Pinkfooted Geese Population crash ?

[scolopax]

 

 

 

The annual census of migratory geese has shown a worrying decline in Pink numbers in recent years, numbers had been gradually building up through the 80' and 90's and reached a high in 2009. Since then 100K have 'gone missing'.

 

The Pinks are counted in October and November, population estimates were:

 

2009 360K

2010 298K

2011 247K

 

So even accounting for any inherent inaccuracies in the surveys there is undoubtably a massive decrease in our wintering Pink population, a loss of a third of the geese in 3 years is pretty much a population crash and something we should be all concerned about.

 

http://monitoring.wwt.org.uk/species/2012/pinkfoot_latest2012.php#2011/12

[markyboy]

Is it possible that these geese are not migrating at all and seeing the winters out at home ?

[scolopax]

A few Greylags are staying in Iceland now but the Pinks all migrate to the UK. Hopefully a couple of good breeding seasons will see numbers bouncing back.

[mudpatten]

I don`t think they are overwintering in the far north. There is nothing for them to eat.

 

Population fluctuations owing to unfavourable breeding conditions are not unusual, especially in other species like Brent geese.

 

I`m slightly concerned that this information should be coming from the likes of the WWT whose recent behaviour in the lead shot research group shows a nakedly anti shooting bias.

 

When one reads the report in detail one discovers that much of the early season data is corrupted by the fact that the early season count weekend, and these things take a lot of organising, failed to coincide with the the normal migration pattern owing to unusual weather conditions and a significant number of birds were "missed" from the count.

 

Counts take place on known areas of poulation. What they don`t take into account are changes in the birds distribution and it is likely that many birds were missed because they were in unexpected areas which were not counted.

 

I don`t doubt that pinkfoot numbers have taken a dip.

 

The real issue here is, can the wildfowling community act responsibly and, if it is proven to be a fact, take the appropriate steps such as showing restraint when shooting.

 

If we can`t do that then we need to be prepared to be beaten by the WWT with the big stick of mandatory bag limits and bag returns.

 

There is a real opprortunity here for the shooting community to demonstrate that it does not need sledgehammer legislation but is quite capable of responsibly managing it`s own affairs.

 

Well, you`d like to think that that would possible.

[jonnybgood]

I think after this winter, the population will go up. They have wintered very well this time, due to our terribly wet summer, leaving many thousands of acres of cereals left unharvested, provideing food though out the winter,they have fed well this year and the geese i have shot have been the fittest ever. There wasnt really a big freeze, and they never went hungry, i think this will have helped them for the up-comin breeding season.

[scolopax]

I think after this winter, the population will go up. They have wintered very well this time, due to our terribly wet summer, leaving many thousands of acres of cereals left unharvested, provideing food though out the winter,they have fed well this year and the geese i have shot have been the fittest ever. There wasnt really a big freeze, and they never went hungry, i think this will have helped them for the up-comin breeding season.

 

Got to agree, if they leave this country in good condition they are more likely to lay bigger clutches, rear more goslings etc. But a lot also depends on the amount of snow cover in central Iceland when they get there. Too late a thaw and they will struggle to obtain nest sites in time.

Edited March 4, 2013 by scolopax

[Pole Star]

Any Icelandic PW users who can shed some light on this for us . Hard to rely on reports from certain bodies that have non shooters & worse still anti's lurking in their ranks ! .

[kent]

its counting errors as the population is now spreading out more, basically its usual haunts are all full and some over shot. There are also a number of Pinks stopping here all summer population near me, one club I am in has been seeing numbers doubling (sometimes more) every year.

[wildfowler.250]

I wouldn't worry about it. 87% of statistics are made up anyway..

 

I'd put it down to counting inaccuracies or the geese spreading out as mentioned. Plus populations are bound to vary a little

[ayano3]

Exactly how do they count them Please don't tell me its Harrycat doing the count.

[Big Mat]

I believe they do it with aerial photography, i'm sure anser2 will be able to tell us how the do it!

[markyboy]

I was told around 70 k of pinks never migrated last season cos the winters being less cold and the ash from a volcano also stopped there normall migratory flight to uk ! But weather true who knows !

[wildfowler.250]

Meant to add, Thought there was plenty pinks this year

[anser2]

I think there can be little doubt the estimate of pink foot numbers in the UK is pretty correct. The way the bird watching news network works it would be impossible to miss 100,000 from the counts and data from the past three years this is a obvious trend. The counts are undertaken by a broad spectrum of reserve wardens amature bird watchers , research officers , wildfowlers and staff from the BTO, RSPB and WWT. I am sure with a variety of counters any charges of a distortion of the numbers can be discounted. These counts are used by govenment and international organisations and any massarging of numbers would bring the whole count scheme into disrepute and while from time to time there might be the odd cock up as birds arrive late or early on migration as a whole the numbers can be trusted. As for pinks staying in Iceland , thats very unlikely. I am in close contact with a number of people involved with goose research and nobody has heard of this.

 

I count wildfowl every week on a Norfolk reserve and with follow up checks by another counter and counting from photos we get fairly good estimate of numbers. In my local area there has been a clear decline over the past 4 years. In part this has been due to changes in farming methods , but even allowing for this numbers have tumbled. 5 years ago If i did not see 40,000 pinks at morning flight it was a poor morning and the peak on the main marsh I shoot was 90,000. In the past season 5-7,000 was the normal population peaking at 15,000. Thats a big decline. Its true there has been a change in the pink habbits with some birds roosting on wet meadows inland , but not enough do that to account for this drop.

 

 

However lets not panic , we have had a run of 3 cold winters across much of the country , this forces the pinks to feed in dangerious places and has probably increased the numbers shot . We still have a lot of pinks and its natural to have population cycles and on occasion there will be natural disasters , we had our airspace closed down a few years ago due to volcanic activity in Iceland , It was a hell of a lot worse up there. Not just the direct effect of the volcano , but huge areas were covered with ash suppressing any plant growth that spring , and perhaps causing the plants the pinks feed on to take years to recover. I will not forget when I was in the far north of Sweden seeing bare earth and stone next a road with no plants on it. When I asked a local if they had recent road works , he said " no that was done 10 years ago " , Plants take a long time to recover in the Arctic. Like wise there times when a natural disaster can cause a major population mortality. Back in 1995 I was walking along a Norfolk beach during a period of very cold weather for about 5 miles . The tide line was littered with thousands no more like 10s of thousands of dead fieldfares with 3 or 4 to every yard along the strand line. God knows how many died trying to make it to the UK a hundred thousand or more perhaps. So its quite possible that we have lost 100,000 pinks in the past couple of years. lets just hope they bounce back soon.

 

I suspect there is no need to worry to much until the population drops to less than 100,000 ( thats still double the population of the 1960s ) , but there is still some conservation measures than can be put in place. Stopping shooting pinks under licence out of season for crop protection for one and encouraging smaller bags.

 

Mat the counts are done by observers on the ground as the majority of pinks are attracted to areas of arable farming where access is not hard , in contrast when surveying barnacle geese aerial surveys from a plane have to be done from time to time as barnacle geese are often found on off shore islands where few if any people live. Pinks may however be surveyed in the Arctic by planes.

Edited March 5, 2013 by anser2

[scolopax]

Easily fixed.....ban the use of decoys.

[6.5x55SE]

Easily fixed.....ban the use of decoys.

Try banning the Icelandic Goose shooters/Outfitters being able to sell the shot Geese for atleast £10 per Goose. That price was 6 years ago

[scolopax]

Totally agree with you on that one Boyd, one Icelandic market gunner shot 900 greys a few years back, all to be sold. Unfortunately there is about as much chance of us persuading the Icelandic to give up the sale of wild geese as there is of us banning goose decaying!

[Pinkfooty]

Too early to panic guys.

 

Bear in mind that even the worst estimates of the current population are still 4 times as many as there were back in the 1960s when the population was in the 60- 70,000 range. And we didn't need any restrictions on shooting pinks then and they still increased incredibly over the next 40 years.

 

There have been a couple of poor breeding seasons but that is a normal cyclical pattern. Geese are long-lived birds and a few bad seasons does no lasting damage to the ongoing population.

 

It is really only if we can discern serious reasons leading to a population decline that we need to think about taking any action.

[ayano3]

I remember them doing wader counts on lawyers creek years ago, only problem was they used to arrive about 9 am when most birds had been seen and gone.

[wildfowler.250]

Easily fixed.....ban the use of decoys.

 

Scolopax, normally your posts are very good but I have to 100% disagree with that suggestion.

[scolopax]

why ?

 

The banning of goose decoys (including dead birds) would stop the over exploitation of migratory geese and make excessive goose bags just about a thing of the past.

[Fisheruk]

Whose counting

[wildfowler.250]

why ?

 

The banning of goose decoys (including dead birds) would stop the over exploitation of migratory geese and make excessive goose bags just about a thing of the past.

 

I've had several times on the shore where I could have shot too many geese,(just because I'm on the right flight line). If I'm using decoys I'm not going to be inclined to shoot any more birds than normal. It's the individual that's is the issue rather than the method of hunting. It's a,"tar everyone with the same brush" scenario".

 

 

[utectok]

Really interesting thread! Some good thoughts I think the time for these muppets who shoot 30 birds on a flight to behave IMHO. I shoot two to five a season plenty for me

[anser2]

Though I do use decoys ( a couple of times a season ) I always stop at 3 pinks or if I have not shot any by 9am to let the geese in to feed I agree with Scolpax a restriction on the use of decoys would almost stop excessive bags of geese overnight. There have been several documented bags in excess of 100 pinks shot over decoys in recent years and a couple of people I know made a huge killing a few years ago over decoys.