Climate Change or Changing Climate

[discobob]

It has just popped up on the news that the UN is demanding that the date is brought forward from 2050 to 2040 for Net (Grosse?) Zero.....

[Scully]

1 hour ago, discobob said:

It has just popped up on the news that the UN is demanding that the date is brought forward from 2050 to 2040 for Net (Grosse?) Zero.....

It can demand all it wants;  none of the major ‘carbon footprint’ purveyors signed up for it, and there’s not a lot the UN can do to change that. 
They all made encouraging noises, but China, Russia, India and the USA are under no legal obligation to do anything, and all have stated they will do nothing to inhibit economic growth or even destabilise their economies, and certainly not at the cost of their citizens standard of living. 
Unlike the good old UK, which as one of the smallest contributors to a global carbon footprint, DOES have a legal obligation to do so….at any cost, using technology that hasn’t even been invented yet! 😀

[old man]

On 20/03/2023 at 15:09, Scully said:

It can demand all it wants;  none of the major ‘carbon footprint’ purveyors signed up for it, and there’s not a lot the UN can do to change that. 
They all made encouraging noises, but China, Russia, India and the USA are under no legal obligation to do anything, and all have stated they will do nothing to inhibit economic growth or even destabilise their economies, and certainly not at the cost of their citizens standard of living. 
Unlike the good old UK, which as one of the smallest contributors to a global carbon footprint, DOES have a legal obligation to do so….at any cost, using technology that hasn’t even been invented yet! 😀

Yep. Sums the gross stupidity of our ××××××× politicos brilliantly. Our economy goes down the pan at the expense of others as usual?

[discobob]

I came across this last night - very dystopian but I found it to be quite powerful... Covers in part Climate Change

 

[Rewulf]

39 minutes ago, discobob said:

I came across this last night - very dystopian but I found it to be quite powerful... Covers in part Climate Change

Very good.
The saddest thing is that there are many ,probably a majority, that think this sort of thing could never happen.

This is because they cant imagine the transition from where we are now, to this kind of future.
When the transition is gradual enough, probably measured more in decades than years, it becomes entirely possible.

[discobob]

49 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

The saddest thing is that there are many ,probably a majority, that think this sort of thing could never happen.

And that is exactly how it will happen - meanwhile the ones that do see it are labelled as conspiracy theorists (and get the tin foil thrown at them). There is that saying - what is the difference between conspiracy and fact - 6 months.....

I thought the UBI and CBDC was again something that people should pick up on.

[Rewulf]

43 minutes ago, amyjones329 said:

It is also worth noting that we are increasingly seeing extreme weather events happening more often.

Are we ?

What we are seeing , is that any 'extreme' weather event , be it heavy rainfall, an autumn storm , or an especially hot day, being labelled as extreme, closely followed by the blame for this being levelled at us for our hedonistic lifestyles, like driving to work , or putting the heating on !
The vegans blame us for eating meat, the politicians blame us for not having electric cars, and the climate activists blame us for merely existing.
They try to use this guilt culture to manipulate us into doing things we clearly arent capable of, and they seem incapable of doing themselves.
Not everyone can afford an electric car, are we supposed to walk instead.?
Children need to be kept warm and eat protein rich food, ie meat.
Are we supposed to feel guilty about this ?

This planet has been exposed to extreme weather since there were humans on it to remember, we created gods to ask for deliverance from it.
But we survived, and now we have to believe that we have created a situation where we have manipulated the weather to such a degree, that we are at risk of being destroyed by it.

Historically there have been violent storms, heatwaves , drought and famine, long before man started burning fossil fuels in earnest.
There is climate change , there always has been , did humans cause it ?
Are we even capable of doing so ?
Thats the real question.

[Penelope]

10 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Are we ?

What we are seeing , is that any 'extreme' weather event , be it heavy rainfall, an autumn storm , or an especially hot day, being labelled as extreme, closely followed by the blame for this being levelled at us for our hedonistic lifestyles, like driving to work , or putting the heating on !
The vegans blame us for eating meat, the politicians blame us for not having electric cars, and the climate activists blame us for merely existing.
They try to use this guilt culture to manipulate us into doing things we clearly arent capable of, and they seem incapable of doing themselves.
Not everyone can afford an electric car, are we supposed to walk instead.?
Children need to be kept warm and eat protein rich food, ie meat.
Are we supposed to feel guilty about this ?

This planet has been exposed to extreme weather since there were humans on it to remember, we created gods to ask for deliverance from it.
But we survived, and now we have to believe that we have created a situation where we have manipulated the weather to such a degree, that we are at risk of being destroyed by it.

Historically there have been violent storms, heatwaves , drought and famine, long before man started burning fossil fuels in earnest.
There is climate change , there always has been , did humans cause it ?
Are we even capable of doing so ?
Thats the real question.

Exactly! I cannot believe that there are so many gullible people out there, who suck up the CC mantra.

1 hour ago, amyjones329 said:

 

 

It is also worth noting that we are increasingly seeing extreme weather events happening more often. This could be due to an increase in the frequency of El Nino/La Nina-like patterns, or it could be due to global warming. It's hard to tell for sure without further research, but whatever the case might be, it's important that we take action now to reduce our carbon emissions and prevent further damage. 

 

One of the ways that we can do this is by using more sustainable sources of energy. This includes investing in renewable energy sources like solar and wind, as well as reducing our reliance on fossil fuels. We also need to start using more efficient methods for producing and distributing energy so that it doesn't get wasted. In addition to this, we need to do our part to reduce energy consumption by using more efficient appliances and lightbulbs, as well as making sure that all electronics are turned off or unplugged when not in use. Doing these things can help us reduce our carbon footprint and make a real difference in the fight against global warming. Solar panels , for example, can be installed on rooftops or other places that get a lot of sunlight, and they can generate enough energy to power an entire home. Wind turbines are also becoming increasingly popular as a source of renewable energy. By investing in these technologies and doing our part to reduce our consumption, we can help make sure that the planet stays healthy and our future is brighter.

There is still much more  to be done when it comes to protecting our environment, but we can all make a difference by starting with small steps. Together, our collective efforts can help create a more sustainable future for everyone. Thank you for taking the time to read this! 

 

 

 

Worth watching, Amy.

[Rewulf]

Heres another little snippet.
I was wondering once, how much volcanoes emit in CO2 ,this graph debunks volcanoes as being any meaningful carbon source, but it does show how much human based CO2 has been emitted in the last 100 years.
We have increased it by 1000% and yet global CO2 has gone from 0.03 to 0.04 % , Im surprised we can still breath with this massive increase.🤪

Discuss.

 

[Rewulf]

 

[discobob]

6 hours ago, amyjones329 said:

 

 

It is also worth noting that we are increasingly seeing extreme weather events happening more often. This could be due to an increase in the frequency of El Nino/La Nina-like patterns, or it could be due to global warming. It's hard to tell for sure without further research, but whatever the case might be, it's important that we take action now to reduce our carbon emissions and prevent further damage. 

 

One of the ways that we can do this is by using more sustainable sources of energy. This includes investing in renewable energy sources like solar and wind, as well as reducing our reliance on fossil fuels. We also need to start using more efficient methods for producing and distributing energy so that it doesn't get wasted. In addition to this, we need to do our part to reduce energy consumption by using more efficient appliances and lightbulbs, as well as making sure that all electronics are turned off or unplugged when not in use. Doing these things can help us reduce our carbon footprint and make a real difference in the fight against global warming.solar panels, for example, can be installed on rooftops or other places that get a lot of sunlight, and they can generate enough energy to power an entire home. Wind turbines are also becoming increasingly popular as a source of renewable energy. By investing in these technologies and doing our part to reduce our consumption, we can help make sure that the planet stays healthy and our future is brighter.

There is still much more  to be done when it comes to protecting our environment, but we can all make a difference by starting with small steps. Together, our collective efforts can help create a more sustainable future for everyone. Thank you for taking the time to read this! 

 

 

While I think that your post is hidden advertising (linking to ********* - and has been reported as such to admins), I will play along with you.(admin has removed the link, and removed the original post,welsh1)

Please can you justify your statements about increasing extreme weather events - with facts and figures that includes current times and also predating the mid 1800's (when measurement/recordings began)?

Can you also show a model that has successfully forecasted our current  "temperatures" (let's be generous - give or take 1 degree) even when plugged in with actual historical measurements?

I suggest that you also go and watch the channel  https://www.youtube.com/@HeartlandInstitute

These are predominantly a bunch of scientists who are not beholden to grant money. There has been some slander about they are funded by petrochemical companies - they have done a video on that as well. It is always an idea when you see a climate scientist (hint - this isn't a real classification) banging on about Climate Change/Global Warmin/Boiling Seas to identify where his grant money came from.

I have said before - Al Gore (an inconvenient truth guy) has been one of the most successful salesmen in history.

You may also like to look at Climate Discussion Nexus....

[oowee]

A July 2011 Nature editorial points out the group's lack of credibility:

"Despite criticizing climate scientists for being overconfident about their data, models and theories, the Heartland Institute proclaims a conspicuous confidence in single studies and grand interpretations....makes many bold assertions that are often questionable or misleading.... Many climate sceptics seem to review scientific data and studies not as scientists but as attorneys, magnifying doubts and treating incomplete explanations as falsehoods rather than signs of progress towards the truth. ... The Heartland Institute and its ilk are not trying to build a theory of anything. They have set the bar much lower, and are happy muddying the waters."^[1]

 

The campaign to undermine public trust in climate science has been described as a "denial machine" organized by industrial, political and ideological interests, and supported by conservative media and skeptical bloggers to manufacture uncertainty about global warming. The politics of global warming have been affected by climate change denial and the political global warming controversy, undermining the efforts to act on climate change or adapting to the warming climate. Those promoting denial commonly use rhetorical tactics to give the appearance of a scientific controversy where there is none.

Scholarly Encyclopedia.

[Rewulf]

52 minutes ago, oowee said:

The campaign to undermine public trust in climate science has been described as a "denial machine" organized by industrial, political and ideological interests, and supported by conservative media and skeptical bloggers to manufacture uncertainty about global warming. The politics of global warming have been affected by climate change denial and the political global warming controversy, undermining the efforts to act on climate change or adapting to the warming climate. Those promoting denial commonly use rhetorical tactics to give the appearance of a scientific controversy where there is none.

Scholarly Encyclopedia.

Is there no uncertainty ?
I seem to remember the great 'Global warming' debates of the 90s which came after the 'New ice age ' theories of the 70s.
In fact there was a time when the trend, and the mass sea level rises predicted for the 00s (that never happened) made the global warming moniker go away for a while, and replaced with 'climate change'
These days, you can take your pick, and the moral stand point is 'We need to do something about it !' But what ?

Well the baddie in this apocalyptic scenario is carbon.
This brings to mind black, or graphite style elements , or in the mind of students...oil and coal.

But this isnt what the scientists are talking about, they are referring to CO2, a gas essential to plant life, and a balance between flora and fauna that has taken a billion years to get right.
Apparently , this balance ,due to humans, is now so far out of kilter, that the planet is heating up , the ice caps are melting , and civilisation as we know it , will be no more, unless..... we all buy EVs, switch the heating off (if you can still afford heating) and start eating insects, and plant based meat food (that looks like meat)

This horrific rise in CO2 of around 30 % over the last 100 years has given rise to the unreal temperature increase of 1 degree C , an average of about +3 % over seasonal shift.
This is the climate emergency. This is why world leaders have to take private jets and motorcades to far flung corners of the world to discuss it.
This is why an autistic Swedish schoolgirl believes she has the right to point her finger at you for your failings.
This is why we have created a state of paranoia for our children.
This is why we are being taxed into poverty, creating a new underclass that will not be able to afford to drive , take a foreign holiday, or eat a nice meal.

1 degree centigrade over 100 years and a millimetre of sea level rise per year.
Looking at the scary hockey stick graph (debunked in some circles) its just surprising we dont look outside and see waves lapping up against our doors.

 

[oowee]

Of course there is uncertainty as there is with any emerging science. There is also a large degree of consensus. 

A key point of the special report is there is no single 1.5-degree warmer world.

The impacts of climate change haven’t been spread evenly around our planet and they won’t be in the future, either. Temperatures increase at different speeds everywhere, with warming generally higher over land areas than oceans. The strongest warming is happening in the Arctic during its cool seasons, and in Earth’s mid-latitude regions during the warm season.

Most land regions will see more hot days, especially in the tropics. At 1.5 degrees Celsius warming, about 14 percent of Earth’s population will be exposed to severe heatwaves at least once every five years, while at 2 degrees warming that number jumps to 37 percent. Extreme heatwaves will become widespread at 1.5 degrees Celsius warming.

NASA 2019 

Tackling climate change is one thing but how do we cope with the impact on population shifts as countries become uninhabitable?

Edited May 25, 2023 by oowee

[Rewulf]

11 minutes ago, oowee said:

Tackling climate change is one thing but how do we cope with the impact on population shifts as countries become uninhabitable?

Most of the people subjected to these heat increases already live in places we would call uninhabitable.
Sub Saharan Africa is home to them , Saudi Arabia and India already have baking hot temperatures, and have done for 1000s of years, they survived, and in some cases thrived.
They wont be shifting because it got a bit hotter , theyll move because they want to be richer, and thats a moral question we have to contend with , and its starting to happen already.
Do we become poorer and less secure so they can be better off ?

Nations have been repelling those who would move to take their more fertile land for 10,000 years, it isnt going to stop now.
On a side note , if the temperatures really do go up significantly , there are vast tracts of land in Canada and Russia that could benefit from it , plenty of land there for them to go, although I reckon the populace of those countries might be a bit more 'robust' in defending that land , than we have been in the UK.

[Westward]

29 minutes ago, oowee said:

Of course there is uncertainty as there is with any emerging science. There is also a large degree of consensus. 

The underlying problem is that the "emerging science" is all about predicting the effects of climate change, all of which is predicated on the assumption that it's caused by man made CO2 emissions.

Not only is there no scientific proof or any other kind of certainty that CO2 is to blame but no one has yet been able to demonstrate that the greenhouse gas effect is actually real. What is certain is that the very high temperatures of the late 19th Century until the 1920s (at least as hot as 2023) and the medieval warming period (hotter than 2023) which enabled agriculture to happen in Greenland were most definitely not caused by CO2 emissions.

A lot of scientists are doing very nicely out of the $1 billion per day being spent around the world studying ways to capture CO2 or reduce emissions and they're not ging to kill the goose that keeps on laying their personal golden eggs by pointing out that no one has yet proved that CO2 emissions are to blame.

[discobob]

2 hours ago, oowee said:

"Despite criticizing climate scientists for being overconfident about their data, models and theories, the Heartland Institute proclaims a conspicuous confidence in single studies and grand interpretations....makes many bold assertions that are often questionable or misleading.... Many climate sceptics seem to review scientific data and studies not as scientists but as attorneys, magnifying doubts and treating incomplete explanations as falsehoods rather than signs of progress towards the truth. ... The Heartland Institute and its ilk are not trying to build a theory of anything. They have set the bar much lower, and are happy muddying the waters."^[1]

These are people who have been highly regarded in their fields over the years - but are not beholden to the Grant System where there is money being thrown about to come up with studies that support the "homo sapien is bad" mantra that organisations like the UN/WEF/Bilderberg can throw about. There is a right little rats nest out there that if you go and look at it it will surprise you who is funding who.

Question - why are our police defending Just Stop Oil (and their predecessors) on our streets but yet are willing to arrest and lock people up before they have even done anything (and that anything had been agreed with the police during meetings prior to the Coronation) for quite a number of hours? Again, it would be interested in how these get funded? Could it be that they are actually false flag operations that are meant to distract us, wish for strong action to be done by the government to make protests illegal? Remember the old adage - remember what you wish for because you just might get it!! And bingo - our right to protest has been removed and one more step towards an Orwellian state - and when there are things that do need to be protested about - we can't because the police will be there with their facial recognition cameras and you will receive a knock on the door and lose everything.

[oowee]

1 minute ago, discobob said:

remember what you wish for because you just might get it!! And bingo - our right to protest has been removed and one more step towards an Orwellian state - and when there are things that do need to be protested about - we can't because the police will be there with their facial recognition cameras and you will receive a knock on the door and lose everything.

Thats what a vote for the Tories and Brexit gets you.

[discobob]

35 minutes ago, oowee said:

Thats what a vote for the Tories and Brexit gets you.

usual bolt hole I see?? 

[sutty2006]

19 minutes ago, discobob said:

usual bolt hole I see?? 

Yup. 
 

It rained on Sunday, better blame it on the Tories and brexit 🙄🤣

 

unfortunately what we are being forced to do to irradicate CO2 is being counterbalanced by other, more larger, countries not giving a hoot. We are punished by “the greater good” for no reason at all. 
 

yes. Temperatures are going up slowly…. But the planet does that regardless. Things change and we adapt to it. I prefer it warmer anyway. 

[oowee]

27 minutes ago, discobob said:

usual bolt hole I see?? 

No doubt. Voter control and id, workers restrictions, right to strike, rights to protest curtailed under this government.  EU higher court appeals against over reaching government and infringement of rights, removed through Brexit. Next exit from ECHR protocols. It's standard right wing control and enforcement agenda. 

What next? Control of the press? 

[Rewulf]

2 hours ago, oowee said:

It's standard right wing control and enforcement agenda

Historically, left wing control has always been far more draconian. 

Again, be careful what you wish for. 

[discobob]

3 hours ago, oowee said:

What next? Control of the press? 

Already happening

we won’t be ditching ECHR, in fact the government is in the process of signing over our forces to the EU - no press about that is there??

Also, signing away our sovereignty to WHO who is non-elected and us massively funded by the Gates foundation and also China which will give them sweeping powers

[old man]

All bull dung in my humble opinion.

We are being pushed about at political will to increase control for the few.

Interestingly AI may well be the final straw when the criminal elements take over?

Sadly, glad to be old.

[discobob]

Well, the mods have earned their porridge today - the original post that brought this thread back to life has been removed

quite blatantly put up for advertising.....