Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 I'm just starting my latest restoration and thought it may be interesting to see if any of you knowledgeable chaps can spot what it is. I'll post a series of picture clues and offer a box of Imperial Game as a prize to anyone who cares to collect them. The feature of the clues is mainly the painstaking attention to detail the maker took to stamp the serial number on virtually every moving part. Now, the first few clues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 (edited) Wrong guess. Edited December 23, 2023 by Gordon R Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 I think it is Continental, so likely Spanish - reason - hinged front trigger. It's a non ejector (no kickers in the forend) but has the remains of engine turning. Presumably the serial number is in fact the 63522 seen on the forend iron. That suggests a maker with a high output. I have not seen engine turning on an AyA, but I think a Union Armeria (Grulla) I once owned may have been engine turned. That's my guess - but I have little confidence in it being correct. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 Here are a couple more images. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 could you post the bit with the name on please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 The part with the name on it is not far away !! In the meantime though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 And some more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 And finally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 Pre-war Beretta? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 hello,Finito sounds Italian , i would suggest a Gunmaker S Marco , Brescia Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 34 minutes ago, London Best said: Pre-war Beretta? That's it !! A 1937 Beretta, still full choke in both barrels, 70mm chambers and very good barrels . Its a gun with some history as most private guns at that time were confiscated by the State and only the wealthy/ people with influence could hang on to them. How it got here, still with legitimate proof marks is something to look into. Collect your prize at any time. Happy Christmas !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oldypigeonpopper Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 3 minutes ago, Velocette said: That's it !! A 1937 Beretta, still full choke in both barrels, 70mm chambers and very good barrels . Its a gun with some history as most private guns at that time were confiscated by the State and only the wealthy/ people with influence could hang on to them. How it got here, still with legitimate proof marks is something to look into. Collect your prize at any time. Happy Christmas !! Well done LB 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 will you post up this Brretta rebuild thread please Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 Yes, I'm going to go through the insides and make sure that everything is working as it should. Its a couple of thou' off the face but as it has a simple parallel hinge pin secured by a small screw, making a new, larger one and reaming the hole out should be straightforward. I'll put some more pictures up to illustrate this. The top lever is well over so some metal needs adding to the bites or possibly the bolt depending on the wear. Its got a Greener type cross bolt, round in cross section through the rib extension but square where it exits the action body together with a "hidden bite" at its top edge which may complicate deciding on which area of wear to attend to first. None of it is really bad. One thing I did notice during a brief look inside was the one piece tumblers seem to have a separate "firing pin" fitted into them, possibly brazed, which may be replaceable should the need arise. All in all, plenty to do until the next one turns up . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, Velocette said: That's it !! A 1937 Beretta, still full choke in both barrels, 70mm chambers and very good barrels . Its a gun with some history as most private guns at that time were confiscated by the State and only the wealthy/ people with influence could hang on to them. How it got here, still with legitimate proof marks is something to look into. Collect your prize at any time. Happy Christmas !! Sometimes I even amaze myself! Vary interesting thread/project. Happy to donate my prize back to yourself..........providing you promise to fire them all at game through that very gun. Thank you. And a Very Happy Christmas to you too. Edited December 23, 2023 by London Best Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 59 minutes ago, Velocette said: Yes, I'm going to go through the insides and make sure that everything is working as it should. Its a couple of thou' off the face but as it has a simple parallel hinge pin secured by a small screw, making a new, larger one and reaming the hole out should be straightforward. I'll put some more pictures up to illustrate this. The top lever is well over so some metal needs adding to the bites or possibly the bolt depending on the wear. Its got a Greener type cross bolt, round in cross section through the rib extension but square where it exits the action body together with a "hidden bite" at its top edge which may complicate deciding on which area of wear to attend to first. None of it is really bad. One thing I did notice during a brief look inside was the one piece tumblers seem to have a separate "firing pin" fitted into them, possibly brazed, which may be replaceable should the need arise. All in all, plenty to do until the next one turns up . cant you just turn the hinge pin 180deg.....or (looking at the retaining screw it might have already been turned)..!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 I did look at the monogram on the top lever. I should have recognised PB as being Pietro Beretta. I was racking my brain for Pedro ???? - as I had it in my mind it was Spanish! I believe Beretta are 'the oldest' gunmakers still in the family? - or possibly the oldest gunmakers still in business? A nice find as Beretta used to make some very sound guns. (Some of) the modern ones I have seen have been very 'unremarkable'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 15 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: A nice find as Beretta used to make some very sound guns. (Some of) the modern ones I have seen have been very 'unremarkable'. Accountants catering for the mass market. 34 minutes ago, ditchman said: cant you just turn the hinge pin 180deg Did you used to be a builder? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 1 hour ago, London Best said: Accountants catering for the mass market. Did you used to be a builder? isnt that what is the normal thing to do ?..........i bow to your superior knowledge......give me a good elucitating please....the engraved ends of the hinge pin would lend themselves to turning and no need to re-engrave surley ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 23 minutes ago, ditchman said: the engraved ends of the hinge pin would lend themselves to turning and no need to re-engrave surley ? On many guns (e.g. many AyAs), the large 'screws' you can see are not the actual pin, but a cap. The pin is a replaceable part underneath. See the exploded diagrams here; https://twchambers.co.uk/firearm-spares/shotgun-spares/shotgun-spares-by-make/aya/ Part 907 is the cap and part 988 is the pin. Photo is from site above and is an AyA No 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 7 minutes ago, JohnfromUK said: On many guns (e.g. many AyAs), the large 'screws' you can see are not the actual pin, but a cap. The pin is a replaceable part underneath. See the exploded diagrams here; https://twchambers.co.uk/firearm-spares/shotgun-spares/shotgun-spares-by-make/aya/ Part 907 is the cap and part 988 is the pin. Photo is from site above and is an AyA No 1 Thankyou for that.................i see excactly what needs to be done now... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnfromUK Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 36 minutes ago, ditchman said: Thankyou for that.................i see excactly what needs to be done now... The Beretta may not be done that way, but that way is used on AyAs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
McSpredder Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 3 hours ago, ditchman said: cant you just turn the hinge pin 180deg.....or (looking at the retaining screw it might have already been turned)..!! 2 hours ago, London Best said: Did you used to be a builder? I suspect he might have some experience of maintaining crawler tractors or tracked excavators. Turning the track pins on those seems to work pretty OK, and they stand up to quite harsh treatment. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ditchman Posted December 23, 2023 Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 6 minutes ago, McSpredder said: I suspect he might have some experience of maintaining crawler tractors or tracked excavators. Turning the track pins on those seems to work pretty OK, and they stand up to quite harsh treatment. im naught but a modern day tinker..as ive always said in my posts of years gone by Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted December 23, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 23, 2023 Rotating the hinge pin is something I have done with early Baikal's but they use a roll pin to secure it which can be driven out from within. This Beretta has a hinge pin which is secured with a small screw into a blind ,threaded orifice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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