BASC January 2024 podcast - voluntary move away from lead shot for live quarry shooting

[holloway]

20 minutes ago, Konor said:

If you read through my posts they are actually mentioned a few times

I have asked him the same question but he will not give a straight answer just tells you to read the whole thread , same as he accuses Conor of really ,simple question but he refuses to answer 🤣

[Konor]

41 minutes ago, jall25 said:

 

Honestly i have tried but they are just swamped

Honestly im not trying to wind you up - can you not just ask them in 1 or 2  lines ?

 

Of course jall25

my questions were

was BASC prepared to negotiate for concessions for 

a     the use of vintage guns such as Damascus barrelled guns and short chambered small bore shotguns 

b     the use of lead over ground that would be shot minimally such as walked up shooting where comparatively little lead is deposited onto the environment 

in both cases the amount of lead deposited would be low and would minimise the risk to flora and fauna  much like a concession was deemed possible for the use of air guns on quarry due to the minimal depositing of lead and was also used as an argument by Norwegian hunters to return to using lead. 
The above concessions would create a niche for those vintage guns enabling their continued use while also protecting what should be considered a valuable resource for future generations to enjoy and at the same time those concessions would result in minimal consequential damage to the environment.

 Those were my main concerns which were largely ignored and not addressed by the responses I received.

Edited January 19, 2024 by Konor

[Konor]

6 hours ago, holloway said:

I have asked him the same question but he will not give a straight answer just tells you to read the whole thread , same as he accuses Conor of really ,simple question but he refuses to answer 🤣

I have put down those exact details on a few posts Holloway if you look back they are easily found. I posted them again for jall25s convenience 

 

 

9 hours ago, Konor said:

have read the document you refer to a few times , there was no information regarding any concessions for the use of old vintage shotguns or the use of lead over areas where circumstance dictated that few shots would be fired hence little lead deposited akin to the example I cited as being accepted in Norway as the grounds for going back to using lead shot. These are both questions I asked very early in this thread and were not answered by the document you referred to.

 

On 19/01/2024 at 00:47, Konor said:

That there has been no evidence of attempts to negotiate concessions to allow the continued use of lead in vintage guns especially short chambered small bores or Damascus barrelled shotguns is evidence of a lack of commitment to ensure the protection of our shooting heritage.

That there has been no move to create concessions for the continued use of lead shot over ground infrequently shot over by low cartridge usage walked up shooting as has been the case in Norway and similar to the acceptance of air gun shooting of quarry with lead pellets is further proof that not much imagination has gone into finding a compromise that minimises risk rather than eliminates it.

 

Edited January 20, 2024 by Konor

[Konor]

15 hours ago, Konor said:

thrust of what I am saying is that despite all the expertise at BASC’s disposal and despite all the time that has been available to tackle the problem of lead ammunition use here we are far down the five year voluntary ban road and little effort has been made to propose compromise that would see the main concern of tons of lead deposited in small areas dealt with while allowing the use of lead in circumstances that would see comparatively little lead spread over a wide area and as a consequence create a niche for all those old short chambered vintage weapons unsuited to the use of steel shot.

 

23 hours ago, Konor said:

That there has been no move to create concessions for the continued use of lead shot over ground infrequently shot over by low cartridge usage walked up shooting as has been the case in Norway and similar to the acceptance of air gun shooting of quarry with lead pellets is further proof that not much imagination has gone into finding a compromise that minimises risk rather than eliminates it.

 

11 hours ago, Konor said:

The fight for the widespread ability to continue to enjoy using vintage guns is more important than your hurt feelings about how you are being criticised and you should be working to incorporate those proposals mentioned into your agenda rather than wasting your time on circular arguments which I think we can both agree are largely a waste of time.

 

[Konor]

1 hour ago, holloway said:

I have asked him the same question but he will not give a straight answer just tells you to read the whole thread , same as he accuses Conor of really ,simple question but he refuses to answer 🤣

The above posts I have quoted and incidentally only go back to page 6 clearly shows the questions I have asked on multiple occasions. They refute your statement above Holloway. I’m surprised you were not able to find them as there is at least one on each page.

Conor has yet to answer those questions directly and has made two false statements one of which he has apologised for and the other I’m still waiting for an apology.

if you look through the thread you will see I have spent as much time explaining that I believe private phone calls are not the way to deal with questions raised on a public forum and also asking for clarification on how BASC can call for a voluntary ban on lead shot and then insist it is against any further restrictions on the use of lead shot and maintain credibility.

I guess the question now is why you should post the comments regarding my inability to give a straight answer when clearly that is not the case and that the contributor most guilty of that is Conor OGorman

Edited January 20, 2024 by Konor

[Konor]

On 16/01/2024 at 13:12, holloway said:

Decoying birds into range ????  what on earth are you talking about ? thats a very small part of wildfowling .

 

On 16/01/2024 at 13:50, Konor said:

I was referring to the folk that Graham h referred to who were using steel in 20 bores to decoy wood pigeon perhaps if you had taken the time to read the posts fully you would have been aware of the context.
Having wildfowled on the Solway for 50 years and never decoyed I’m experienced enough to not need any guidance on the subject of basic wildfowling practice. 

Could this interaction shed some light on your previous post from 1 hour ago questioning my ability to give a straight answer

Edited January 20, 2024 by Konor
Addition

[Konor]

On 03/01/2024 at 23:29, holloway said:

To be fair most of us lost interest ages ago as we can make our own minds up .

 

On 03/01/2024 at 23:49, Konor said:

Then it may help the minority who haven’t 

Or perhaps this interaction

Edited January 20, 2024 by Konor

[Konor]

1 hour ago, holloway said:

I have asked him the same question but he will not give a straight answer just tells you to read the whole thread , same as he accuses Conor of really ,simple question but he refuses to answer 🤣

I have looked through all the  posts in this thread but am unable to find one from yourself asking the question referred to above could you perhaps let me know the page it is on. I also can’t recall ever writing a reply that asks you to read the whole thread for an answer to your question could you please clarify this for me any help would be most welcome

[Konor]

1 hour ago, holloway said:

I have asked him the same question but he will not give a straight answer just tells you to read the whole thread , same as he accuses Conor of really ,simple question but he refuses to answer 🤣

I have counted 5 posts that you have contributed to this thread and none of those mentions asking me a question as detailed in your last post. Could you explain why this might be as it seems strange that I can’t remember that post and even stranger that I can’t find it. Any help to clarify would be appreciated 😂

[shaun4860]

3 hours ago, grahamch said:

 

Maybe the moderators or admin need to intervene?

 

 

We have when required.

I personally don’t see the need to close the thread 🤷🏻‍♂️

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Simple really, Dr O'Gorman just needs to answer the questions he has been repeatedly asked.

[Konor]

10 hours ago, holloway said:

I have asked him the same question but he will not give a straight answer just tells you to read the whole thread , same as he accuses Conor of really ,simple question but he refuses to answer 🤣

I can find no record of any such post from yourself or the reply you claim I make.

I did manage to find in another thread however which has now been locked

the

BASC Response to to HSEb Lead Ammunition Consultation

Page 5

where you state that you can’t be bothered reading through the thread and I answer with a few paragraphs to give you a summary. Your next post thanks me.

It seems odd that we have an example of the exact opposite of what you have accused me of.

 I tracked this information down using the activity section on your profile

Oddly enough on your activity section there is no record of the post that you claim you made in the quote at the top of this post. 
Do you have any insight that would explain these bizarre occurrences. 
Could it be that the posts you have referred to have been deleted by the mods and I just have a bad memory.

perhaps the moderators can check all posts including those deleted and shed some light on this odd set of circumstances.

 

 

Edited January 20, 2024 by Konor

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Curiouser and curiouser.................................

[London Best]

1 hour ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Curiouser and curiouser.................................

Tediouser and tediouser. (sic)

[Konor]

5 minutes ago, London Best said:

Tediouser and tediouser. (sic)

Don't read it then. I tend to defend myself when wrongly accused. Do you? 

[London Best]

Just now, Konor said:

Don't read it then. I tend to defend myself when wrongly accused. Do you? 

Oh, I defend myself. 
But I refuse to get into internet arguments.

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 hour ago, London Best said:

Oh, I defend myself. 
But I refuse to get into internet arguments.

No you don't.............

[Konor]

17 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

No you don't.............

🤣

[wymberley]

"He's behind you!"

[Konor]

9 minutes ago, wymberley said:

"He's behind you!"

They all are 

It seems like a queue is forming

[Scully]

4 hours ago, Konor said:

I can find no record of any such post from yourself or the reply you claim I make.

I did manage to find in another thread however which has now been locked

the

BASC Response to to HSEb Lead Ammunition Consultation

Page 5

where you state that you can’t be bothered reading through the thread and I answer with a few paragraphs to give you a summary. Your next post thanks me.

It seems odd that we have an example of the exact opposite of what you have accused me of.

 I tracked this information down using the activity section on your profile

Oddly enough on your activity section there is no record of the post that you claim you made in the quote at the top of this post. 
Do you have any insight that would explain these bizarre occurrences. 
Could it be that the posts you have referred to have been deleted by the mods and I just have a bad memory.

perhaps the moderators can check all posts including those deleted and shed some light on this odd set of circumstances.

 

 

Oooops! What a tangled web we weave…..🙂

[Konor]

5 minutes ago, Scully said:

Oooops! What a tangled web we weave…..🙂

To be honest I think the simple explanation is that Holloway has got me mixed up with another poster so no drama, it's hard to keep track on long threads such as this. No hard feelings we're all on the same side 👍

[TIGHTCHOKE]

1 minute ago, Konor said:

To be honest I think the simple explanation is that Holloway has got me mixed up with another poster so no drama, it's hard to keep track on long threads such as this. No hard feelings we're all on the same side 👍

But are we?     

[Konor]

2 minutes ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

But are we?     

Is that a match I see in your hand TC 🤣

[TIGHTCHOKE]

"There are NONE so BLIND as those that CANNOT SEE".

 

I really do despair, we who question are seen as the trouble makers and the small band of BASC Defenders repeatedly wish to close threads and silence open debate.