Over enthusiastic gamekeeper?

[BountyHunter]

I have just had a rather interesting evenings shooting.

 

My nephew and his boy came over this evenig for a spot of lamping. I may have mentioned before but I live on a farm, (not run it, just live on it). The land owner rents a couple of barn conversions, one of which is my residence and he rents the land and farm buildings to a local farmer. The land is situated between an estate (as in lauded gentry, not housing) and a main road. I spoke with the land owner and he is really happy for me to shoot the air rifle and he has approved and helped with my co-terminus so is OK with my shooting a .22 rimfire / shotgun shoud the application be approved. I also spoke with the farmer out of coutesy and he was fine, he just asked me not to shoot in the feilds where his cows were grazing, fair enough.

 

So off we go this evening with Nick (the nephew) his boy and my son in tow. We didn't expect to see much due to the two extra bodies but had a pretty good shoot in the top fields and having scared everything away decided to go down to the bottom field that lies accross the valley from the estate, the border of which is a strip of dense woodland.

 

We saw a few bunnies who were unfortunately out of range and were working further into the field when we saw a lamp near the boundary of the land. My first reaction was that there was somebody lamping in the field adjacent to us and after a brief discussion with Nick decided that the safest course of action was to light up our lamp so that they were aware we were there and wouldn't shoot us by mistake, then make our way accross the feild and away from them.

 

As soon as I lit the lamp up the other light pointed over towards us through the trees. It turned out to be mouned to a Landy or suchlike which I believe to belong to the estates gamekeeper.

 

Having seen that they knew we were there we started of across the feild, only to be lit up by the torch and have the guy fire warning shots from a bloomin' rifle over our heads (full on big crack shot rifle, not a pnumatic!!). I was a tad annoyed as my boy and his peer were scared sh!tless. We made it into a lane and relative cover safely but that isn't the point, surely this guy has no right to dictate what I do with permission on land that isn't anything to do with him, or am I being naive?

 

I am going to go and talk to the landowner tomorrow and if he has no objections I would like to report this to the local constabulary. Hope that won't affect my application....

[whippet.22]

He probably thought you were poachers or summat cos you walked away when you realised he was there. 'Keepers have a lot on their plate so don't be too quick to judge, go speak to him first before you kick up a stink with the coppers. You never know you might get some shooting permission out of it, although 'keepers tend to mistrust 'air rifle people' and 'dog people'

[magman]

not being funny but that di""head had no right whatsoever to shoot at all .

i would be on the phone to the police , if u were on his land maybe but on your own permission. its people like him that gets us a bad name, stop & think of u in his scope F""K that. at least find out who he is & confront him.

[blackthorn]

magmans rite confront him the man sounds like a right arrogant pri!k. i no they have got a lot on there plate but to do that trick.

[Will Beasley]

Personally.......I'd report the guy to your local firearms dept with a view to licence revocation as he's seriously got a screw loose if he's whacking bullets over your head, you have witnesses and doing this will probably only strengthen your application as it demonstrates that you are responsible and safe..

 

And I'd be tempted NOT to confront the man as Blackthorn 687 said for obvious reasons as you're likeley to come to some form of physical harm!

Edited October 16, 2005 by Will Beasley

[blackthorn]

bounty hunter take no notice of what i said. WILL is probably right it was the hot head attitude that made it take so long to get my licence

[BountyHunter]

Thanks for the advise guys, I have posted the same thread on other shooting forums and have got similar replies, I think that the best course of action is going to be to speak to the landowner who gave me permission and see how he would like me to deal with this. The counity is close knit and I don't want to stir up trouble for my kindly landlord as he shoots as well. He may suggest a qhick phone call to the estate of suchlike, I don't know.

 

The thing that strike me is that the guy must have a screw loose, how many poachers shine a light to show that they are there?

 

BH

[ochre]

Sage words Billy B.

[badsworth]

Take a deep breath and sit on your hands for a day or two before doing anything.

 

Act in haste and repent at leisure. When you are calm try to find out what happened via the landowner. You might gain and you might lose out bigtime. After all - if he is a good gamekeeper the landowner will want to keep him 'onside' too.

 

Be cautious.

 

B

[converse320]

If you are sure of your facts, absolutely no question you should call the police immediately, regardless of any local politics you might have with landowner and farmer. Then let the police handle it. Forget about confrontations with the perpretrator - will just muddy and confuse things. This is way too serious too ignore. I'd have been on the phone immediately. Full bore rifle, in the dark, at a fairly high elevation presumably - potentially lethal to anyone within a couple of miles!

[Hodmedod.one]

Anyone stupid enough to fire a centrefire at an elevation such that he has no idea where the projectile will land is not fit to use a catapult.

If it is the gamekeeper, I would still report him to the Police.

[plexer]

I see absolutely no excuse for firing shots like that over you even if it was the gamekeeper what does he think will happen if he hits someone even if they are a poacher the law still isn't going to look favourably on the gamekeeper having shot someone.

 

Ben.

[Gemini]

If you are a member of BASC or CA then get in touch with them straight away and see what they say.

Anyone who shoots a fullbore rifle at an angle without any backstop is a bloody menace who is liable to kill someone.

You can bet your bottom-dollar that had you fired an air rifle pellet in HIS direction the police would have been called there and then.

It is a criminal offence to use any firearm/shotgun to frighten anyone regardless of circumstances, and would almost certainly result in revocation and a fine (or even a custodial sentence) so make sure of your facts before pursuing this.

G.M.

[BountyHunter]

I was thinking about this in the shower. It seems odd to me, backed up by the opinions of people on the forums, that a gamekeeper would act so irresponsibly. It is possible that the gamekeeper was actually looking for poachers and it was one of them that let the shot off, either taking a pop at some quarry or to cause me to consider that it was the gamekeeper. Only flaw I can see in that is that I wouldn't be using an unmoderated gun if I didn't want to be found....

 

The trouble is that I am NOT 100% sure of who fired a shot off, only the fact that a shot was fired and the gamekeeper (I assume) was in the field opposite pointing his torch at us.

[Gemini]

Then you must try to resolve this with the gamekeeper to see what he says. If he denies it, then tell him that you will be going to the police anyway because someone took a shot at you. He may get a bit pi$$ed off with this but at least it will give him food for thought the next time you are there.

It is also a criminal offence to shoot over into someone else’s land as the law states that you must confine your shots within your own boundaries. So if it was him then he has committed a series of illegal acts and should have his ar$e kicked anyway.

G.M.

[hawkeye]

Just go to the police and report that someone from what you think was a land rover fired a bullet gun over your head you do not have to say who you think it is. That way you are not pointing the finger at anybody, because i was dark and you did not see the person that fired so dont accuse anyone thats for the cops to sort out but for f--ks sake get it reported dont wait any longer.

 

Then you can go along to the landowner and let him know what has happened as the police will more than likely call to see him.

 

Then if you feel you must call to see the gamekeeper and tell him what happened and you have reported it to the police and you are letting him know incase he,s out and about on a night and someone fires at him.

Edited October 16, 2005 by hawkeye

[Bazooka Joe]

I am going to go and talk to the landowner tomorrow and if he has no objections I would like to report this to the local constabulary. Hope that won't affect my application....

 

Won't affect yours BountyHunter, but it will certainly affect his!!!!!!!!

 

 

Anyone who shoots a fullbore rifle at an angle without any backstop is a bloody menace who is liable to kill someone.

You can bet your bottom-dollar that had you fired an air rifle pellet in HIS direction the police would have been called there and then.

 

Gemini right Bountyhunter.

 

Bazooka Joe.

[magman]

please dont worry about losing land u can get more but u only get one life

next time u might not be posting at all :*)

[BountyHunter]

Just go to the police and report that someone from what you think was a land rover fired a bullet gun over your head you do not have to say who you think it is. That way you are not pointing the finger at anybody, because i was dark and you did not see the person that fired so dont accuse anyone thats for the cops to sort out but for f--ks sake get it reported dont wait any longer.

 

Then you can go along to the landowner and let him know what has happened as the police will more than likely call to see him.

 

Then if you feel you must call to see the gamekeeper and tell him what happened and you have reported it to the police and you are letting him know incase he,s out and about on a night and someone fires at him.

That seems like a good course of action, I'll let y'all know how I get on.

 

[mel b3]

please dont worry about losing land u can get more but u only get one life

next time u might not be posting at all :*)

magman is correct,you can always find more shooting permission but that would be a bit difficult if the worst happened,just think how you would feel if next time he got off a shot it hit one of the younger members of your shooting party, i think firstly i might have a quiet word with the land owner and then the keeper and if i had no joy i would be off to the police. just my humble opinion

[rarms]

How do you know it was the keeper?

 

Anyone can drive a car accross a field at night with a lamp and gun. I dont really think you have enough evidence to go to the police, it will more than likely just cause aggro for all involved

[velveteens]

As a life long keeper of what is now described as old school I would not think a fulltime keeper would jeopardise his position by irresponsible discharching of a firearm near or close to anyone. We used to have to attend refresher classes at Fordingbridge, run by the Game Conservacy. They were quite rigorous in hammering gun safetey so much so it got tedious. At the end of the day only an idiot would discharge a weapon in any circumstance he runs into. Anybody doing wrong normally legs it not wanders round with a searchlight. Check you have got the right person as it doesn't seem likely. Stay Safe. Velveteens.

[Devilishdave]

You have to do somthing one way or another. I personaly would go down and speak to the keeper explain what happend from his land. one of two things will happen either he will deny it or he will admit it.

 

If he denys it then there is a dangerouse idiot cutting arround your area so phone the police.

 

If he admits it and apologises take it at face value. If he admits it and comes the cu,nt phone the police imediately and to hell with loosing a bit of permission and upseting the wider community. I for one would not want to have anything to do with some one like that.

 

Dave

[tenbears10]

If I remember right a keeper was sentencend to 3 months in jail for firing a shotgun into the air to break up an illegal rave on their land. If someone fires a rifle into the air and it goes to court I would expect the punishment to be more harsh. Keepers are professionals so they are dealt with more severly by the courts as they should know better.

 

Like others have said it is not your problem to decide who did what. Just report the facts to the police as you know them. It was dark but someone on that land fired a shot at your party. The estate keeper might need to know he has poachers on his land if it wasn't him.Someone shooting over you is more likely to be poachers than the keeper IMO.

Edited October 17, 2005 by tenbears10

[Teal]

Are you sure he did not fire the gun into the ground near his vehicle, or that he had a blank firing gun which he might use given that he had seen people working the fields, and in close range of his woods.

 

I don't know what you were using (gun wise) but lamping near a wood at night - which is probably a roosting pheasant wood is obviously not a good idea and I could understand his concern, if not his methods. I would discuss it straight with the police if you have reason to believe that the shots were intended to narrowly miss you. Do you remember it will be your word against his, and finding the bullets he fired will be impossible (obviously). Speaking with your landowner is probably the best first call of action.