Covid 19 Enquiry

[Rewulf]

15 hours ago, oowee said:

^^^^^^ This, this and this again.

At the very least I hope the findings will point out those that were unable to take the bold decisions neccessary to save lives. Thise that were too full of their own ego's to listen to the science. If ever an inquiry was needed it's this one, with over a 100000 deaths. 

Although I think youve missed the point of Udderleys argument, Im assuming the tory government are , in your mind, directly responsible for these 'excessive' deaths ?

At what point did they NOT listen to the science, if people like Whitty et al , didnt agree with the governments decisions, or felt like they were being ignored, why didnt they let this be known , and resign from SAGE ?
Did ANYONE resign from SAGE (You can discount all the SAGE members who resigned after breaking lockdown rules )?

Was Boris full of his own ego when he came out of hospital ?

You mention over 100,000 deaths.
France and Italy have 107 and 124 thousand deaths respectively, do their leaders need dragging into the square and lynching too ?
Other countries have far higher per capita deaths, maybe they need enquiries ?

If you seriously believe , like some on here choose to , that covid is somehow the fault of the tories, its more a reflection of the hatred you feel toward them, than any rational thoughts about how the disease was handled.
Hopefully the enquiry will have a more balanced hand at the wheel.

[oowee]

5 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Although I think youve missed the point of Udderleys argument, Im assuming the tory government are , in your mind, directly responsible for these 'excessive' deaths ?

At what point did they NOT listen to the science, if people like Whitty et al , didnt agree with the governments decisions, or felt like they were being ignored, why didnt they let this be known , and resign from SAGE ?
Did ANYONE resign from SAGE (You can discount all the SAGE members who resigned after breaking lockdown rules )?

Was Boris full of his own ego when he came out of hospital ?

You mention over 100,000 deaths.
France and Italy have 107 and 124 thousand deaths respectively, do their leaders need dragging into the square and lynching too ?
Other countries have far higher per capita deaths, maybe they need enquiries ?

If you seriously believe , like some on here choose to , that covid is somehow the fault of the tories, its more a reflection of the hatred you feel toward them, than any rational thoughts about how the disease was handled.
Hopefully the enquiry will have a more balanced hand at the wheel.

Why do you propose dragging and lynching? Surely the point is to look at what worked and did not work.

Follow the science was the moto but often it was implemented too late for fear of being unpopular. Classic is the recent India added to red list lock down which was late again. Whetre are the chasers to sort out the rule flouters (diverting through Turkey)? I seriously believe that the covid death rate was exacerbated by poor management during and prior to the pandemic, that the measures put in place to respond were eratic and partisan, that the eceonomic measures were poorly thought through and finaly that the response was totaly disproportionate. 

If you seriously believe like some on here that the Govt only produces rose scent and sunlight then the balanced and thorough review will demonstrate this to be the case. 

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, oowee said:

Why do you propose dragging and lynching? Surely the point is to look at what worked and did not work.

I never proposed anything of the sort, it just strikes me that some here with their fevered hatred of anything tory, would very much like to.
What worked and what didnt ?

Thats for the experts to delve into, but scaring the populace to death was , IMHO a bad move , considering the actual mortality rate, and its upper age group, this in itself will have repercussions when it happens again.
Boy crying wolf scenario.

The 'science' was , and is , learning as it goes along, they followed a route of caution, as did the governments interpretation of it.
No mask = Masks, for instance.
Eat out to help out = Tiers then lockdown.

10 minutes ago, oowee said:

If you seriously believe like some on here that the Govt only produces rose scent and sunlight then the balanced and thorough review will demonstrate this to be the case. 

Mistakes were made, elderly should have been shielded far sooner, the vast majority of the dead were 75 + 
But this in itself creates terrible problems , what if they dont want to ? Could a government forcibly lock down its most venerable citizens ?

Lockdown itself, by their own admission , was a gamble , would they obey ?
They could have looked mighty stupid if a gilet jeunes style movement had enough support.

But when it truly comes down to my rose scented view of how the tories handled it, I cast my mind over to the alternative.. the opposition, if you can even call them that !
Try and imagine Corbyn or Starmer trying to navigate their way through the mess, with their associated sycophants.
They cant even run a party in opposition, never mind a government in power at a time of crisis.

 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

'nuff said!

[oowee]

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

Thats for the experts to delve into, but scaring the populace to death was , IMHO a bad move , considering the actual mortality rate, and its upper age group, this in itself will have repercussions when it happens again.
Boy crying wolf scenario.

The 'science' was , and is , learning as it goes along, they followed a route of caution, as did the governments interpretation of it.
No mask = Masks, for instance.
Eat out to help out = Tiers then lockdown.

Mistakes were made, elderly should have been shielded far sooner, the vast majority of the dead were 75 + 
But this in itself creates terrible problems , what if they dont want to ? Could a government forcibly lock down its most venerable citizens ?

Lockdown itself, by their own admission , was a gamble , would they obey ?
They could have looked mighty stupid if a gilet jeunes style movement had enough support.

But when it truly comes down to my rose scented view of how the tories handled it, I cast my mind over to the alternative.. the opposition, if you can even call them that !
Try and imagine Corbyn or Starmer trying to navigate their way through the mess, with their associated sycophants.
They cant even run a party in opposition, never mind a government in power at a time of crisis.

 

And this is the crux of the matter. A disproportionate response, poorly timed wth a totaly garbled message throughout. 

A lack of confidence in leadership was evident throughout and an unwillingness to take the tough decisions needed. 

I can't see any other party that would have done better but this in itself is no cause for celebration.  Outsourcing the problem would have been the obvious way forward but, for me this is where the vanity of the trolly comes in, where is the glory in that? 

Edited May 15, 2021 by oowee

[TIGHTCHOKE]

2 minutes ago, oowee said:

And this is the crux of the matter. A disproportionate response, poorly timed wth a totaly garbled message throughout. 

A lack of confidence in leadership was evident throughout and an unwillingness to take the tough decisions needed. 

I can't see any other party that would have done better but this in itself is no cause for celebration.  Outsourcing the problem would have been the obvious way forward but, for me this is where the vanity of the trolly comes in, where is the glory in that? 

Who's looking for glory?

 

You accept that no other person or party would have done better, it wasn't pleasant, but it had to be done without any previous experience to go on.

[Rewulf]

9 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Who's looking for glory?

 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

[Vince Green]

On 14/05/2021 at 17:30, Walker570 said:

Utter waste of OUR money.

I agree, what are they going to do? press rewind and have a re-run?

Every idiot is an expert, after the event

[Rewulf]

Interesting program on last night about the history of the pandemic from late 19 to present day, some decent footage...

... And an over whelming sense and portrayal of whose 'fault' it was , it wasnt the WHO , or China, it wasnt even the Russians fault , or the uneducated right wingers !

It was the tory governments fault, and how badly they handled it.

But then it was a  channel 4 production 

[Walker570]

I think the only good thi can come out of any enquiry is the parlous state of our NHS.  It is not as if such pandemics have not occurred before.  BUT.. worse still it just outlined how pathetic the running of our NHS is.  OK as an ex copper I have private health care which was introduced many years ago in the West Midlands and is now a National facility. Recently my wife attended for a very small minor removal of a dodgy spot on her face.  A nurse attended and had a 'booklet' of forms she had to complete and some of the questions where not applicable but had to be answered. One made us both roar with laughter .... Do you drink? ....and without a hestation my wife returned, "Yes, like a fish" and insisted that was what the nurse wrote down.  All of that paperwork had to be 'pushed' by someone and they had to have an Assistant and they had to have a Secretary each etc etc.    How many people have died from heart disease and cancer due to not being able to get treatment or even be diagnosed?

I am not holding my breath to see an improvement any time soon. Too many snouts in the trough.

[Yellow Bear]

35 minutes ago, Walker570 said:

Too many snouts in the trough.

And most of them are no win no fee lawyers  - it is because of them that there is so much paperwork required!

[Vince Green]

2 hours ago, Rewulf said:

Interesting program on last night about the history of the pandemic from late 19 to present day, some decent footage...

... And an over whelming sense and portrayal of whose 'fault' it was , it wasnt the WHO , or China, it wasnt even the Russians fault , or the uneducated right wingers !

It was the tory governments fault, and how badly they handled it.

But then it was a  channel 4 production 

Like I said before, every idiot is an expert after the event

[Saltings]

8 hours ago, Vince Green said:

Like I said before, every idiot is an expert after the event

+1 on that 

[Rewulf]

On 25/05/2021 at 17:02, Vince Green said:

Like I said before, every idiot is an expert after the event