FEO visited today...not sure if positive or not.

[Pointy Hat]

FEO came to see me today regarding my variation to add three full bore firearms to my ticket- 7.92, .308 and 7.62 Mosin. He asked what I wanted them for and I explained they were specifically for target, that I have an interest in historic military firearms and that I have use of the Bisley ranges and have just become a member of two other MOD range clubs. He didn't seem very keen on the fact that I was still a probationary member of the other two clubs. I told him I was advised by the club sec to apply for the variation straight off as it would be okay. He told me it was bad advice and that he hears it all too often. He quizzed me on my security and asked to see my cabinet which he seemed content with. Then he asked me what home security I had, what locks I had on the front door, and if my windows were double glazed with locks and I explained they were. I said I was getting a burglar alarm and he's response was 'do it'. He said' 'I don't mean to sound rude, but you're living in a ground floor flat in a built up area in the middle of town.' He went on to say that any added security is a very good idea. He also suggested I would need an extra ammo safe for the bigger calibers. Then he asked if I had to remove a caliber from my list what would it be? I said the Mosin rifle, but preferably I want to keep all three if I can. He then clarified that 'so your reasons for wanting these firearms is your interest in them and target shooting?', to which I replied yes. Then he said that he would take it back to the office for them to make a decision as it wasn't up to him. I'm kind of disappointed as I was hoping to be given some answers and the whole thing left me feeling a little uncertain now. There was no clear yes or no. Opinions on this please. I'll update when I hear back.

[Scully]

I'm afraid no one can give you the reassurance you seek, as whatever anyone says it will only be just that, an opinion.

Times have changed, and not for the better, regarding firearms ownership.

Prior to Hungerford I knew people with what would nowadays be described as 'arsenals' of CF firearms.

All you can go on really is your 'good reason' and the fact you satisfy all criteria to own them.

Personally I see no reason why you shouldn't have them, but unfortunately it isn't up to me.

However, good luck; let us know how you come on.

[mossy835]

are you a member of basc.give them a call.

[oowee]

Sorry to hear the feedback but. No decision has been made yet. If one rifle is removed you would still have two others to use and you can only shoot one at a time.

I expect (as Scully says only my opinion) they may like to see a track record of safe ownership and use before filling your cabinet? You can always go back later if need be.

[cuffy]

When I first got my fac the club sec said always apply for more guns than you want as the firearms lot sometimes like to knock something off your list .

[noodly]

I had a similar experience when I put in my last renewal.

 

I had asked for a few extra slots.... And yes they were quite anxious to knock some off!

 

I had the feeling the FEO was trying to play good cop bad cop.... The office being bad cop.

[Rewulf]

When I first got my fac the club sec said always apply for more guns than you want as the firearms lot sometimes like to knock something off your list .

 

This was my advice also.

But many club secs are not with the times on this.

They seem very reluctant these days to give out multiple firearm variations or grants.

'Why do you want 2 x .22lr ?'

'You have a .22lr ,why do you need an HMR?'

'Oh you want a .243, so are you getting rid of your .223 ? '

'No I want both ' - 'Why? '

They want you to keep a shooting diary, that somehow proves you are making use of all granted firearms.

 

 

It makes people hesitant about putting in for variations, knowing you are going to get a grilling about use ect.

Make no mistake people the attitude of licencing is not getting any better.

[fortune]

are you a member of basc.give them a call.

If basc were any use this situation wouldn't exist. It's just like the crazy waiting times for certificates​. If you have good reason what's the difference between one two, ten or any? Why should you have to go back and pay again for a variation apart from the fact that it is more income for the police. Be insistant that you have reason, security and storage. Your not a rogue, nutter or a villain are you?

[mossy835]

very good point.

[paulnix]

 

This was my advice also.

But many club secs are not with the times on this.

They seem very reluctant these days to give out multiple firearm variations or grants.

'Why do you want 2 x .22lr ?'

'You have a .22lr ,why do you need an HMR?'

'Oh you want a .243, so are you getting rid of your .223 ? '

'No I want both ' - 'Why? '

They want you to keep a shooting diary, that somehow proves you are making use of all granted firearms.

 

 

It makes people hesitant about putting in for variations, knowing you are going to get a grilling about use ect.

Make no mistake people the attitude of licencing is not getting any better.

Our neighbours put in for a renewal for a .22lr and were told on his visit that HMR's are popular and that maybe he should put one on his form as well !

[Rewulf]

Our neighbours put in for a renewal for a .22lr and were told on his visit that HMR's are popular and that maybe he should put one on his form as well !

 

Sounds like a good area for licencing down there !

[nagantino]

Security questions are all well and good. You must have good security; alarm, dog , windows especially patio doors, what type of neighbourhood .....all are factors that you must satisfy. But no policeman can " knock one off". He's just a policeman and you are a citizen, but yes, good reason is a factor. Why do you need 2 .22 rifles? One for target rifle and one for Mini Rifle. Have your answers ready. Good cop bad cop, yes been there except I knew the bad cop and he was a great bloke.

[srspower]

Security questions are all well and good. You must have good security; alarm, dog , windows especially patio doors, what type of neighbourhood .....all are factors that you must satisfy. But no policeman can " knock one off". He's just a policeman and you are a citizen, but yes, good reason is a factor. Why do you need 2 .22 rifles? One for target rifle and one for Mini Rifle. Have your answers ready. Good cop bad cop, yes been there except I knew the bad cop and he was a great bloke.

 

He isn't a Policeman he is a civilian just like you are and if you are a club member they have no good reason to refuse assuming that the range allows use of the rifles asked for.

[nagantino]

What he said.

[MakarovNcl]

always apply for more guns than you want as the firearms lot sometimes like to knock something off your list .

 

There's actually a term for this in the IT world, it's called a "Duck"...

 

http://softwareengineering.stackexchange.com/a/122148

 

 

This started as a piece of Interplay corporate lore. It was well known that producers (a game industry position, roughly equivalent to PMs) had to make a change to everything that was done. The assumption was that subconsciously they felt that if they didn’t, they weren’t adding value.

The artist working on the queen animations for Battle Chess was aware of this tendency, and came up with an innovative solution. He did the animations for the queen the way that he felt would be best, with one addition: he gave the queen a pet duck. He animated this duck through all of the queen’s animations, had it flapping around the corners. He also took great care to make sure that it never overlapped the “actual” animation.

Eventually, it came time for the producer to review the animation set for the queen. The producer sat down and watched all of the animations. When they were done, he turned to the artist and said, “That looks great. Just one thing—get rid of the duck.”

[Vince Green]

To be fair, newcomers often go a bit OTT wanting all different calibres and then end up selling them again a year or two down the line. You can only shoot one rifle at a time. Maybe the FEO has seen it all before, I know I have as a former club secretary.

[fortune]

To be fair, newcomers often go a bit OTT wanting all different calibres and then end up selling them again a year or two down the line. You can only shoot one rifle at a time. Maybe the FEO has seen it all before, I know I have as a former club secretary.

I understand this point but what does it matter if the weapons are bought or not bought and not used, little used or shot out. As long as the person doesn't do anything stupid with the tool what does it really matter. You could authorise a person to have 20 but if they only ever bought 10 and sold 5 of them after the first year so what?

[Vince Green]

I understand this point but what does it matter if the weapons are bought or not bought and not used, little used or shot out. As long as the person doesn't do anything stupid with the tool what does it really matter. You could authorise a person to have 20 but if they only ever bought 10 and sold 5 of them after the first year so what?

I suppose from the FEO's point of view every time you buy or sell it involves them in paperwork and re-instating slots, reissuing FACs etc. updating databases and so on. There is a man in our club who buys or sells something nearly every week. He's a bit geeky so I won't describe this as normal behaviour but the police must love him.

[Scully]

I suppose from the FEO's point of view every time you buy or sell it involves them in paperwork and re-instating slots, reissuing FACs etc. updating databases and so on. There is a man in our club who buys or sells something nearly every week. He's a bit geeky so I won't describe this as normal behaviour but the police must love him.

 

But that's the entire reason the licensing authority exists for, to provide a service.

[Vince Green]

But that's the entire reason the licensing authority exists for, to provide a service.

Yes but, no but.........

 

I agree with you in an ideal world