barrie0 Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 Watching the russian siege unfolding at the moment ,has the world gone mad , to do these things to small children sickens and disgusts me . I have to admit to having a tear in my eye at the thought off how brutal people can be . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 Yes it is very distressing Barrie. Those Chechen rebels are ruthlessly fanatical.. Women & Children are treated just the same... How can they have been treated so badly by the Russians in their conflict for independance that their women folk would want to blow themselves up and take as many Russians with them as they can... its beyond me... I am afraid the eastern Block is now suffering, and will do so for many years, the back lash of an opressive communist regime which has lasted for almost 100 years. As their public get to realise the wealth and material possessions of the west which has been denied to them for so many years, so they will want a slice of that cake. China now is evolving after many years of similar oppression and I dare say the same thing will happen in regionalised China unless the Government can nip it in the bud. God help us all if and when half a billion chinese drivers run short of petrol and their equivilent of George W. Bush goes looking for new supplies to keep them happy. FM. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTMS Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 What worries me as it says in the bible: "There will be three great wars and the yellow man shall rule overall" Sick people sick minds Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gamebag Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 The chechens are doing it simply because they want to be free of the tyrannie of the russians they were under the boot heel for so long they just want what every 1 wants freedom from oppression BTMS its the russians that will be in the **** if the chinese go on the rampage for oil as they are the closest with a sizable amount of oil Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 "There will be three great wars and the yellow man shall rule overall" The yellow army is often compared by some Military men to Ants.. And I think a former US president once said " Try stamping on an Ants nest " Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozo Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 yea i was watching it aswell, it made me sick but more angry than anything, if the russians wernt so dam proud and they let the sas(best and most well trained counter-terrorisim regiment in the world) take control of the situation maybe it wouldnt of been so bad, look @ the iranian embassy for example. from wat i have heard the spetsnaz have mucked the whole operation up and they think around 13 of 18 of the terrorists escaped, although its still too early to be sure, as for china id be more worried about korea( another vietnam??) and i reckon that will start the a full scale world war off. Ozo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 i think talk of a world war is a bit over the top (just my opinion). there has been conflict in that area for centuries and no power wants to bring about the detruction of mankind. i too watched with bated breath,shocked that anyone can think the answer to any problem is by attacking children.adults know about the way the world works,kids are kids.no cause,ever,can justify what those animals did and be they muslim,christian or whatever they will be judged. my girls are eight and four,my heart goes out to the parents in russia. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aled_cky Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 im watching the program on it now, it is absolutely disgusting. have they captured the school back yet? i can't tell. on a different note.. theres some tidy women on there only seen a few though:( - not hostages, the family Aled Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 just put my kids to bed after explaining why i had tears rolling down my cheeks.my answers to them were quite pathetic,i dont want them to know what a **** world i have brought them into.i held them as never before,because i could and i will be able to do so today,tomorrow and for as long as i can. i have nothing in common with the russian parents other than the fact that i am a father and thats enough. vanessa redgrave ? hang your head in shame,their blood is on your hands. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cranfield Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 Vanessa Redgrave ? What has she got to do with the siege ? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 she has been an apologist for the chechen cause for a considerable time and was interviewed on bbc1 tonight.she had the gall to try and justify what happened by comparing it to the destruction of grozny (sp ?).she laid the blame not at terrorists feet but at putins.a case of my sympathies BUT.truly sickening. i am no polotician,no historian of eastern history but you cannot defend the in-defensable. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aled_cky Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 never heard of her, sounds like a nutcase. Cletch No4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hammergun Posted September 3, 2004 Report Share Posted September 3, 2004 Whosever uses such terrorist tactics is beneath contempt, as is anyone who sympathises with them. Remember those who do this to innocent people who have no involvement with them are terrorists. They are truly evil people and must be treated as such. Such actions can only strengthen the resolve of those who are fighting terrorism. I am sure that many of those who once supported the Chechen separatists will also be disgusted with these actions and try to distance themselves from this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Antipodean Posted September 4, 2004 Report Share Posted September 4, 2004 i Like you Hammergun once had a little bit of sympathy for the Chechens. Never knowing what REALLY happened at the hands of the russian military. But taking women and children hostage on the first day of a new school year is really beyond comprehention. The rebels would know full well that the Russian army being what it is would mount a rescue attempt and hundreds of lives would be lost. Not caring whether they {the rebels} died or not but willing to take out young innocent lives for their "just cause" makes my blood boil. It is a shame they didnt ask for SAS help Im sure they would have done a much better job without any escapees to plot again. Im just glad i dont live in Chechnia because im sure its going to get very warm over there when Mr Putin has finished. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Antipodean Posted September 4, 2004 Report Share Posted September 4, 2004 Having just read your post again Hammergun i apologise for saying you had sympathy for the chechens i read it wrong Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ozo Posted September 5, 2004 Report Share Posted September 5, 2004 while we are on the subject of terrorism, i found this yesterday on 9/11 @ the pentagon, makes it look like a setup. pentagon 9/11 p.s takes a while to load, maybe 5 mins, but its well worth watching. Ozo Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
red_stag88 Posted September 6, 2004 Report Share Posted September 6, 2004 The Chechens are not brave enough to fight out in the open, yet they are so dirty and underhand to kill children. This event will only serve to infuritate the Russians and give the world a reson for them to continue to occupy Chechnia. At one point th Chechens had some symithisers but now they have perverted their course. I respect the dirt on my shoes more then them. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Mr Pieman Posted September 6, 2004 Report Share Posted September 6, 2004 There is little doubt that the recent events in Russia have shocked and sickened almost the entire populus of the planet. The loss of ANY life is bad, but the young and such high numbers seem to make the pain that much worse Chechnya has been a killing ground for the Soviet forces for around 10 years now and the Chechens are, undoubtedly, a nation that has been raped, pilliged and brutalised. Many, many have been killed in cold blood, many more than have died in the school siege. None of this makes the murder at the school in any way justified We must make sure we don't 'paint a nation' through the actions of a few. The vast majority of Chechens will be appalled by this atrocity-they are human after all. The actions of a few have tainted the world's opinion of a nation, which is both unjust and unfair. It would be the same as calling all Irishmen terrorists and butchers because of the actions of the few that make up the IRA. As for the actions of the Russian army, what else could they have done? It seems the whole event kicked off when a number of students made a run for it and were shot at by the hostage-takers. The soldiers tried to lay down supressive fire to help them escape and the baddies thought it was an attack and started blowing things up and, as they say, the rest is history. One of the fleeing students had 45 bullet holes in her back. What do we suggest (from our armchairs) that the soldiers had done? Let the children be slaughtered as they fled? Of course not, they were doing the best they possibly could. As for the SAS, not a hope of storming the place. A vast cavern with only one way in - it was a school gym - and the whole place mined and armed with bombs. Not just bombs, but people who were ready to die for their cause. The Iranian Embassy siege was a stroll in the park in comparison. Regardless of how good we think the SAS are, how would they select a target from among 1500 people and kill them all before the bombs went off? Unfortunately, this was the only outcome that was ever going to occur. No negotiation dialogue ever took place. This was a statement of power by the terrorists that no matter where the Russian people felt safe, they should now feel very afraid. It is that fear they hope will sway the Russian people to pressure their polititians to cut Chechnya free. Some people accuse Russia of trying to maintain a decaying empire and to let Chechnya go. As a British subject I'd never agreed to that happening with Northern Ireland and suspect most Russians (those with an opinion) would feel he same. However, I feel Russia will now either become politically unstable with the removal of Putin, or the Red Hand will inflict pain and suffering on the Chechen people like never before experienced. The 'eye for an eye' concept has never sat comfortably with me. The most frightening thing is, no matter where we live in the world, people can reach out into our lives and cause our families and friends suffering and pain that, until recently, was unimaginable :thumbs: If the 'terrorist' is determined and clever enough, he can strike wherever he wants and whenever he wants. SAS won't save us, bombing the **** out of Iraq, Afganistan etc won't help either. And what's really sad is I know what won't fix things, but have no idea what will :( :( Care for your loved ones and try to teach our future - the children - that the world we pass to them is not in good order but they can correct our mistakes and make the world a better, safer place. PP Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lurcherboy Posted September 6, 2004 Report Share Posted September 6, 2004 Nice to have you back Pieman. Will be doing my DSC level 1 thanks to you and the disc. I was going to post a scoreline, in fact I will. Russia 100,000+, Chechyna 500+. Pick the bones out of that. LB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the last engineer Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 just read your comments mr pieman ,i must have to agree that the russian army had no choice than to go in ,a very sad day for the world . to quote you if i may "The most frightening thing is, no matter where we live in the world, people can reach out into our lives and cause our families and friends suffering and pain that, until recently, was unimaginable " its a very scary world we bring children into ,as a father of two boys, it frightens me to think of whats next . martin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fisherman Mike Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 Me too Martin, My 10 year old son watched the seige unfold and I couldnt give him the answers he wanted. This world and some of the people in it are very evil at times, Thank God we live in a reasonable Democracy. FM Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dazza Posted September 10, 2004 Report Share Posted September 10, 2004 Terrorism is awful no matter where it happens, my Uncle and Cousin where in the Security Forces and both blown to bits by the IRA. :yp: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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