Vince Green Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 The death penalty for treason remained on the statute books long after other reasons for the death penalty were removed years ago. You would assume there was a reason. Yet in 1998 Tony Blair removed it for no good reason and with no consultation, or discussion WHY? Events in Woolwich, the political killing of a soldier would have been clear cut treason in the past and would have carried the death penalty without doubt. No point in charging the killers with treason today, it virtually doesn't exist any more. Thanks Tony, you have done it yet again. The word idiot is not strong enough for you, but if I use anything stronger it will get banned. That man was such a ............... choose your own word. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
digger Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 He was and is a total male chicken, despise the man. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Do you really think this country would carry out the death penalty for treason even if it were still in statute.we stopped the death penalty a long time ago for good reason,because for every 10 you put to death there will probably be 1 that was a mistake, and 1 is to many. Let them suffer in prison for the rest of their lives,they will never be released,and i am sure there are other nutters in there that will try to finish them off on a regular basis. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malik Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Do you really think this country would carry out the death penalty for treason even if it were still in statute.we stopped the death penalty a long time ago for good reason,because for every 10 you put to death there will probably be 1 that was a mistake, and 1 is to many. Let them suffer in prison for the rest of their lives,they will never be released,and i am sure there are other nutters in there that will try to finish them off on a regular basis. They must suffer though, too much EU law these days when it comes to prisons. It should be a hell hole. So if even someone did a minor offence. They'd think twice and not repeat. At the minute, these chavs get a status from being "sent down" Take away their tvs, take away the gym, give them books or something, they may actually leave with an education and some morals. As for the ones that are never being released... Ive always been a fan of chain gangs, like america Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Tomorrow i will go to a car boot sale in my sports car,then have a bbq and a few drinks while chatting to my kids and my beautiful wife. i can do this any time i feel like,if i want to go somewhere i can,i f i want to do something i can,and i will be able to do this until the day i die. In prison your life is planned for you, decisions are no longer yours and you will probably never see the other side of the prison wall again,no big macs(for those that like junk) or a takeaway, or a pint after work, or if single trying to chat up that fat bird in the club. I know we would all like to see people suffer, but face reality that won't happen,but they will have their liberty removed and will realise every day that they will never have freedom again.And they will be looking over their shoulder all their life,because there will be someone looking for the glory of being the one to finish them. Would i like a tv in my cell to watch a concert, or would i like to go to that concert,no brainer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bruno22rf Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 Do some research-the death penalty is too expensive compared to life. By the time you have paid for all the Judicial farce and appeals its cheaper to just keep em locked up. Besides this we must remember that we are a civilised people-I think that's what they call people who stand by and do nothing when a member of their armed forces is hacked to death on a busy high street. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 . Besides this we must remember that we are a civilised people-I think that's what they call people who stand by and do nothing when a member of their armed forces is hacked to death on a busy high street. That's a cheap shot,our "society" reacted ,from the women who shielded and argued with the nutters to the armed officers who were prepared to put their lives at risk,they all stood by and did nothing! The attack was so fast no one could have prevented it,but to say we all stood by and did nothing is a bit extreme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chrisjpainter Posted June 8, 2013 Report Share Posted June 8, 2013 The trouble with the death penalty - whether morally justifiable or not - in the Woolwich scenario it achieves nothing, as it would create martyrs and the islamist extremists LOVE a good martyring! And this is grandstand martyring, with a full court and a state sentence to death. It makes Britain much more of a target and won't act as a deterrent; it may just make things worse. I say let them be forgotten by the world in a jail. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clakk Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 bring back the oubilette that french hole u drop em in and walk away.no appeal ,no food ,no internet .just rot n die we been at war since some toerag decided u should die for your religion end of.its not anything but fact they came up with a load of carp where woman are second class .and u will do as your told or else.tuff titty we is not wanting that we live our lives by family values and hope not stone age drivel from some bloke with a beard i dont caare wot u beleive but do not force it on me and my family.beleive wotever u want do not try and tell me n mine that i will do as u say.i am british irish mum scotish dad born in yorkshire .religon sucks i know talking to hundreds of peeps at work im not alone in this.i dont wish to killall muslims contary to wot penis choudry preaches.a;l; i ask is let my grandkids grow up making their own choice not doing wot mr najeeb abdullah tells em .and to all those who think religeon is the answer jogg on .if i wish to join you il come and ave a look .if i want to tell me im wrong then you sir are dissa wrong nutjob.rant over live long n prosper may all your troubles be small Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 Tomorrow i will go to a car boot sale in my sports car,then have a bbq and a few drinks while chatting to my kids and my beautiful wife. i can do this any time i feel like,if i want to go somewhere i can,i f i want to do something i can,and i will be able to do this until the day i die. In prison your life is planned for you, decisions are no longer yours and you will probably never see the other side of the prison wall again,no big macs(for those that like junk) or a takeaway, or a pint after work, or if single trying to chat up that fat bird in the club. I know we would all like to see people suffer, but face reality that won't happen,but they will have their liberty removed and will realise every day that they will never have freedom again.And they will be looking over their shoulder all their life,because there will be someone looking for the glory of being the one to finish them. Would i like a tv in my cell to watch a concert, or would i like to go to that concert,no brainer. Great post. It's good to think and reflect on the nature of freedom. I suppose one can only truly value it when it's taken away, like so many things. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
four-wheel-drive Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Tomorrow i will go to a car boot sale in my sports car,then have a bbq and a few drinks while chatting to my kids and my beautiful wife. i can do this any time i feel like,if i want to go somewhere i can,i f i want to do something i can,and i will be able to do this until the day i die. In prison your life is planned for you, decisions are no longer yours and you will probably never see the other side of the prison wall again,no big macs(for those that like junk) or a takeaway, or a pint after work, or if single trying to chat up that fat bird in the club. I know we would all like to see people suffer, but face reality that won't happen,but they will have their liberty removed and will realise every day that they will never have freedom again.And they will be looking over their shoulder all their life,because there will be someone looking for the glory of being the one to finish them. Would i like a tv in my cell to watch a concert, or would i like to go to that concert,no brainer. The problem is you paint a rosy picture of life but for a lot of people ( I am not defending them ) brought up or should I say dragged up on council estates with bad parents and little money or love they find being in prison better that living on the outside so do not confuse your idealistic lifestyle with theres prison for you would be hell but not for a lot of them just a thought. P/S In a county where they will not allow even a dieing person to helped on there way the thought of them agreeing to hang someone is a joke. Edited June 9, 2013 by four-wheel-drive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overandunder2012 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) Do some research-the death penalty is too expensive compared to life. By the time you have paid for all the Judicial farce and appeals its cheaper to just keep em locked up. he's right about the costs . in america it is cheaper to give a man life. i like to think britain has moved on from such practices and will not decide to return to the past. Edited June 9, 2013 by overandunder2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 The problem is you paint a rosy picture of life but for a lot of people ( I am not defending them ) brought up or should I say dragged up on council estates with bad parents and little money or love they find being in prison better that living on the outside so do not confuse your idealistic lifestyle with theres prison for you would be hell but not for a lot of them just a thought. P/S In a county where they will not allow even a dieing person to helped on there way the thought of them agreeing to hang someone is a joke. You don't get what i am saying,this thread was about the death penalty v life,and when you are locked up for a very long time you will have what everyone else takes for granted removed.i may paint a pretty picture of my life,and it is good because i made it that way,but i have been in the military and seen the rough side of humanity round the world, and in my job i come across some vile people.The thought of prison to me is not the perceived hell you think it might be to me,the hell would be not being able to make my own decisions and choices,and even the "scum"from estates that you write about like to hang round on corners,or get a KFC and then drive their cars round,only an absolute idiot would welcome imprisonment for life over freedom. Think about being in a high security prison where your every move is planned by someone else, and you will probably live in an area no bigger than a football pitch for the rest of your life, then couple in the fear that some other nutter wants your scalp to be harder than the next man. Until we can be 100% certain 100% of the time that someone is guilty then life is the only option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pushkin Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 Oh dear. The EDL folks are really getting a boost with this post eh? This is a highly emotive issue for folks in light of the recent murder. I would ask that you slow down and really think about what the death sentence would mean. All that time and money spent trying to convict someone who cannot even be able to respect the basic functions of the court. WOW! how many lawyers would be fighting amongst themselves to get on his defence case if he was being tried for the death penalty (win or lose!) This is not about being a liberalist it is about being a realist. One death does not make society any better for the death of the person who did it. Pushkin Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debaser Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 The death penalty for treason remained on the statute books long after other reasons for the death penalty were removed years ago. You would assume there was a reason. Yet in 1998 Tony Blair removed it for no good reason and with no consultation, or discussion WHY? Events in Woolwich, the political killing of a soldier would have been clear cut treason in the past and would have carried the death penalty without doubt. No point in charging the killers with treason today, it virtually doesn't exist any more. Thanks Tony, you have done it yet again. The word idiot is not strong enough for you, but if I use anything stronger it will get banned. That man was such a ............... choose your own word. The death penalty was abolished in 1998 due to The Human Rights Act 1998. In effect the Human Rights Act, made allowance for the European convention on Human right to be incoperatted into British Law. Article 2 is the right to Life and apparently the dealth penalty isn't compatible with this.....therefore the abolishment of the death penalty for treason and I think a few other offences. Personally I don't agree with the death penalty so no bad thing in my book. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unapalomablanca Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) i think people need to understand, that the liberals won and are winning everywhere. Just because a politician calls themselves a socialist, or a tory, doesnt mean they are not liberal. You will struggle to beat them, they are running every part of life, government, media, local government, police, courts,schools, they crush right wing thinking like a butterfly. They are the undisputed kings of barminess, and can find any fact to support any of their crazy arguments. They should be proud of themselves. This topic is not worth your breath, there are many liberals on here, many join just for subjects like this. Edited June 9, 2013 by unapalomablanca Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
debaser Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 i think people need to understand, that the liberals won and are winning everywhere. Just because a politician calls themselves a socialist, or a tory, doesnt mean they are not liberal. You will struggle to beat them, they are running every part of life, government, media, local government, police, courts,schools, they crush right wing thinking like a butterfly. They are the undisputed kings of barminess, and can find any fact to support any of their crazy arguments. They should be proud of themselves. This topic is not worth your breath, there are many liberals on here, many join just for subjects like this. Who's breath? Are you referring to me? Just because someone has a different view to you it doesn't make them wrong or right, just like you view isn't wrong or right. I don't believe in the death penalty for a number of reasons. However I do believe in very tough, long prison terms with no privalages, no tv's, sky, no gyms, basic food etc. Am I still a "liberal"? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unapalomablanca Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 Who's breath? Are you referring to me? Just because someone has a different view to you it doesn't make them wrong or right, just like you view isn't wrong or right. I don't believe in the death penalty for a number of reasons. However I do believe in very tough, long prison terms with no privalages, no tv's, sky, no gyms, basic food etc. Am I still a "liberal"? no, i am not referring to you. I am saying that to argue this, is so pointless as anyone who is 'pro' is just rubbished from every angle. Plus i do believe there is a right and a wrong and that too much opinion and debate has stopped decisive thinking. You can argue anything if you really try, that much i do know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
four-wheel-drive Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 You don't get what i am saying,this thread was about the death penalty v life,and when you are locked up for a very long time you will have what everyone else takes for granted removed.i may paint a pretty picture of my life,and it is good because i made it that way,but i have been in the military and seen the rough side of humanity round the world, and in my job i come across some vile people.The thought of prison to me is not the perceived hell you think it might be to me,the hell would be not being able to make my own decisions and choices,and even the "scum"from estates that you write about like to hang round on corners,or get a KFC and then drive their cars round,only an absolute idiot would welcome imprisonment for life over freedom. Think about being in a high security prison where your every move is planned by someone else, and you will probably live in an area no bigger than a football pitch for the rest of your life, then couple in the fear that some other nutter wants your scalp to be harder than the next man. Until we can be 100% certain 100% of the time that someone is guilty then life is the only option. Ok I live in a nice area in a nice part of the country and do not come in to contact with the type of person that I am talking about but I have seen on TV and heard them on the radio people who will admit that they prefer life in prison they do not have to worry about keeping a roof over there heads they get fed and looked after I am not saying all of them but there is who say this. There are some people who I would like to see executed but as has been said the cost of numerous appeals etc make it not worth the bother I would go for the American way of doing things for killing someone just give them 999 years with parole after a third of the sentence has been served. :good: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
joe soapy Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 There is a strange irony in some of the relies, this being a shooting forum. Most members will be acting as judge and jury every time they go out with a gun. when a fox kills your chicken, what do you do? give it a warning? cage it for life? or deal with it and move on. The blokes in question selected a victim, ran him down with a car and butchered him. The consequences should not be the cause of endless expence or debate, or even take more than a few moments of somebodys time Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wulliewinky Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 They must suffer though, too much EU law these days when it comes to prisons. It should be a hell hole. So if even someone did a minor offence. They'd think twice and not repeat. At the minute, these chavs get a status from being "sent down" Take away their tvs, take away the gym, give them books or something, they may actually leave with an education and some morals. As for the ones that are never being released... Ive always been a fan of chain gangs, like america Here ere, get the ******s working in a quarry until they drop dead of exhaustion Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
overandunder2012 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) i think people need to understand, that the liberals won and are winning everywhere. Just because a politician calls themselves a socialist, or a tory, doesnt mean they are not liberal. You will struggle to beat them, they are running every part of life, government, media, local government, police, courts,schools, they crush right wing thinking like a butterfly. They are the undisputed kings of barminess, and can find any fact to support any of their crazy arguments. They should be proud of themselves. This topic is not worth your breath, there are many liberals on here, many join just for subjects like this. without meaning to cause offence i wonder, if so many people think liberals are in the right enough to put all these "liberals" in all the jobs you claim they have and give them so much power to "crush the right wing thinking like a butterfly" do you think it could be because few people think the politics of the far right make any sense. this is a question not a declaration of love for any politics right or left Edited June 9, 2013 by overandunder2012 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 There is a strange irony in some of the relies, this being a shooting forum. Most members will be acting as judge and jury every time they go out with a gun. when a fox kills your chicken, what do you do? give it a warning? cage it for life? or deal with it and move on. The blokes in question selected a victim, ran him down with a car and butchered him. The consequences should not be the cause of endless expence or debate, or even take more than a few moments of somebodys time But you are looking at one isolated crime,we all know they are guilty,but they will suffer for a long time rather than becoming martyers,if you dish out the justice that you seem to so want then you will have to apply it across the board and that is when it becomes a certainty that a mistake will be made and an innocent human will die. Would you be prepared to execute someone for the state by shooting them?,after all a .22 to the back of the head will do the trick,but if you want to be certain i am sure you could ask for .223 I do agree with one of the posters that sentences should be served consecutively Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
four-wheel-drive Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 (edited) There is a strange irony in some of the relies, this being a shooting forum. Most members will be acting as judge and jury every time they go out with a gun. when a fox kills your chicken, what do you do? give it a warning? cage it for life? or deal with it and move on. The blokes in question selected a victim, ran him down with a car and butchered him. The consequences should not be the cause of endless expence or debate, or even take more than a few moments of somebodys time The problem is in the case that you are talking about the people doing it was expecting to be shot and killed by the police that is why they waited for the police to arrive and then ran at them waving guns and knives they did not expect the police to shoot them in the legs I still do not understand quite why they did that but for them to be killed is making them in to martyrs in there strange minds the one thing that they do not want is to be locked up for the rest of there life what irony. Edited June 9, 2013 by four-wheel-drive Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
unapalomablanca Posted June 9, 2013 Report Share Posted June 9, 2013 without meaning to cause offence i wonder, if so many people think liberals are in the right enough to put all these "liberals" in all the jobs you claim they have and give them so much power to "crush the right wing thinking like a butterfly" do you think it could be because few people think the politics of the far right make any sense. this is a question not a declaration of love for any politics right or left You made a big error in your post, i made no mention of the 'far right', that is something that is completely different to what i am trying to get at. You may have had your head turned by the lefty thought police, as any mention of 'right wing' is propaganded into 'far right wing', by these cretins. If anything has been extreme, its the 'hard left' we have been under for years, we were promised after the abolition of the death penalty, that all murders would mean prison till the day the murderer dies. The truth is they have reneged spectacularly on this promise to the people, and now we have the disgusting outcome of an average 12 year joke of a 'life sentence'. Couple this with the deliberate destruction of the country through mass immigration, then i think its obvious who the extremists have been. Any reversal of their hideous betrayals would have to be extreme as a response. The answer to your question is, there are many millions of normal right wing people who are suppressed daily by those in positions of authority. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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