 we had camps for undesirables, maybe we should have the same again? The terrorists are muslims, not Christians, Catholics or Hindus, no bombs linked to druids or sun worshippers, just muslims, the so called religion of peace that is killing people around the world in a sick campaign waged by morons.

 

A lot of Muslims are British citizens, born and bred here. What do we do with people such as these and their children....all tarred with the same brush simply because of a minority amongst them, based on their religion? Bears a striking resemblance to the Catholics and Protestants of N.Ireland doesn't it? Yet another bombing campaign with its origins well and truly based on religion?

So we round up everyone of Muslim religion and intern them in camps, what then?

[Psyxologos]

It is tremendously painful we have to contemplate the aftermath of such mindless, pointless (to those with an IQ over 2) and unfortunately periodic acts of barbarous savagery. Every major city in the world is an easy, low cost and extremely soft target, as we are finding out to our expense. All it takes is a gullible individual and a few pounds of home made explosives. Unfortunately we, the people, and our 'leaders' go through the same set of emotions, rhetoric and half hearted action after each one of these attacks. We get angry and upset, our 'leaders' talk tough and maybe drop a few bombs on some schools or hospitals in some middle eastern country, and then we are back to our everyday routine. We have done our duty. Until the next time the same thing happens again, that is. I believe Albert Einstein once said that lunacy is doing the same thing time and again expecting different results each time. Well, I guess it is time for us to change the way we respond to these atrocities. Maybe we get less angry at the stupid misled gullible individual and show a bit more compassion to everyone affected. Maybe instead of dropping bombs on a country far away, this time we try to PREVENT people from being so disenfranchised in their own country (I am willing to take a guess here that whoever carried these attacks was second, perhaps third generation Belgian/French citizen). A few burning questions we need to ask ourselves:

 

What made these people hate the society they grew up in, were educated in etc?

 

What made them fall for the stupid lies, propaganda and hate speech of some dress wearing, blinded by ignorance and perhaps envy old men who think a return to the 13th century is what their god wants?

 

Why did their parents and grandparents not behave in the same way?

 

This time, this attack was a lot more than just a news piece to me. Nevertheless, it did not change my views on the issue. Last time I wrote (on the Paris thread) more or less the same things. I also wrote that education, jobs and inclusion was the answer. My opinions remain the same. Education, jobs and inclusion are a two way street. European countries need to provide them to all, and communities need to be ready/willing to accept them. Like I said last time, for many this is already too late. They are radicalised beyond repair. There is still hope for all of us.

 

Someone asked earlier in the thread what purpose attacks like that serve. In my eyes the answer with the best chance is to lead us to respond to it the same way we did before (see earlier point) so these dress wearing, blinded by ignorance and envy old men who want to return to the 13th century can take advantage of more people by pointing at our response and naming it yet another crusade, another war on muslims and whatever else their sick senile mind comes up with.

 

It is time to STOP

[FatFreddysCat]

Maybe we should ban all religion. I mean, we all know that the world isn't run by an invisible man in the sky. Perhaps we could put a condition on religions like if you want to be religious you have to be sterilized so that religion will die out in a generation.

[paul65]

I think a large part of the 'why now?' falls into the variety of issues that the Internet has brought us. Nutters and wicked people worldwide can find and influence each other as never before. Paedos, terrorists and those with any grudge can reach out and find likeminded associates with whom to plan atrocities that would never have got out of their sick fantasies before.

[ordnance]

Absolutely not to belittle what the IRA did and thankfully I was not at the sharp end . Just refer to the global aims and occupation of countries .Enslavement and rape on large scale . Eradication of peoples and culture . No possible negotiable outcome . Medieval brutality taken to a perverted level completely . Fact that we harbor potentially very large numbers of supporters and more pending . I think they are a bigger concern and threat for many more people not drawing the line at any level of outrage .

Not to mention the suicide culture , big significant difference .

There are deferences but they use similar tactics with sectarian religious elements, murder men women and children terrorise the population to try and get their objective. All they can do is try and contain it as best as possible it caint be stopped.

Edited March 22, 2016 by ordnance