Brancaster

[ayano3]

That's about once every three days, unless my maths fail me, always a possibility.

 

I thought I was going far more often than could be considered sensible, once a week, every week, twice sometimes.

 

You've reached a new level however, respect.

I live on the doorstep as harry says. I can be there in 20 minutes. It's possible to do 3 flights a day...morning, dinner time tide and evening flight. Lots of my trips are taking out new members and others who want to learn the marsh. My bag return is not what some would think it could be after spending so much time there but the marsh is my place to chill out and take in the wonderful views etc. My wife always asks how I got on and suggests the butchers shop would be a far better option. My views are if I see something it's a bonus. If it's within a mile of me it's another bonus. If I actually get a shot it's an added bonus and if I hit something it's a miracle.

[Ttfjlc]

I live on the doorstep as harry says. I can be there in 20 minutes. It's possible to do 3 flights a day...morning, dinner time tide and evening flight. Lots of my trips are taking out new members and others who want to learn the marsh. My bag return is not what some would think it could be after spending so much time there but the marsh is my place to chill out and take in the wonderful views etc. My wife always asks how I got on and suggests the butchers shop would be a far better option. My views are if I see something it's a bonus. If it's within a mile of me it's another bonus. If I actually get a shot it's an added bonus and if I hit something it's a miracle.

 

Gotta love the 'if i hit something its a miracle' bit!

[bobshooting]

I live on the doorstep as harry says. I can be there in 20 minutes. It's possible to do 3 flights a day...morning, dinner time tide and evening flight. Lots of my trips are taking out new members and others who want to learn the marsh. My bag return is not what some would think it could be after spending so much time there but the marsh is my place to chill out and take in the wonderful views etc. My wife always asks how I got on and suggests the butchers shop would be a far better option. My views are if I see something it's a bonus. If it's within a mile of me it's another bonus. If I actually get a shot it's an added bonus and if I hit something it's a miracle.

A good friend, one of the members of my clay-pigeon club, a game shooter, said at last Sundays meet, aah yes, wildfowling, that's the sport where you walk for hours and hours over mud, in order to stand in mud for hours and hours, and not get a shot. Then you go home covered in mud.

 

I had to laugh. I suggested that his mum and dad weren't married, and that he'd missed out that you also have to get up in the middle of the night.

 

He's cut out so what makes it superb of course, the breaking dawns, the sight and smell of it, the kind of people you meet and the kind you don't.

 

Your words about bonus are exactly correct.

[Ttfjlc]

A good friend, one of the members of my clay-pigeon club, a game shooter, said at last Sundays meet, aah yes, wildfowling, that's the sport where you walk for hours and hours over mud, in order to stand in mud for hours and hours, and not get a shot. Then you go home covered in mud.

 

I had to laugh. I suggested that his mum and dad weren't married, and that he'd missed out that you also have to get up in the middle of the night.

 

He's cut out so what makes it superb of course, the breaking dawns, the sight and smell of it, the kind of people you meet and the kind you don't.

 

Your words about bonus are exactly correct.

Remember being under the moon on New Year's Eve you knew when it was mignight as the whole coast lit up with fireworks, beautiful.

[bobshooting]

I

 

according to the charity commission the wild spaces fund lists it's activities as "CONSERVATION OF NATURE AND WILDLIFE AT OUR 6 RESERVES AT COOLING, ISLE OF GRAIN, IWADE, HALLING, MOTNEY HILL AND WESTBERE IN KENT}". and operates in Kent and Medway, so why is it buying common rights at Brancaster?, if not to take over Wildfowling currently controlled by two other clubs through the back door. How can the Kent Wildfowlers expect "to show by deed and action" ? well in following this course of action the club has nailed its colours firmly to the mast. No clubs ground can been seen as safe.

Up until reading this I'd never even heard of the Wild Spaces Fund.

 

I'm certain that they had nothing to do with the infamous Thornham Land Snatch Scandal.

 

Surely, if they are solely in the business of setting up reserves, they would be in competition with Kent and seeking to curtail shooting in Brancaster.

 

However, I remain firmly in the belief that if you shoot anywhere between Boston and Gt Yarmouth and don't own the land you use, then Kent will be watching for opportunities.

 

I'm sorely tempted to join with The Prince of Demons and ask for membership forms, Beelzebub grows in strength and ambition and my Crucifix is at the menders; any chance DNT?

[Jono 4]

Bob the wild spaces fund is set up and run by Kent Wildfowlers, I suspect with common trustees, if they were not being underhand with the potential purchase why buy it through their charity? Not in the name of the club. They have 6 of their own reserves in Kent and on the Meadway the purchase of the common rights can not be to create another one in Norfolk, so why try to make it?

[DNT]

Sounds like something out of the Mummy. Membership is open, and when we say inclusive we mean it. KWCA now have shooting in Kent, East Sussex, Essex, Cambridge and North Norfolk. Visit the website and make the best decision of the year so far. Another advert, sorry I can't help myself.

[DNT]

Jono4, WSF is the conservation arm of the KWCA. This is not a secret, anyone visiting our website can see it right there on our front page. Their strap line is People Preserving Places. Trustees are from both KWCA and Independents. KWCA have engaged the WSF to manage six sites in Kent. They deliver the stewardship and conservation work required on those flagship sites. It is the aim of both KWCA and WSF to show as most of you will know from your own work that Traditional Land Management (preserving and improving the places and allowing a sustainable harvest of the wildfowl to be taken) is the best method of sensible Conservation. KWCA have several sub- committees dealing with all sorts of projects and ideas, all reporting back to the Full Committee. It was suggested earlier that KWCA is Commercial, and I suppose in the sense of the word our setup and operations are. But the big difference is we never lose sight of our beginnings and core objectives and we make no apology for fighting the Wildfowling and Sport Shooting corner vigorously at all times.

[harrycatcat1]

I live on the doorstep as harry says. I can be there in 20 minutes. It's possible to do 3 flights a day...morning, dinner time tide and evening flight. Lots of my trips are taking out new members and others who want to learn the marsh. My bag return is not what some would think it could be after spending so much time there but the marsh is my place to chill out and take in the wonderful views etc. My wife always asks how I got on and suggests the butchers shop would be a far better option. My views are if I see something it's a bonus. If it's within a mile of me it's another bonus. If I actually get a shot it's an added bonus and if I hit something it's a miracle.

 

That about sums it up for me too

 

Regards

 

H

[anser2]

DNT I am not a member or ever have been a member of Thornham Wildfowlers so I have not suffered any direct loss. My loss is coming from your club into the county pushing up the sporting rents in the county.

 

In am almost ashamed to mention it given the actions of your club , but I was born in Kent , but have lived in Norfolk since I was a kid of 7 , so almost a local. I fail to see why your club has any interest in buying shooting in Norfolk or any county away from your traditional home ground. Unless you wish to become a country wide club taking shooting where ever you can get it from fowlers who had shot the ground for years. I have no wish to wildfowl on the Kent marshes , the shooting should be for Kentish wildfowlers so why come here. And do not say to save Norfolk wildfowling because that is just not true. Wildfowling would have continued at Thornhan if you had got the marsh or not .

 

Quote “I said at the beginning of this post, we understand your hurt and loss, but surely it's time to accept at least some of the blame and stop making accusations that you know are at best mistaken and at worse misleading.”

 

I am not hurt or suffered any loss so how you can suggest I should accept some of the blame is quite beyond me. And I would suggest its you that are acting like a politician and making mistaken and misleading statements.

 

Quote “I merely make the comment in order to remind everyone that by choosing not to be you cut out one very big aid when you find yourself in a difficult situation.”

 

Now that sounds very much like a threat.

 

 

Quote “ But the big difference is we never lose sight of our beginnings and core objectives and we make no apology for fighting the Wildfowling and Sport Shooting corner vigorously at all times”

 

Well you and your club were very silent when BASC failed to fight to keep greylag off the GL. A species that Dr Harrison and others worked so hard to restablish as a native breeding goose.

 

 

Quote “I know you all talk about your relationship at a local level, well try to think nationally before you decide who are your real friends.”

 

Well it’s not Kent WA.

 

DNT it appears that you have come on here as the mouth peace and spin doctor for your club and it just does not wash and with every word you print making the position of your club worse in the eyes of the wildfowling community.

[DNT]

Answr2, I fear we are so far apart in our ideas for the future of Wildfowling that we will never agree on much at all, which is a shame. I do take exception to your accusation about my mistaken and misleading comments, I assume you are referring to Thornham. I fail to see if you are not very close to the Thornham club, how you could make such comments, because you would have no knowledge of the discussions that took place. I would because I was there. You say Wildfowling would have continued at Thornham with or without our intervention and that may very well be true, but not by the Thornham club and not open to anyone who was not in a private syndicate. You seem to blame KWCA for your rising costs and again this may be partly true, but again we are responding to a market place where land that you yourself said was once worthless and now commands serious money is the norm. We must either match other groups on price or loose more land from traditional Wildfowling.

Your comments concerning NE, BASC and Greylag geese are also misleading, we made a full response to the consultation and had several discussions with other groups, but were unable to persuade them to support our position. But let's be honest we were always going to be up against it with the NFU, CLA and most other organisations in favour of Greys going on the GL. We also at KWCA worked alongside others to reintroduce the Grey to our shores and as well as releasing geese locally for several years, we had a complete ban on shooting them for a long time. Unfortunately I know several shooters ( non Wildfowlers) who will be delighted if they can shoot Greys all year. We can't even agree on that amongst ourselves.

Finally you say that our actions and any comments I have made make for a worst position for KWCA in the Wildfowling community. Well judging from the comments we have received from all around the country and enquiries for membership that have followed, I would respectfully suggest that you are in the minority on that one. Once again that is your prerogative.

[bobshooting]

Bob the wild spaces fund is set up and run by Kent Wildfowlers, I suspect with common trustees, if they were not being underhand with the potential purchase why buy it through their charity? Not in the name of the club. They have 6 of their own reserves in Kent and on the Meadway the purchase of the common rights can not be to create another one in Norfolk, so why try to make it?

Why would they want a new Reserve in Brancaster? They have to be after the Rights. One has to admire their professionalism; you can bet any proposal they may make will be well thought out and attractive to anyone with Sporting Rights and it won't just be the money they can spend.

 

The clubs along the North Norfolk Coast are small and independent. That's fine until an aggressive outsider, whoever they may be, comes along with an offer small and independent can't match.

 

Once it happens, I can assure you, it's no good coming on here to complain; it's been tried, didn't work worth a damn.

 

Times are changing in Norfolk, I don't want to change with them, I liked things fine just as they were, but maybe I'll have to.

 

On the other hand, maybe you're just being paranoid.............but are you being paranoid enough?

[House Boat]

DNT I am not a member or ever have been a member of Thornham Wildfowlers so I have not suffered any direct loss. My loss is coming from your club into the county pushing up the sporting rents in the county.[/font][/background]

 

In am almost ashamed to mention it given the actions of your club , but I was born in Kent , but have lived in Norfolk since I was a kid of 7 , so almost a local. I fail to see why your club has any interest in buying shooting in Norfolk or any county away from your traditional home ground. Unless you wish to become a country wide club taking shooting where ever you can get it from fowlers who had shot the ground for years. I have no wish to wildfowl on the Kent marshes , the shooting should be for Kentish wildfowlers so why come here?

 

In a word anasa2 "PINKFEET" pure and simple, its a case of "simple haves and have nots" Good luck Kent I would think you have little or no idea what pinkfeet can turn members into!! Unfortunately the looser will Norfolk Pinkfeet.

Edited June 26, 2014 by House Boat

[scolopax]

Why would they want a new Reserve in Brancaster? They have to be after the Rights. One has to admire their professionalism; you can bet any proposal they may make will be well thought out and attractive to anyone with Sporting Rights

The conservation "wing" of Kent Wildfowlers, the Wild Spaces Fund has acquired a quarter share of a single commons right for Brancaster marshes

 

The question, which DNT is repeatedly dodging, is why ? It cannot be to establish a reserve.

[IEH]

As a registered charity with income exceeding £10,000 wouldn't the Wild Spaces Fund require permission from the Charity Commission to amend their charitable objects?

[6.5x55SE]

DNT I am not a member or ever have been a member of Thornham Wildfowlers so I have not suffered any direct loss. My loss is coming from your club into the county pushing up the sporting rents in the county.[/font][/background]

 

In am almost ashamed to mention it given the actions of your club , but I was born in Kent , but have lived in Norfolk since I was a kid of 7 , so almost a local. I fail to see why your club has any interest in buying shooting in Norfolk or any county away from your traditional home ground. Unless you wish to become a country wide club taking shooting where ever you can get it from fowlers who had shot the ground for years. I have no wish to wildfowl on the Kent marshes , the shooting should be for Kentish wildfowlers so why come here?

 

In a word anasa2 "PINKFEET" pure and simple, its a case of "simple haves and have nots" Good luck Kent I would think you have little or no idea what pinkfeet can turn members into!! Unfortunately the looser will Norfolk Pinkfeet.

100% True HB. Also there are plenty of Clubs who have membership available and Far Far more Pinks than Thornham or Brancaster has these days so why are Kent claiming there getting so much support and new members !!!!! Is it because they are selling there club as having the " finest Pinkfeet Goose shooting in Europe " and numbers up to 100 thousand !!!!! I've seen and spoke to a few Kent members looking for those mystery elusive Pinks. Long gone are the days when the sky from Hunston to Holkham was laced for 2-3 hrs with Pinks.And anybody with local knowledge will know why. To much shooting pressure and Kent are for sure adding to it. I predicted what would happen at Brancaster 4-6yrs 90% Pinks gone and that's what happened Thornham the same.

[anser2]

Quote “I assume you are referring to Thornham. I fail to see if you are not very close to the Thornham club, how you could make such comments, because you would have no knowledge of the discussions that took place. I would because I was there.”

 

Of course I have no knowledge of your face to face discussions with the landowner , but the N Norfolk is a tight community and many other parties from Thornham from the fowlers, RSPB and other locals , were also in the know about what was going on and talked to me. Given your present underhand tatics at Brancaster I know who I would rather beleve.

 

 

Quote”You seem to blame KWCA for your rising costs and again this may be partly true, but again we are responding to a market place where land that you yourself said was once worthless and now commands serious money is the norm.”

 

Wrong. In Norfolk the money your club flashed about is not the norm in Norfolk. But if might become the norm in the future if your club continues its present tatics. Its present pratice is great for Kent WA members , but a serious threat to every other wildfowler in the county.

 

Quote” our comments concerning NE, BASC and Greylag geese are also misleading, we made a full response to the consultation and had several discussions with other groups”

 

Its good that Kent WA made objections to BASCs position on greylags , but I would guess that was in private as there was little if anything about the subject on any of the wildfowling forums where a major attempt was made to keep greylags of the GL.

 

Quote” Finally you say that our actions and any comments I have made make for a worst position for KWCA in the Wildfowling community. Well judging from the comments we have received from all around the country and enquiries for membership that have followed, I would respectfully suggest that you are in the minority on that one. “

 

Of course I cant know about all these statements of support your are receiving , but in public that is not the case. Discounting Kent WA members there are very few posts of support for your position on this forum.

 

The manner of your communications is very similar to the way BASC attempted to defend their position over greylag but when what they were saying was looked closely it was clear they were acting on badly researched data . What you are saying is coming from internal Kent Wa sources and as such cannot be researched being not in the public domain . Just read the posts above and clearly I am not in a minority of one.

Edited June 26, 2014 by anser2

[DNT]

Nobody claimed you were a minority of one, just a minority. We at KWCA are happy that we acted in the best interest of future Wildfowling. Given the situation, we would have come to Thornham with or without the pinks. We spend most of our time tide flighting teal and wigeon. Of course we have Greys and Canada's in increasing numbers along with a few pinks ( red letter day) and Whitefronts (nearly a red letter day). Our members enjoy the sport as a whole, obviously people will travel to Thornham in the hope of a pink, but with a bag limit in place even if they hit the flight of flights no one can get overexcited and go overboard. I don't know what the future holds for Wildfowling, but I do know that unless we find some neutral ground and the majority stand firm together, our enemies need do very little because we'll push the self destruct button and save them the bother. I guess in the end we will all have to let history be our judge.

[DNT]

Stalkerboydy, of course we're not getting members by claiming Thornham is goose heaven. People are joining because they want a chance to shoot and that's what we give them and lots of it. We listen to our members and if we see a trend, such as airgunning we do our best to provide it. A quick glance at our website shows our members have several options, and they can join the Full Membership or any sub- section that interests them. Our large land holding gives us that opportunity and we do all in our power to retain the old and bring in the new. How can anyone truly claim to be helping Wildfowling or any other field sport for that matter if they operate a closed shop to all but a selected few. Obviously there are some clubs who are limited by the size of their land holdings (owned or leased) but most could do something for newcomers or would be guests and thankfully several do. But who can blame any frustrated fowler who languishes on a waiting list for years with very little chance of actually getting on the marsh from joining a strong vibrant club like KWCA. People like to be around success of any sort and bask in the rewards. Like or loathe us, but don't deny we have a very business like and professional approach which is bringing us members and more approaches from other clubs and landowners than we are able to assist at once, and I'm pleased to confirm as Bobshooting stated, it's not just about the money.

[6.5x55SE]

DNT.lets try looking at this at a different angle. EG Whitefronts built up to say 50 thousand on Sheppey - Shellness outsider's get in the back door and do to shooting pressure moved them slowly they built up to good numbers and along comes EG and Norfolk club not only do you loss your shooting but again do to shooting pressure the Whitefronts all but leave the area !!!! I know some Kent members of which I class as good friends and each season I hear them moaning about the commercial and private shooting having a terrible effect on there sport. So can't you see your now doing in Norfolk what your members are having done in Kent. Also as I've already stated there are plenty of Clubs your members could have applied to join and with a bit of hard work got day tickets for others. As HB stated Pinks do funny things to some people eg get a Pink at any cost. I've taken high shots I should never have done but the high shooting has increased at Thornham. A long with people let's just say not acting in the right manner. I won't go into details on here but last season the was a incident involving a Chinese Water Deer at Thornham !!!!!!!!

[Ttfjlc]

DNT.lets try looking at this at a different angle. EG Whitefronts built up to say 50 thousand on Sheppey - Shellness outsider's get in the back door and do to shooting pressure moved them slowly they built up to good numbers and along comes EG and Norfolk club not only do you loss your shooting but again do to shooting pressure the Whitefronts all but leave the area !!!! I know some Kent members of which I class as good friends and each season I hear them moaning about the commercial and private shooting having a terrible effect on there sport. So can't you see your now doing in Norfolk what your members are having done in Kent. Also as I've already stated there are plenty of Clubs your members could have applied to join and with a bit of hard work got day tickets for others. As HB stated Pinks do funny things to some people eg get a Pink at any cost. I've taken high shots I should never have done but the high shooting has increased at Thornham. A long with people let's just say not acting in the right manner. I won't go into details on here but last season the was a incident involving a Chinese Water Deer at Thornham !!!!!!!!

'As HB stated Pinks do funny things to some people eg get a Pink at any cost' this is true, my dad once witnessed a punch up on the marsh over a shot pink!

Edited June 26, 2014 by Ttfjlc

[DNT]

Stalkerboydy. There is no doubt private shooting on ponds, some of which is commercial is a problem in many areas now. When I think of the number of these that have popped up around me, it's staggering. I think the point is that if high standards are observed there's no reason to worry about things. The problem is their not all observing high standards. The BASC guides/codes are very useful, but they are just guides with very little in the way of teeth. On the point of other memberships being available, several of our members are in other clubs around the country. But I don't want that to stand in the way of why we came to Thornham in the first place. I have posted the reasoning and don't propose to go over it again. I know you are concerned about overshooting, but we have a strict permit system in place to monitor that. In addition we have been told by some locals who dare to talk to us that the marsh is being shot less now. Obviously I can't confirm that and nor can anyone else truthfully, but I would have thought that a club of 40, whose members live in or very close to the village and with no restrictions on their use would have been on the marsh a lot more than guys who in the main have to travel some considerable distance. Therefore I don't see any comparison with what some people are doing in Kent. I am disturbed to read your report about the deer, which is the first I've heard of it. I can only repeat earlier postings, that we take very seriously the standard of behaviour of our members and if this matter had been bought to our attention it would have been and still could be fully investigated. I believe the onus is on all sportsman to report any transgressions and not look the other way. We are not a club of short term knee jerk reactions, everything we are involved in is under constant review, and we do not hesitate to change things if the need arises.

[Jono 4]

The conservation "wing" of Kent Wildfowlers, the Wild Spaces Fund has acquired a quarter share of a single commons right for Brancaster marshes

The question, which DNT is repeatedly dodging, is why ? It cannot be to establish a reserve.

Can we have an answer?

[DNT]

Sorry Jono4, not at this time. I have already posted our policy on confidentiality. We issue press releases when and if we have something to say. We are constantly linked to many transactions (real and imagined) and we will not make any comments to confirm or deny our involvement until the appropriate time. I am not dodging the question, I am simply refusing to answer at this moment in time. I would ask members of the forum to respect that position for the time being.

[bobshooting]

Any one on here hold rights at Brancaster?