bicykillgaz Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) Just wondered that you gets use for getting them high crows? We've been struggling to get them to come down to our pattern, they are on a flightline over the top of a tall woods i shoot, i normally use 5's and my mate uses 6's were hitting them There folding up and dropping then getting up dusting themselves off and wandering off! I've just picked up a slab of hulmax 34g no3's to see how i go but was curious what you guys use. I know I've lost a lot of lead out my pattern but least they'll hit harder. Atb Gary Edited January 22, 2012 by bicykillgaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
M.I.A Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) 3's are a bit much and pattern may suffer, 5's are ideal for a combination of stopping power and pattern, especially on the high stuff. There all feather really so pattern needs to be reliable I would say 32g 6's will do just as well but I've always used 5's on crows 6's will carry enough stopping power to kill a tall crow, pattern is the key here Edited January 22, 2012 by M.I.A Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
the crowman Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) If you have m/c go 3/4 and full or full full that Will sort them out Edited January 22, 2012 by the crowman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodcock1 Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 If you have m/c go 3/4 and full or full full that Will sort them out Have to agree with this. Crows are not hard to kill other than the fact that the 'kill zone' is very small. 6's or 7' are more than enough in terms of energy but a tight pattern is key to success. Imagine the kill zone about as big as a golf ball. Can you guarantee a hit in that area every time with 3's or even 5's??? My crow recipe was 28gms of 7.5 and a 3/4 and full choke. It was kill or miss to 50 yards and few woundies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicykillgaz Posted January 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 I usually leave 1/2 in the hatsan but switched to 3/4 after 2-3 getting up and had another 3 after changing, these was about 50yrds i was actually gonna go for no4's and full but thought i could get away with no3's. I'll give a box a try next time Im out and see how they go, ill let you know the results. Atb Gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 I to prefere pellets in target approach, a cloud of 7s or 6s is hard to beat. A better chance of a busted wing and a couple centered and they are pretty sorted by the time they are down. In saying that a good pattern wins every time, even with larger shot! Got any large pieces of cardbourd? U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicykillgaz Posted January 22, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 I to prefere pellets in target approach, a cloud of 7s or 6s is hard to beat. A better chance of a busted wing and a couple centered and they are pretty sorted by the time they are down. In saying that a good pattern wins every time, even with larger shot! Got any large pieces of cardbourd? U. i'm gonna pattern them see how they go, worse case i'm gonna have some light fox or overkill rabbit rounds, or they'll do the trick nicely on the crows eitherway they'll end up getting used, if anyone needs a box and is passing my way i'll take 32g no5's in exchange. atb gary Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 I had some saga 36g#4s which were excellent for really high birds, a tight choke is a must though for anything at distance. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
minghis Posted January 22, 2012 Report Share Posted January 22, 2012 I had some saga 36g#4s which were excellent for really high birds, a tight choke is a must though for anything at distance. I've been using Pigeon Special (Lyalvale?) 30g 6's but have been getting a lot of shot but run away ones. Tried 32g 5's (Fob) today and they're definitely better. Gushop bloke said that 4's would be better but he also said you'll have to use full chokes - no good to me as I'm fixed 1/2 and 3/4. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B525 LIGHT Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Im firmly in the increase your shot size camp. Crows are a whole different ball game to pigeons any day. 5's over decoys and 4's or italian size 5's if at range. Your hullmax will be fine, just tighten your chokes a little. Smaller shot will do exactly as youve already witnessed. I really dont get the uk facination with the size 6 pellet!!! Every other country in the world uses larger sizes than we do over here. Ive spent years stood at pegs on driven days seeing birds flick in the air as they get struck by a few tiny pellets from the outside of a pattern when 5's simply knock them down. 6's are far from an all round shell unless your shooting a short range only. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
casts_by_fly Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 your 5's carry enough energy for crows at 50 yards. The problem is the choke. You'll want to swap into a full choke for shooting 50 yards consistently. Try a shot at a measured 50 yards with 1/2 choke. I think you'll be surprised how open the pattern is. You're probably only getting 2-5 pellets in the entire bird at that range (assuming a vertical belly shot) and only 1-3 in the vitals. You'll have some pretty big holes in your pattern at 50. Tighten it down to full, up the payload to a 32 or 36 g 5 and you'll be in good shape. Thanks, Rick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest cookoff013 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Im firmly in the increase your shot size camp. Crows are a whole different ball game to pigeons any day. 5's over decoys and 4's or italian size 5's if at range. Your hullmax will be fine, just tighten your chokes a little. Smaller shot will do exactly as youve already witnessed. I really dont get the uk facination with the size 6 pellet!!! Every other country in the world uses larger sizes than we do over here. Ive spent years stood at pegs on driven days seeing birds flick in the air as they get struck by a few tiny pellets from the outside of a pattern when 5's simply knock them down. 6's are far from an all round shell unless your shooting a short range only. you and me both ! 6s are imho the minimum requirement for game, it is however suitable for close decoyed birds. so pigeon cartridges get used for everything. its that they are available in volume and can do the job. i do understand that pattern kills, but penetration kills too. i`ve had the odd one pellet take game cleanly. no pattern there, just penetration. there are some good posts here about choke. and certainly 4s are morethan up to the job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Floating Chamber Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Lyalvale Europa Game 34 gram No. 5 (2.8mm) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coneyhunter Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Gamebore clear pigeon 32G 6's, or if you have the cash black Gold 32g 6's , drop crows a treat! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicykillgaz Posted January 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) Cheers for all the opinions guys, i usually use 32g 5s or 34g 5s but was still getting pricked birds, maybe its me miss judging the hight and range and only just catching them with a few pellets (probably) but Im just not confident with 5s at them ranges now. i'm nearly out of 5's so thought id go top up with something a little more substantial, originally was after no4's but they only had steel no4's so i got the no3's instead. I paid £65 which i didn't think was too bad as places usually overcharge for larger shot sizes, they was actually cheaper than some of the 28/30g no6 loads they had in which i found quite strange. I'll let you know how it goes when Im next out, it won't be for a few weeks unfortunately though as I've got a bad back. Im selling what no6's i have to get some more no5's if anyone local wants them, Im after £50 for 222 of them, they cost me £67 for 250! I only got them for using in sbs and I've sold that now so I'll stick with my usual. Atb Gary Edited January 23, 2012 by bicykillgaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdSolomons Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 unless you really step your choke up then 3s will be pants as you will have holes in the pattern the size of a dinner plate. 5s will stone anything out to 60 plus, choke up and give it a try. If not, then try them closer as you might well be getting out further than your ability can take you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicykillgaz Posted January 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Hi edd, I will be using them through full probably, and 50-60 is the max Im prepared to shoot at, the land is next to a tall woods they tend to follow a line of trees toward the wood then divert over my pattern but staying high before either looping back or going over the woods, need to get a rotary/magnet when funds permit to try get them to commit more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BRAD1927 Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 32g 6's for me drops them every time. would suggest you try decoying them in a bit closer if struggling to kill cleanly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicykillgaz Posted January 23, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 32g 6's for me drops them every time. would suggest you try decoying them in a bit closer if struggling to kill cleanly. as i've already said mate due to where the flightline is i'm having to decoy on the edge of a tall woods so they come over high and travel along a tall treeline towards/away from my position, i'm already having to set my pattern 40yrds in from the tree line so i can set up facing 45degrees away from the wood and treeline to make it safe to shoot and as a result they are reluctant to come down to my decoys as they've already been draw off course, its not for the want of trying to get them to commit, you get maybe 1/10 come down for a closer look. i'll see how i get on with the no3's for now then think about getting my mate to chip in on a rotary. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted January 23, 2012 Report Share Posted January 23, 2012 Some interesting comments here however I feel some facts are missing. Whilst it is possible for a single large pellet to penetrate more than a smaller one the actual difference is not that much greater. An important factor to remember is a shotguns payload has an accumlative affect on it's target. A number of smaller wound channels will in fact have more chance of immobilising a vital organ or nicking a bleeder more so than a single or couple of larger shot. Also the velocity of shotgun pellets are not much in the sense that they are not going to act like super high speed bullets and cause hydrostatic shocks or fragment on contact causing massive trauma. Only testing on a pattern board will find a nice even pattern and then what ever the shot size you choose will have an affect. I found a wonderfull shell years ago in 4s, it was that good I would go after snipe with them! Equally I was given some old Champion 8s 1 1/8oz and through some choke floored crows at very good distance! Their necks, heads, wings and lungs were well peppered! Another thing was that when using larger shot I always prefered 4s over 5s. I never could put my finger on why but one day read an old book that made some comment that only a shot size that would lay evenly on a wad in the bore layer after layer etc should be used, it then went on to say how a number 4 does that much better than a 5 amongst other examples in 12g! I never tested it but was satified that from my own experience it may have a point! U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bicykillgaz Posted January 24, 2012 Author Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Hi ud some good points there too, would the shot laying even still apply with plastic cups or just fibre wads? I've always found my no5's to pattern well but as a rule i usually get plastic. I guess the cup would prevent any un even spread to a certain extent. I've got some 3" 50g no3's if all else fails, big shot and good pattern just a little expensive to be decoying with at £8.60 a box! Gary Edited January 24, 2012 by bicykillgaz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 Ahhr, der good ole' days (I miss 'm ) U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 Hi ud some good points there too, would the shot laying even still apply with plastic cups or just fibre wads? I've always found my no5's to pattern well but as a rule i usually get plastic. I guess the cup would prevent any un even spread to a certain extent. I've got some 3" 50g no3's if all else fails, big shot and good pattern just a little expensive to be decoying with at £8.60 a box! Gary I doubt that old rule in that book applies to plas wads no! In saying that though a plas wad is what- a 20gauge internally! I don't think it all that important, it's a lore not law! Plas wads generally can tighten things up some but not always!! Are the sizes you have English sizes or Italian, most Italian is half a size bigger than English! That 3/4 choke by the way is plenty tight but do remember a tight choke can ruin a dense pattern with the wrong load, again it is not a given and nothing can be taken as a granted. But get as many of the little ******** as you can U. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
escortmagnum999 Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 i do a fair bit of crow shooting/decoying and i use whatever cartridges are cheap, 7.5s,7s,6s iv even used 8s at a push. i shoot with full or 3/4 choke all the time. putting the shot in the right place is key. Im aware that i'll be jumped on for using small shot but it works for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spara Dritto Posted January 24, 2012 Report Share Posted January 24, 2012 (edited) Stick with no 6's and maybe try giving them a little more lead (leed) in front. Focus on the head and not the whole crows body. If you get a head shot it wont be dusting it's self off and flying away All the best mate. Edited January 24, 2012 by Spara Dritto Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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