.22lr or .17hmr

[njc110381]

Now I've had all my paperwork lost by the firearms dept and I have to apply again, I'm having second thoughts about asking for a HMR! I've been told on the phone that if I can provide details of a mentor to accompany me when I shoot, I can have the 6.5x55 now too. I'm starting to doubt my original choice of the HMR. My land was cleared for .22lr and .17hmr as long as I use a high seat, so I guess that extreme range shooting with the HMR is out because of the reduced angle of the ground at range? Anything that needs more power than a .22, or longer range shots, could in theory be taken with the 6.5. I'm also starting to realise that subsonic shooting is very useful, especially at night. Should I ask for a .22lr or a .17hmr, or just ask for both? I'm even thinking about comments I've made in the past, if I was to buy a .22lr I'd rather have a .223 than a HMR as a long range vermin round! Would I get away with asking for .22lr, .17hmr, .223 and 6.5mm so I could decide later? I hate it when I can't make a decision, it's my most irritating flaw :blink:

[markbivvy]

I get away with asking for .22lr, .17hmr, .223 and 6.5mm

 

if you have a good reason for them all, why not.

or go.22lr,hornet, 6.5.

[Dunkield]

Only Smarties have the answer :blink:

[magman]

I get away with asking for .22lr, .17hmr, .223 and 6.5mm

 

if you have a good reason for them all, why not.

or go.22,hornet, 6.5.

 

 

:blink:

 

Ps , dont forget fac air plus sec 1 firearm

[Quist]

Its horses for courses. Have a chat with your Firearms Officer. Tell him that there's situations there where a .22 would be a better and quieter solution and situations where a .17 HMR or even a .17 FAC Air Rifle would be better. He's much more likely to give you additionals if he can see that you understand the uses and limitations of each tool in the arsenal.

[njc110381]

I get away with asking for .22lr, .17hmr, .223 and 6.5mm

 

if you have a good reason for them all, why not.

or go.22lr,hornet, 6.5.

 

 

 

I'm glad you replied to this, I was going to PM you if you didn't! What makes you say a Hornet over a .223? I must say I was tempted, but then for targets the .223 ammo is cheap and easy to come by at the club.

 

I don't want to sound like I'm asking for too much. The trouble is I really don't know what to get! I think at first a .22lr and the 6.5x55 will do. You can get some pretty light weight varmint type bullets for the 6.5, so the others may not be needed?

[markbivvy]

light weight varmint type bullets for the 6.5, so the others may not be needed?

 

but would your licensing authority give you permission to use a 6.5

for vermin/ground game. hornet would be granted for fox/vermin.

and is easy to reload.

at the end of the day its down to what they will let you have, and what they will let you shoot with em.

 

i cant get the 223 for vermin, thats why i have the hornet.

the .17 hmr is not getting out like it used to.

[08shooter]

both have pros 22lr cheap as chips to shoot and silent.17hmr a little noisy but awesome accuracy up to and well over 100 metres.i have 22 but would never rule a 17hmr out.i thought it was an amazing little round for them longer distance shots and easy to use due to its flat trajectory.

[njc110381]

No .223 for vermin, that's harsh! I guess it depends on your needs and what the land you are shooting is like, aswell as the mood of the FEO. I'm going off of the HMR now I'm thinking about it. It's very expensive and loud for the level of power it offers. You can get 40 grain .223 ammo, that will be good on the bunnies if I can get it!

[al4x]

If you can only shoot safely from a high seat then I'd not even contemplate the .22 you can't have adequate backstops for it. Pretty much no matter what angel you fire one into the ground you can and will get ricochets disapearing into the distance.

With the HMR though this is far less likely and if the ground is open then the noise won't be much of an issue, plus though they sound loud at times rabbits don't seem to worry about it as its very hard to find a source for the noise.

With the issue of taking longer shallower shots as long as you stick to the Ballistic tips and don't get silly you'll be far more comfortable taking those shots than using a .22 at half the distance.

have you tried both in hunting conditions? as thats what you really need. In your situation I'd apply for both and get the HMR first then chop it in if you don't get on with it but personally I won't use a .22 on our ground any more and that is purely down to the ricochet issue as I absolutely hate firing at a steep angle and hearing a zing

[casts_by_fly]

Like said above, 'horses for courses'. What do you want to shoot and how far away will it be? Are there noise considerations?

 

A 22LR will do you rabbits and small animals <100 yd. It does 'silent' work. An HMR extends your range another 50 yd on the same animals and gives you fox under 100 yd. You loose a bit of silence, you gain some accuracy and range.

 

A 22 hornet will add another 50 yd on top of the HMR for fox and smaller and is a true 200 yd gun. You give up a little accuracy on the HMR if you don't reload, but you pick up a lot of power.

 

A 223 is another step of similar size. It is a 250 yd gun for fox and anything smaller. You'll get better accuracy out of a 223 than all of the above. But, it is at the expense of noise.

 

A 6.5 is a huge step up in power over the 223 and if you're planning to shoot mostly vermin/varmints then I wouldn't use the 6.5 as you're burning a lot more powder and making a lot more noise than needed.

 

My choice? Ask for them all. If you don't ask you can't get it. If you ask for them all but are turned down on the 223 and HMR you still have the air rifle, 22LR, hornet, and 6.5 on your ticket. If you had only asked for the HMR and 223 you're SOL. Get them all on your ticket, then buy as you get a deal on them or need a particular one.

[tuck1]

As stated above, I'd ask for them all. I recently put in for .22 and my FEO told me WHEN HE DROPPED MY CERT OFF that I could have had much more if I wanted it!

 

I should certainly have got a centre fire of some kind, and section 1 shotgun.

 

And due to the advances that have been made I really wish I had gone for FAC air to sort out the squirrels round here.

 

Don't forget though, that if you do not fill vacant slots they can take them away.

 

The bottom line is, get what you think you need now and for the immediate future, a variation is only £26 (I think) at the end of the day.

[njc110381]

I've made a final decision on .22lr, .17hmr and 6.5x55. The .223 will be an expensive gun to buy, and I wont have the money for some time so I'll ask for it later if need be. I'm buying the HMR first, and then the 6.5 (or both if funds allow). I've been told I can have the 6.5 with no experience as long as I name a mentor to accompany me, which I'm happy about. Getting open may be an issue with the 6.5 on there, but I'd rather have the gun and wait before I can take it where I like over not having it at all.

 

I've only ever hunted with a .22. I've club shot a HMR and really liked it, but I've never shot a bunny with one. I have heard the zing of the .22lr, but luckily the ground was very large and open so it wouldn't have hit anything :blink:

[Dunkield]

As the others have said, if you have good reason for them put them all down, you have 5 years to decide if you are going to buy them or not.

Situations can change you can gain/loose permissions in that time.

The .17hmr/.22lr debate will never end, but as has been said before it is horses for courses.

I would be mindful of richochet's with the .22 but just bare in mind how many millions of rabbits and other vermin have been shot with them over the years, and take that into account when reading about it, especially from people who have never owned or used one.

As always backstops are everything.

[Oly]

If I had to choose .22lr, but my FLO offered me .17hmr as well if I wanted it, but then they allowed me a second .22lr - so that's what I now have on my ticket!

[invector]

Please don't make the mistake of believing that 17HMR rounds don't ricochet, they do. In any case, with all these ricochets, why aren't the fields littered with dead and dying people? No excuse for proper backstops, and safety at all times, but it does make you think......................

[njc110381]

Please don't make the mistake of believing that 17HMR rounds don't ricochet, they do. In any case, with all these ricochets, why aren't the fields littered with dead and dying people? No excuse for proper backstops, and safety at all times, but it does make you think......................

 

 

I understand they are less likely to ricochet, which can only be a good thing. As you say there's no excuse for not taking the usual safety precautions. The reason the fields are not littered with injured ramblers is because the chance of hitting one is remote. There's a lot more empty ground area to hit than rambler! This however is down to luck, which should never be relied apon in our sport. Remember the child hit by a .22 round in a school playground some time ago? Whoever fired that shot obviously run short on luck that day, and thank god the child wasn't fatally wounded.

 

EDIT....And I forgot to say thanks for pointing that out. I do know the safety rules of shooting fairly well already, but there's no harm in pushing the point home.

[markbivvy]

I have thought about this a lot lately why dont lets say eley make a b/tip sub that is less likely to rico beats me

 

 

.22 lr subs arent fast enough kev.

[al4x]

Please don't make the mistake of believing that 17HMR rounds don't ricochet, they do. In any case, with all these ricochets, why aren't the fields littered with dead and dying people? No excuse for proper backstops, and safety at all times, but it does make you think......................

 

 

on the rare occasion one does there usually is very little bullet left to go anywhere plus with the light weight the ability to retain energy and travel far is reduced, unlike a 40 grain lump of lead that doesn't break up. I've shot down at a 45 degree angle on grass and killed the rabbit and still had a ricochet followed by thud off the corrugated Iron straw shed I was using as a secondary backstop with a .22lr and to me thats not funny, and certainly not something I've experienced with the HMR

[invector]

I've had several ricochets with the .17HMR, and they sound different to the .22 ricochets. It's a high pitched zzzip, probably fragments of copper jacket.

[Stuu]

I have both, 22LR and 17HMR.

If its rabbits your going for, then you cant go wrong with a .22LR

[markbivvy]

I have both, 22LR and 17HMR.

If its rabbits your going for, then you cant go wrong with a .22LR

 

 

unless they are 200 yds away.

[mossy835]

well iv had a .22 for 14 years hit many a rabbit only now i have slots for .17hmr, and fac air rifle.not got round to getting any of them but i do like the .22 for rabbit.

[BigGun1]

I have thought about this a lot lately why dont lets say eley make a b/tip sub that is less likely to rico beats me

 

Here here! why does every other bullet shape/design get so many changes and updates but the .22RF seems to be frozen in time! lets have a sabot loaded .17 or .204 round in a .22RF long case, why not use a .22 30grain balistic tip in a hot loaded case?? should be good for about 1700-1800 FPS that should get it expanding!! How about promethius type round, working on a sabot style round but retaining the jacket. Or a flat balistic tip or ball that fractures the round into 3 or 4 sections at the lower velocity that subs offer giving more reliable expansion or offering more wound channels, this would also be safer as the 3 or 4 lighter pieces of lead or whatever would carrly less energy if it were to richochet. lets hassle the manufactures to get designing!!!

[luckytrigger]

I get away with asking for .22lr, .17hmr, .223 and 6.5mm

 

if you have a good reason for them all, why not.

or go.22lr,hornet, 6.5.

 

 

 

I'm glad you replied to this, I was going to PM you if you didn't! What makes you say a Hornet over a .223? I must say I was tempted, but then for targets the .223 ammo is cheap and easy to come by at the club.

 

I don't want to sound like I'm asking for too much. The trouble is I really don't know what to get! I think at first a .22lr and the 6.5x55 will do. You can get some pretty light weight varmint type bullets for the 6.5, so the others may not be needed?

 

Thats why ive gone for .223. I only intend on using factory ammo and fancy doing some target shooting down the club. Ive had the FEO round already and he's put it down for fox and vermin. Ive got 22lr and hmr already but find i use the 22lr a lot more but wouldnt be without hmr as its so handy for those longer shots.