MPT1 Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi, In the fantastic BASC Mag. There is an article about restrictions on lead shot. I believe if there is a viable alternative that helps conservation it should be used. Well there is also a more than viable alternative to lead pellets. What is it you ask? Right I'll tell you then. DYNAMIC AIR PELLETS, they're made in every calibre, different weights to suit springers or PCPs . They are made from an alloy which according to today's scientific research sre totally non-toxic. They are more finely engineered than lead type and the tails don't get scrunched up. What do you think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
henry d Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi,In the fantastic BASC Mag. There is an article about restrictions on lead shot. I believe if there is a viable alternative that helps conservation it should be used........... .......What do you think? Sounds like an advert Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BSA-airgunner Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Sounds like an advert and of corse there more expencive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlaserF3 Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Probably a load of ****, if we lose lead, shooting will never be the same again. Only lead has the density we need, all the other substitutes are far too light. I must agree that you do sound like an advertisement. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alpha Mule Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Would these be the Promethius jobbies? FYI they don't work at all in my Airmagnum. The tips get poked out leaving the plastic waist still in the magazine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huntercarbine Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 i'm pretty sure all the lead substitute pellets are nowhere near as accurate because of their light weight and density. a lot of companies have manufactured them specifically with increasing the flight speed in mind but every review i have read states that accuracy is affected, in some cases dramatically. usefull if you have permission to shoot where lead poisoning is a concern though, although everything i shoot dies of lead poisoning Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 I've used the Logun version of these Defiants in various guns and have found two significant problems with them; Firstly they are nowhere near as accurate as my diablo pellets such as AA Fields and JSB Exacts, and there was a problem with 'flyers'. About one on five went way off target. I tried them in four guns, three .22s and a Weihrauch HW100 in .177 and two of the guns definitely had clean barrels as they were virtually new. This is reflected by comments on the Defiant pellets web site. In fact that site does little to recommend these pellets. Secondly, they are simply too hard. They penetrate the target and go straight through wood pigeons and squirrels leaving them to escape and bled to death somewhere else. In the spring I went 'branching' - shooting the young rooks. I used four pellets in a side by side test as the targets were all the same species, age and roughly the same distance and height. These pellets fared the worst by far as regards clean killing. Granted a good head shot will always kill no matter what the target. But sometimes you can't get a head shot and the softer diablo pellets are far more forgiving, killing where the Penetrators would only wound. They aren't a viable alternative in my opinion. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPT1 Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Fair play, I suppose it does sound like an advert, but that's because I was quoting the good points. No they are not the Proetos thingies although they are made by the same company. If you read what i said they are of varying weights depending on the gun type. "If we lose lead shooting will never be the same" Sounds like if we don't have muzzle loading with black powdwer shooting will never be the same. With regard to accuracy, do military weapons fire lead nosed bullits anymore or do they hve a more finely engineered finish now to enhance accuracy? Regarding lead, eventually it is inevitable that it will be totally banned as in angling with split shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPT1 Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 I don't know if they're more epensive or not. 500 for £12/13 is acceptable to me. Remember " there wa nothing ever made that could not be made worse for less money" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 £12 - £13 is far too much for them - even if they worked. The problem with these articles is that they accept whatever the manufacturer tells them without question. Maybe in the future there may be a lead free alternative. But at the moment these aren't it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveB916 Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Quote from above: 'I've used the Logun version of these Defiants in various guns' I think the Logun variants are lead are they not ? Dave B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
covlocks Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Granted a good head shot will always kill no matter what the target. But sometimes you can't get a head shot and the softer diablo pellets are far more forgiving, killing where the Penetrators would only wound. If you can't get a head shot then you should move on to the next target. Wounding with lead, plastic or any other pellet is unforgiveable, and shooting the body of Pigeon, Squirrel etc will rarely give a clean kill. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Firstly they are the same pellets as far as I'm aware. Secondly, I accept your point of view covlocks. I happen to have a different one. A chest shot with a good pellet will invariably kill cleanly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveB916 Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Same shape of pellet but I belived one is tin and one is lead ? The Logun being lead ? Dave B Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
covlocks Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 A chest shot with a good pellet will invariably kill cleanly. Highly incorrect unless you have an FAC Rifle, even then I would doubt the statement, particularly with squirrel and pigeon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Dave, I'm sure our resident Defiant representative will be along shortly and confirm one way or the other. On previous threads I'm sure he's said that they are the same pellet. One other point; Has the initial poster actually used any of these pellets? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breastman Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 With regard to accuracy, do military weapons fire lead nosed bullits anymore or do they hve a more finely engineered finish now to enhance accuracy? 'Military' small-arms (i.e. rifles, pistols, SMG & MG) all use Full Metal Jacketed (FMJ) rounds with lead cores. Lead nosed or soft/hollow point bullets are no longer used by the military, but not because of anything to do with accuracy. They were banned under the Hague convention for being too dangerous Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Highly incorrect unless you have an FAC Rifle, even then I would doubt the statement, particularly with squirrel and pigeon. 11.8 ft/lb .177 Weihrauch with AA Fields. Two of many - dead before they hit the ground. Post mortems confirmed I'd broken their heart... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
covlocks Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 11.8 ft/lb .177 Weihrauch with AA Fields. Two of many - dead before they hit the ground. Post mortems confirmed I'd broken their heart... First point is - 11.8lbs will be illegal if taken by the police for testing 'cause they dont use AA Fields Second point - A broken heart?? You have been reading too many Mills and Boon books. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MPT1 Posted November 18, 2009 Author Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 £12 - £13 is far too much for them - even if they worked. The problem with these articles is that they accept whatever the manufacturer tells them without question. Maybe in the future there may be a lead free alternative. But at the moment these aren't it. I've heard some silly remarks before but this takes the bisquit. Yes I have used thes pellets for two years and have found them to be extremely effective. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Aldous Huxley Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 'Military' small-arms (i.e. rifles, pistols, SMG & MG) all use Full Metal Jacketed (FMJ) rounds with lead cores. Lead nosed or soft/hollow point bullets are no longer used by the military, but not because of anything to do with accuracy. They were banned under the Hague convention for being too dangerous Mark Actually I believe they were banned due to there propensity to fragment in the body, which is banned under the Hague convention, I believe due to fears of wounding rather than killing, much like anti=personel land-minds. Luckily the hague affords no such protection to rabbits Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
UKPoacher Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 (edited) First point is - 11.8lbs will be illegal if taken by the police for testing 'cause they dont use AA Fields Second point - A broken heart?? You have been reading too many Mills and Boon books. First point - let me worry about that. Second point - the squirrels are dead - from a chest shot. If you want to restrict yourself to head shots only then go ahead. Just don't try and preach to me about it from high moral ground. I regularly kill pigeons and squirrels from chest shots. Dead is dead! I've heard some silly remarks before but this takes the bisquit. Yes I have used thes pellets for two years and have found them to be extremely effective. What's silly? The price or the fact that the magazine didn't do side-by-side tests with lead free against lead pellets? Bye the way; I see that you mentioned the, ahem, 'excellent' BASC magazine was full of adverts when you posted about it the other day AND you are no stranger to the Pellpax company. Edited November 18, 2009 by UKPoacher Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave-G Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 I was under the impression that restrictions were regarding lead SHOT pellets. This sounds like someone trying to corrupt the restrictions to sell their product. Getting shot down from our own side eh? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
huntercarbine Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 this threads warming up nicely Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blunderbuss Posted November 18, 2009 Report Share Posted November 18, 2009 Hi,In the fantastic BASC Mag. There is an article about restrictions on lead shot. I believe if there is a viable alternative that helps conservation it should be used. Well there is also a more than viable alternative to lead pellets. What is it you ask? Right I'll tell you then. DYNAMIC AIR PELLETS, they're made in every calibre, different weights to suit springers or PCPs . They are made from an alloy which according to today's scientific research sre totally non-toxic. They are more finely engineered than lead type and the tails don't get scrunched up. What do you think? Fair play, I suppose it does sound like an advert, but that's because I was quoting the good points.No they are not the Proetos thingies although they are made by the same company. You'll forgive me but this is a tad evasive. Direct question, are you involved with or connected in any way with the manufacturer, distributors or retailers of these pellets? Just asking like, so we can place your ringing endorsement in context Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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