wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 a utopian dream. scotslad says how do you stop hoodlums getting these weapons, well they already can, and do, its only the law abiding that cant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 Either that or u go the other way and build a load of prisons with no/little comforts,hard labour, work gangs (fix some bl**dy potholes) possibly even death penalty etc, basiclly make prison so horrible they won't be keen to go back. Wot are thr reoffending ates like for countries with hell hole prisons? Althou in many of those poorer countries living standards will be far lower. But i bet most drug western dealers/mules aren't so keen to reoffend after spending a few years in there And plenty of polis on the streets. Ps wadering I thought the weapons u talked about ()small 6 shot rubber bullet gun) don't even exist, so how have the bad guys got their hands on them Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 no, i meant they can get the real thing, anytime. there are non lethal alternatives available in other countries, i did also write, that the gun is for all law abiders, in conjunction with a training course, but i like your piece about hard prison time, prison does work, Michael howard knew that, i liked the bloke. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 a utopian dream. Really ? I have been to many countries abroad where I felt absolutely and perfectly safe and they don't carry , I only ever feel jittery here very occasionally say when I walk through Margate town centre where people have been known to come up to me intimidatingly asking for change, I am grateful we don't have the means to pump them full of bullets. Simple cure is avoid such places, I avoid many pubs and snooker clubs for similar reasons, I don't ask for a gun so I can go to them. It's a matter of respect being taught from a very young age, some of the safest places in the world (including for foreigners) are in the Middle East. I know I know, truth is well weird and very very hurtful to gun nuts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 Really ? I have been to many countries abroad where I felt absolutely and perfectly safe and they don't carry , I only ever feel jittery here very occasionally say when I walk through Margate town centre where people have been known to come up to me intimidatingly asking for change, I am grateful we don't have the means to pump them full of bullets. Simple cure is avoid such places, I avoid many pubs and snooker clubs for similar reasons, I don't ask for a gun so I can go to them. It's a matter of respect being taught from a very young age, some of the safest places in the world (including for foreigners) are in the Middle East. I know I know, truth is well weird and very very hurtful to gun nuts. What is a gun nut. ? If its someone that likes owning and shooting guns then I must be one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 What is a gun nut. ? If its someone that likes owning and shooting guns then I must be one. I am a gun nut, always have been.There are armed guards on school buses in Israel, and for good reason. If guns are widely and readily available in any society where there are those who would do others harm, it would seem folly to me not to be armed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
daveboy Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 They have rubber bullet guns in France for home defence.(no FAC required) http://www.fusil-calais.com/en/176-rubber-bullets-guns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 (edited) What is a gun nut. ? If its someone that likes owning and shooting guns then I must be one. I love most shooting sports which of course means I appreciate most guns but I wouldn't describe myself as a gun nut, to me a gun nut is someone who doesn't understand it's society that needs fixing not adding more guns as a means of defense. I suspect you knew that though. Edited January 28, 2017 by Hamster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 never met me in your life, yet an alternative opinion to yours has someone labelled as a gun nut, but isn't that always the way with these forums I was more than respectful of your view. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spandit Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 Speaking of zombies, did anyone manage to get some of the hornady zombie max bullets. I had a couple of boxes, great novelty factor. http://forums.pigeonwatch.co.uk/forums/topic/350990-hornady-z-max-223-55gr-ammunition-20-rounds/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 no one acknowledged the fact that we all enjoy the benefits of air marshalls, we have every other form of insurance, why not personal safety insurance that we can keep as we see fit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickS Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 . I'm trying to sell peace to America, how's my chances looking? Well, based on the fact they bought the old London Bridge, not without hope.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 no one acknowledged the fact that we all enjoy the benefits of air marshalls, we have every other form of insurance, why not personal safety insurance that we can keep as we see fit. This is 1 of those debates that will go round and round as so hard to compare apples to oranages. And plus trying to compare to UK is completely different culture and threat of voilence Big difference to having armed air marshalls to arming joe bloggs, in both training and screening. I'm with hamster that there is something fundementally wrong with society in some countries, and usually adding extra guns will not help matters. But in hindsight my earlier suggestion of tough prisons and death penalties might not work either as proved by America How many shooting accidents is there in US every year? How many times does somone misunderstand somone, road rage etc or even as i think the OP suggested intially u break down needing help and the 1st thing that comes out is the gun? And thats the thing at moment pretty much almost anywhere in the world (and esp in UK/europe) u really are quite unlikely to by targeted by gun crime unless u are a drug dealer/gang banger, so its a lot of hassle for something u will neve ever likely to need. And when/if people start to get tooled up then the bad guys HAVE to so things really would begin to esculate pretty quickly with guns available everywhere Also if ur going to routinely carry a gun it is a massive responsibility on yourself (that ipersonally would not want) and it will limit wot u can and can't do. No going to the pub for a unplanned few pints as carrying (and that will be the most likely place to get troube) Esp in this country many licence holders are feart of there own shaddow nowadays, and the police seem quite happy to take guns away for any village rumour wether or not any truth to it Self defence weapons in this country will never ever happy and to be honest in the future we ight be lucky to keep hold of our sporting guns Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 never met me in your life, yet an alternative opinion to yours has someone labelled as a gun nut, but isn't that always the way with these forums I was more than respectful of your view. Come on now gun nut is hardly a swear word and I did not direct it at you specifically anyway, anyone who is overtly keen on grabbing guns for so called protection is just a little nutty that's all. Most of Europe and much of the rest of the world including the ME is a no carry option and they seem perfectly reasonable to me. In contrast I would be loath to visit many parts of America where aside from their no holds barred attitude to non whites they just seem to be too tooled up for my liking, my biggest mightmare though is running into one of their pow leece. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 (edited) now you are saying the police in the states are racist, read the statistics, they are widely available, the media focus on an incident, make it high profile and the story gets twisted and out come the activists. if you read the statistics, you will see many more white people are shot by white police taking into account population percentage. you have taken the thread to somewhere else, but you threw out a wild accusation at the u.s police, again, totally untrue. ignore what Obama used to say, and the media, read the statistical fact. many black people are also shot by black officers. Edited January 28, 2017 by wandringstar Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old06 Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 (edited) I could point you in the direction of Brazil, Columbia, Mexico, Honduras, South Africa, Somalia, CAR, Sudan, all countries with huge gang/tribal problems. I think you have a problem with the US and 'old white men' whilst totally missing the point that a young black man has been in charge of the US for the past 8 years. Exactly! Now what 8 years later we have more discourse among the races it’s not that we didn’t give him a chance 2 terms. I have firsthand knowledge working in corrections for 20 years black youth in the last 8 years have now developed the mind set to disobey law enforcement and to carry out right killings of them. All this in 8 years Obama being half white could have brought us together but as everyone can see he didn’t even try. Given the freedom to arm myself or not I have made my decision to do so. So far its been a good discussion. Edited January 28, 2017 by old06 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fortune Posted January 28, 2017 Author Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 Hi I have no stake in this matter and this has no bearing on the situation that we experience here. It was not a post with a political angle or bias it was just a comment on the report. Here is a small part of it. >>> Gun sales in America hit record levels in October amid fears a Hillary Clinton election victory would lead to increased controls. Many expected the election of Donald Trump, whose candidacy was backed by the National Rifle Association, to bring an end to the panic buying. Shares in gun manufacturers dropped by as much as 18% following his victory. But instead FBI background checks for gun transactions soared to a new record for a single day - 185,713 - during the Black Friday sales on 25 November. <<<<< This must indicate that the general public are going out and buying guns ect dictated by who they thought was going to be elected. This is just a statement of fact, not any sort of political statement supporting one side or the other. Father always told me not to get into a discussion that involved politics or religion. Because all you would do is to go round and round in circles and probably end up in a war. My reading of the report was that their seems to be a great instability in America at the moment with the election of DJT. The report was a factual account about how the liberal left who previously shunned owning and carrying guns were now unsettled by a perceived lack of self security and were going out and getting tooled up and getting training to protect against an unknown,unspecified personal threat. A few weeks ago there was a programme about new gun owners going into gun shops and buying guns. Now from what I saw the people buying the guns were probably more dangerous to themselves than the supposed bad guy that might exist. I am in a position that I live in an affluent country and area. I and the wife can, like most of you walk the streets and fields with the dog unaccompanied without fear of being assaulted or mugged. Now don't get me wrong if this situation did become the norm and I was carrying then I would have no compunction or concience about using the tool because if I drew the tool it would only be for a specific threat reason but it is very final with a lot of criminal implications. Anyone with a couple of brain cells and a bit of gun knowledge and experience must realise that having a gun is not the equivalent to some sort of reflective force field that will save you in the event that a nutter shoots you or you just happen to be in the wrong place at the wrong time. I now see that a lot of the brain people are getting jittery and are looking to find somewhere else to live. Let's all hope that things start to calm down before a lot of people get hurt or worse. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 This is 1 of those debates that will go round and round as so hard to compare apples to oranages. And plus trying to compare to UK is completely different culture and threat of voilence Big difference to having armed air marshalls to arming joe bloggs, in both training and screening. I'm with hamster that there is something fundementally wrong with society in some countries, and usually adding extra guns will not help matters. But in hindsight my earlier suggestion of tough prisons and death penalties might not work either as proved by America How many shooting accidents is there in US every year? How many times does somone misunderstand somone, road rage etc or even as i think the OP suggested intially u break down needing help and the 1st thing that comes out is the gun? And thats the thing at moment pretty much almost anywhere in the world (and esp in UK/europe) u really are quite unlikely to by targeted by gun crime unless u are a drug dealer/gang banger, so its a lot of hassle for something u will neve ever likely to need. And when/if people start to get tooled up then the bad guys HAVE to so things really would begin to esculate pretty quickly with guns available everywhere Also if ur going to routinely carry a gun it is a massive responsibility on yourself (that ipersonally would not want) and it will limit wot u can and can't do. No going to the pub for a unplanned few pints as carrying (and that will be the most likely place to get troube) Esp in this country many licence holders are feart of there own shaddow nowadays, and the police seem quite happy to take guns away for any village rumour wether or not any truth to it Self defence weapons in this country will never ever happy and to be honest in the future we ight be lucky to keep hold of our sporting guns I suppose it depends on the threat a lot here still carry handguns for self defence. But even if there was a similar threat in the rest of the UK I doubt they would allow firearms for some for self defence,. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 now you are saying the police in the states are racist, read the statistics, they are widely available, the media focus on an incident, make it high profile and the story gets twisted and out come the activists. if you read the statistics, you will see many more white people are shot by white police taking into account population percentage. you have taken the thread to somewhere else, but you threw out a wild accusation at the u.s police, again, totally untrue. ignore what Obama used to say, and the media, read the statistical fact. many black people are also shot by black officers. Not so, I'm not saying anything, the social media however is chock full of video's that show there is institutionalised racism within America's police force, they also brutalise white people in a way that we in Europe cannot begin to comprehend and hopefully will never have to put up with. Instead of going round in circles here I suggest you join FB and cop a load of a few groups such as Police the Police but be prepared to be utterly amazed at uniformed man's hostility and inhumanity towards those meant to be served. Wrong on stats too you are I'm afraid, taking population percentages into account blacks are 8 times as likely to be brutalised and or shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 I wouldn't go near faceberg, I get my info live from the u.s radio stations, listening to different opinions and joe blogs phoning in. knocks our radio into a cocked hat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scotslad Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 To be far hamster some of the europen polis forces aren't slow in bringing the batons out, seen it a few times when i've been at fitba games abroad or down some resort centres at kicking out time. React in a very different wa to UK forces To be honest most of us are very fortunate to live in a country which is really pretty safe Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 I wouldn't go near faceberg, I get my info live from the u.s radio stations, listening to different opinions and joe blogs phoning in. knocks our radio into a cocked hat. The problem with live msm news is that it's false, their narrative is a lie. Even the political elite are openly saying so hence comical expressions such as Alternative Facts. To be far hamster some of the europen polis forces aren't slow in bringing the batons out, seen it a few times when i've been at fitba games abroad or down some resort centres at kicking out time. React in a very different wa to UK forces To be honest most of us are very fortunate to live in a country which is really pretty safe That we are. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 I don't listen to live msm news. I don't even know what it is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hamster Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 I don't listen to live msm news. I don't even know what it is. Mainstream Media, i.e, EVERYTHING you and I absorb via TV, radio and newspapers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wandringstar Posted January 28, 2017 Report Share Posted January 28, 2017 oh right, i read between the lines, i think when the media said Hillary was a 95percent cert for president, it was clear the b/s was too much to bear. anyone could see the winner, the rallies dident lie. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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