Rob85 Posted August 17, 2021 Report Share Posted August 17, 2021 27 minutes ago, Graham M said: Been reading through this and I just feel numb. Lost my semi-auto fullbore rifles in 89 and then my pistols in 96. Now what? I have been talking today to one of my referees who I have know since he was a lad, and is now a deputy head teacher at a local school. He told me that he wasn't contacted by the police at all at my last two FAC renewals. Surely the whole point of the referee system was to get information from people who know you. If this fundamental condition isn't being adhered to what else is being left out, and who will the police blame when their mistakes are uncovered. Part of the licence process in NI now has a step where before the licence is submitted electronically through to the main branch the two referees get up to 5 days (I think) to reply to a standard form that is emailed to them automatically by the firearms branch system. You get an email to tell you to get in touch to remind your referees that they have been emailed incase its in their junk folder. If they do not reply your payment is refunded and the application automatically cancelled. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Munzy Posted August 18, 2021 Report Share Posted August 18, 2021 (edited) On 16/08/2021 at 20:13, Vince Green said: It's just not possible to be 100% right what ever they try to do We should reflect on how infrequently these things happen. But happen they will. The system works pretty well most of the time. It's never going to work every time I think this is a very sensible conclusion. As humans we strive for perfection but the fact is it rarely exists, perhaps never. Drawing on a few points, it sounds like there was an “accusation” of assault rather than a charge. Our legal system offers the protection of being innocent unless proved to be otherwise. Should an FEO work outside of that parameter? In this case I wish they had, however, if I was accused of something I didn’t do tomorrow and have my shotguns removed I would be instructing a solicitor and would feel incredibly offended. Regarding this person’s mental state and educational background; it appears an EHCP (Education, Health & Care Plan) was in place at some stage whilst he was at school. Every plan is different and may not have made any reference to underlying behaviour or issues which would ordinarily result in this sort of behaviour. EHCPs also come and go and therefore it simply may not have been visible or relevant to the FEO. It could, for example, have been issued at age 6 due to ADHD ensuring he was given special attention academically but it was then dissolved 5 years later. All of these things will come out in the wash, however, the key thing to remember is, as Vince said, a perfect solution does not exist. Ban pump-actions, move all shotguns to FAC holders, implement social media checks and have an annual GP checkup… at some point we will still have another licensed gun used to murder others, either in anger or insanity. Whilst we await that tragic future event we will see many killed by knives and blunt instruments. Edited August 18, 2021 by Munzy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted August 18, 2021 Report Share Posted August 18, 2021 11 minutes ago, Munzy said: I think this is a very sensible conclusion. As humans we strive for perfection but the fact is it rarely exists, perhaps never. ...... Agree 100%. Overall- the UK has a pretty good record with low crime levels from firearms overall compared to other countries. This is particularly so from licensed firearms (as we do have quite a 'tough' regime - but it will never be 'zero' and whilst removing 'legally held' firearms would possibly save a very few cases - the illegally held firearms involved in the majority of crimes would allow that to continue. Sadly deaths in crimes of all sorts, road accidents, house and building fires, air accidents, and all many of premature accidental and criminal deaths will still happen ......... as it has since the dawn of time. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted August 18, 2021 Report Share Posted August 18, 2021 Quote Drawing on a few points, it sounds like there was an “accusation” of assault rather than a charge. We will have to wait until an investigation into the Police conduct has been concluded, but it might well be that he received a caution, conditional on him attending an Anger Management Course. If that is the case, he would have already admitted guilt. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted August 20, 2021 Report Share Posted August 20, 2021 Police took three months to seize Plymouth incel Jake Davison's gun and licence off him | Daily Mail Online Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Newbie to this Posted August 20, 2021 Report Share Posted August 20, 2021 6 minutes ago, Gordon R said: Police took three months to seize Plymouth incel Jake Davison's gun and licence off him | Daily Mail Online Oh dear. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted August 20, 2021 Report Share Posted August 20, 2021 9 minutes ago, Gordon R said: Police took three months to seize Plymouth incel Jake Davison's gun and licence off him | Daily Mail Online I try not to knock the police , but I'm sitting here shaking my head at this one . On the face of it , it looks so easily preventable , and ,It looks more like a failure in the system , rather than a failure by a single officer . I dare say more facts and findings will appear as the investigation moved forward . Truly heartbreaking. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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