saddler Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 2.8 = semi & pump ONLY The proviso at the end is to cover ALL such semi/pumps - irrespective of whether they are on SGC or FAC Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 There are two sections which state that a section 1 shotgun is any smooth bored gun with a barrel length greater than 24" and a barrel diameter no greater than 2" (no stipulation on overall length), however that is superseded should the smooth bore gun be either a self loading or pump action gun which must not have a barrel length less than 24" and an overall length less than 40". According to the wording of the act an SxS or OU could be chopped off behind the pistol grip and remain legal providing that the length from the breach face to muzzle is greater than 24". The legislation is poorly worded and as with all these things there are many sub clauses and 'subject to' elements. Some extracts from the act taken from this link http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/1968/27 This section applies to every firearm except— [F1(a)a shot gun within the meaning of this Act, that is to say a smooth-bore gun (not being an air gun) which— (i)has a barrel not less than 24 inches in length and does not have any barrel with a bore exceeding 2 inches in diameter;......... (With a further sub clause superseding this.......) any self-loading or pump-action smooth-bore gun which is not [F13an air weapon or] chambered for .22 rim-fire cartridges and either has a barrel less than 24 inches in length or F14. . . is less than 40 inches in length overall; Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TDS Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Copied and pasted from Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sawed-off_shotgun United Kingdom[edit]Shotguns held on a shotgun certificate are subject to a legal minimum barrel length of 24 inches (61cm), but there is no limit on overall length meaning that 'pistol grip only' shotguns are legal, though the barrels would be longer than most 'sawn-off shotguns'. Shotguns held on a shotgun certificate must either have no magazine, or a non-removable magazine capable of holding no more than two rounds. Semi-automatic or pump action shotguns held on a firearms certificate (which are not subject to any magazine restrictions) are subject both to a minimum barrel length of 24 inches (61cm) and a minimum overall length of 40 inches (102cm). This precludes legal ownership of 'short' shotguns of this type on a firearms certificate. Shotguns held on a firearms certificate that are neither semi-automatic nor pump action are subject only to a minimum barrel length of 12 inches (30cm), well within the definition of a 'sawn-off shotgun'. Muzzleloading guns are exempt from this restriction and may have barrels of any length ----------------------------------------------- Therefore it seems you can chop the stock if the above is correct Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TONY R Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Saddler and TDS and others are right oal of gun is only self loading shotguns not single shot/ doubles etc, barrel length on shotgun cert a minimum of 24 inch. Such guns if on an FAC barrels can be 12 inch or more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jaymo Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Saddler is indeed correct- otherwise them poor cowboy action group peeps are in trouble with their coach guns. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 So I can now cut the stock off my 25" barelled SxS? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 So I can now cut the stock off my 25" barelled SxS? If you fancy that sort of style then you certainly could, really not sure what benefit it would bring you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 So I can now cut the stock off my 25" barelled SxS? Aye - but ONLY if you buy a hog-leg holster off me for it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 (edited) If you fancy that sort of style then you certainly could, really not sure what benefit it would bring you. It would make a wonderfully concealable weapon which is exactly what the act precludes. Aye - but ONLY if you buy a hog-leg holster off me for it Now that's an idea, could you make a shoulder holster rig? Edited February 16, 2016 by TIGHTCHOKE Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry136 Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Can't wait to hear what the Firearms licencing Dept make of this one! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Me too! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 It would make a wonderfully concealable weapon which is exactly what the act precludes. Now that's an idea, could you make a shoulder holster rig? S2 with 24" barrels & a chopped stock is still a lot longer than my .22 Browning carbine when fully assembled and BOTH are a lot longer than the B/P revolvers I've owned recently Not sure of the point of the argument? In your case an IWB would be better for a 6'o'clock carry Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saddler Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Reading never was a strong point in some classes at my old school. BUT Anyone think that the Police will come up with a contrary view, please write to your local FLO & scan their written replies in here: we'll all NEED them to argue the case for all these new illegal "sawn-off's" that will be created.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Can't wait to hear what the Firearms licencing Dept make of this one! Share it with them and report back what they say. I'm popping in to see my FEO for a brew shortly and will ask him too. Just for the record can you highlight the bit in the firearms act that says it isn't against the rules? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 It would make a wonderfully concealable weapon which is exactly what the act precludes. As with so many bits of the act it is inconsistent Dave and it is bewildering as to why there is a difference, but there is. Just thinking out loud i have a 20b with 26" barrels and a junior stock, i reckon that gun may be less than 40" straight from the manufacturer. I shall measure it and see. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TONY R Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 As with so many bits of the act it is inconsistent Dave and it is bewildering as to why there is a difference, but there is. Just thinking out loud i have a 20b with 26" barrels and a junior stock, i reckon that gun may be less than 40" straight from the manufacturer. I shall measure it and see. If its a youth escort with all the spacers and the rubber removed it is in spec, i measured the one the kids had when i got it a few years ago. Has all the spacers and a long rubber back on it now, i am the only one uses it now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 (edited) If its a youth escort with all the spacers and the rubber removed it is in spec, i measured the one the kids had when i got it a few years ago. Has all the spacers and a long rubber back on it now, i am the only one uses it now.It is an OU, i shall have a look shortly. I assume the youth escort is either semi or pump so it must be 40" or more. Edit: the wee OU is 42" overall. Edited February 16, 2016 by grrclark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 So all these junior guns 24" barrels and 12 1/2" lop guns are illegal then you would have thought there be a few shooting school owner in jail by now after there regular inspections etc! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Share it with them and report back what they say. I'm popping in to see my FEO for a brew shortly and will ask him too. Just for the record can you highlight the bit in the firearms act that says it isn't against the rules? What did he say? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old farrier Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Hi When you do it take the barrel of a bit at a time try it you may find the muzzle blast a shock settle on the barrel length before you trim the stock found about 26was livable tru cylinder obviously It's only £40 and I bet you can get scrapers all day long for a tenner if you don't like the stock length Just a thought Maybe team out the chambers to 3.1/2 for the extra buzz 😀😀😂😂 Perfect for snare checking 😇 Best of luck Of Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impala59 Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 I believe that the relevant paragraph in the firearms licencing guide is 2.9 which states that "overall length is not a relevant factor in traditional single and double barrel guns but barrels less than 24" would be subject to section 1" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 I think you'd have to be Brahms and Liszt to be Chopin the barrel . . . . . . . . I'll get my coat ................. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Underdog Posted February 16, 2016 Author Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 I think you'd have to be Brahms and Liszt to be Chopin the barrel . . . . . . . . I'll get my coat ................. Don't you start with riddles too, the law is complicated enough! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
malkiserow Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 Don't you start with riddles too, the law is complicated enough! I thought I'd tempo the fever pitch Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grrclark Posted February 16, 2016 Report Share Posted February 16, 2016 What did he say? I didn't mean shortly as in tonight, my bad for not making that clear. Actually popping in to have a blether about the licensing debacle, we had a good yap on the phone and he was telling me some interesting things, but most likely next week before I will see him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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