Twistedsanity Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 Tried to contact trading standards yesterday and they no longer deal with the public, you get diverted to the citizens advice consumer helpline who give you some.info and take notes, these are then passed to trading standards who decide whether to review your info and act on it or not. The young lady who seemed very knowledgable told me that my builder had committed a "criminal offence" by failing to provide me with a contract containing t's & c's but could not tell me if trading standards would contact me or ever take any action against him! It's no wonder builders think they can get away with behaving like cowboys if trading standards are unobtainable and can't even be relied upon to act when there is a clear cut breech of the law Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 (edited) A couple of years back, my son had an issue with some shoes he bought and went to trading standards but they didn't want to even take down his details because it was below a certain figure. I think it was £200So much the same comment as above, shops can sell utter rubbish with impunity as long as they keep below £200 Edited April 11, 2017 by Vince Green Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 Why? All part of the cost cutting and providing a more efficient system. ie; cheaper. "Never mind the quality feel the width" springs to mind with the customer being the quality control. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munzy Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 A couple of years back, my son had a big issue with some shoes he bought and went to trading standards... This really made me chuckle! What, pray tell, was the big issue?! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twistedsanity Posted April 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 (edited) It gets worse, just been to the local court to collect some forms for the small claims or fast track system and you can't even collect a form or talk to anyone without an appointment, there was a number on the wall to call to get forms posted out and after 20 mins on hold I was told.they don't even post forms anymore and to download them online or go to the cab and get some, then before using the small claims online process I have had to pay to use a mediation process or risk the case being thrown out by the judge! Edited April 11, 2017 by Twistedsanity Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BrowningB525 Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 It gets worse, just been to the local court to collect some forms for the small claims or fast track system and you can't even collect a form or talk to anyone without an appointment, there was a number on the wall to call to get forms posted out and after 20 mins on hold I was told.they don't even post forms anymore and to download them online or go to the cab and get some, then before using the small claims online process I have had to pay to use a mediation process or risk the case being thrown out by the judge! Can't you just use www.moneyclaim.gov.uk ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Vince Green Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 This really made me chuckle! What, pray tell, was the big issue?! He bought an expensive pair of shoes (expensive to him that is) when he started his first job. Within a couple of days, one of the soles completely detached. So he took it back to the shop expecting to get them swapped and the manager of the shop just said no. Its not their policy to change shoes once they have been worn was the reason he gave So he took it to Watford Trading Standards who also said no because it was under a certain figure Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twistedsanity Posted April 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 Can't you just use www.moneyclaim.gov.uk ?That's what I'm doing, the online claim.service but as of 2015 you are expected to show the court you have tried every way possible to resolve the issue before using legal process Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno22rf Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 A few years back TS had a huge truck with a display trailer on the back advertising their work and it was parked outside Tesco in Buckingham. We arrived to pick up a few bits about 2 o'clock in the afternoon and I decided to wander over for a butchers. Turns out that I am the first person to enter the trailer since 9 o'clock that morning and I had my choice of 5 members of the team to chat with. After chatting for a while I asked why they had not done anything about the illegal DVD's that were a job to avoid at our local Sunday market - "unfortunately Sir, we simply do not have the manpower" came the reply !!!!!!!!!!!!! What a bunch of useless pancake flippers. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munzy Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 He bought an expensive pair of shoes (expensive to him that is) when he started his first job. Within a couple of days, one of the soles completely detached. So he took it back to the shop expecting to get them swapped and the manager of the shop just said no. Its not their policy to change shoes once they have been worn was the reason he gave So he took it to Watford Trading Standards who also said no because it was under a certain figure I would've been fuming! Hope you know I wasn't having a dig, it was just the way you worded it made me laugh this morning. I was picturing a Frank Spencer-esque calamity involving a shoe! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vampire Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 It gets worse, just been to the local court to collect some forms for the small claims or fast track system and you can't even collect a form or talk to anyone without an appointment, there was a number on the wall to call to get forms posted out and after 20 mins on hold I was told.they don't even post forms anymore and to download them online or go to the cab and get some, then before using the small claims online process I have had to pay to use a mediation process or risk the case being thrown out by the judge! I think that's always been the case for mediation. Is your builder a member of any professional body,were there drawings that formed part of the contract/quotation ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bobba Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 (edited) Tried to contact trading standards yesterday and they no longer deal with the public, you get diverted to the citizens advice consumer helpline who give you some.info and take notes, these are then passed to trading standards who decide whether to review your info and act on it or not. The young lady who seemed very knowledgable told me that my builder had committed a "criminal offence" by failing to provide me with a contract containing t's & c's but could not tell me if trading standards would contact me or ever take any action against him! It's no wonder builders think they can get away with behaving like cowboys if trading standards are unobtainable and can't even be relied upon to act when there is a clear cut breech of the lawSadly, there is little info here as to the basis of your grievance from which PW members can offer constructive advice. Firstly, separating Criminal and Civil actions, if your problem is that the builder has not done what you paid for or to the required standard you expected then this is a Civil action. If he has, for example, nicked something of yours then that is a Criminal matter. The small claims court can help you construct your case or you can DIY. Having recently successfully used the "small claims court" my advice would be firstly to sit down with a blank piece of paper and a wet towel round your head and construct your case for your own benefit. Start with why you selected that builder, whether you sought more than one quote, your instructions to the builder and his response as to how he would implement those instructions. Then how he failed to do what he said he would do or that it was not to the required standard. Next, how you drew his attention to the deficiencies and what you wanted him to do to put things right and how he has responded how his response is unacceptable which is why you are at an impasse. At each stage of your case you will need as far as is possible to evidence instructions and quotes in response. Once you have constructed your case put it aside for a day or two (there is no immediate rush). Then re-read it. Indeed, if you've a good mate ask him to read it through and ask him bluntly does he/she think you have a case. A second opinion can be a douche of cold water and take away the red mist. If you decide to move forward Look for flaws in your case or weaknesses in your argumentation and how to strengthen it. Once you are content with what you have done then there is then a need for arbitration. There seem to be two options. Either you send a copy of your case to the builder and invite him to respond and then have a meeting to try and agree a way forward. Or, as has been suggested, if he is, for example, a member of the Federation of Master Builders, ask them if they provide arbitration. I believe that if you and the builder try to resolve it an fail to agree then you can both demonstrate this to the courts as having reached an impasse which is why you have submitted your case. Download the forms. Submit your case. The builder has then to respond. You will then be given a court date and sit before a judge. If you win you can ask an award of costs. Just my thoughts. I assure you it's a long haul and something you can well do without. But if needs must then off you go. Good Luck. Edited April 12, 2017 by Bobba Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 Good advice, my neighbour has recently used the SCC against a plumber who failed to keep to his side of the agreement, a relatively simple process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twistedsanity Posted April 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 Hi guys, wasn't looking for advice but thanks for the words of wisdom which I have duly noted. He is pretty much swimming up poo Creek with no paddle as it was a full plans submission so not open to his personal interpretation, his quote letter states clearly "after studying the drawings you supplied I can complete your extension for xxxx" and is in his own personal name with the phrase "general builder" after it and dated and signed in Ink with his home address and phone number. The current 2015 consumer law states the work must be as described and carries out with "reasonable care and skill" which the £7500 quote to correct the roof and £2500 for the underfloor heating suggest otherwise along with the lack of drip rail and missing insulation. he signed for all the money he had as well.the only thing he may be able to argue about was the destruction to my driveway which is another £6k to replace. He had a spec sheet to work to that accompanied the plans that were submitted and passed by building control which he ignored and what he has done wouldn't pass regs. if he fails to pay up or offers £10 a month the current Interest rate for the court is 8% per annum and he has plenty of equity so it's better than having an isa :-) he is probably in his late 60's and smokes 40 a day whilst surviving on junk.food so I'll get paid out sooner or later Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 Hi guys, wasn't looking for advice but thanks for the words of wisdom which I have duly noted. He is pretty much swimming up poo Creek with no paddle as it was a full plans submission so not open to his personal interpretation, his quote letter states clearly "after studying the drawings you supplied I can complete your extension for xxxx" and is in his own personal name with the phrase "general builder" after it and dated and signed in Ink with his home address and phone number. The current 2015 consumer law states the work must be as described and carries out with "reasonable care and skill" which the £7500 quote to correct the roof and £2500 for the underfloor heating suggest otherwise along with the lack of drip rail and missing insulation. he signed for all the money he had as well.the only thing he may be able to argue about was the destruction to my driveway which is another £6k to replace. He had a spec sheet to work to that accompanied the plans that were submitted and passed by building control which he ignored and what he has done wouldn't pass regs. if he fails to pay up or offers £10 a month the current Interest rate for the court is 8% per annum and he has plenty of equity so it's better than having an isa :-) he is probably in his late 60's and smokes 40 a day whilst surviving on junk.food so I'll get paid out sooner or later Maybe not with that lifestyle, Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Eyefor Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 (edited) Not wishing to teach people to suck eggs - but if any goods which turn out to be faulty / not fit for purpose were purchased on a credit card then the credit Company is responsible and will refund in most cases? It doesn't even have to be the full amount. A £1k hoiiday paid £100 deposit on a credit card and £900 cash - the credit card Company is still liable if it goes mammaries up. Google "section 75 claim". Edited April 12, 2017 by Eyefor Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Twistedsanity Posted April 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 Maybe not with that lifestyle, I'm.banking on it, I'm expecting him to not attend court so I win the judgement by default(I'm confident I will win even if he does show) then plead poverty and offer £10 a month, which is fine as the interest will grow until he "expires" at which point hos estate will pay out, I know he has around £700k in equity, he ignored my letter requesting he comes and sorts out all the things he has done wrong and tomorrow he will get a letter from the dispute resolution people which I expect he will also ignore then it's off to court we go after his 7 days to reply is over, the cost of righting all his wrongs far exceeds the 10k limit set by the money claim online but I can't afford to fork out on solicitors and court fees and not see a return for maybe ten years, I understand a charging order on his home is an option if the magistrate agrees which is about £150, in ten years his 10k becomes 18k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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