bigman Posted August 29, 2016 Report Share Posted August 29, 2016 (edited) Can anybody shed any light on these marks and what the marks on chamber area are Thankyou Edited August 29, 2016 by bigman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glenlivet Posted August 29, 2016 Report Share Posted August 29, 2016 Have a look here http://www.shotguns.se/html/uk.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
matone Posted August 29, 2016 Report Share Posted August 29, 2016 1925-1954 Birmingham Proof .Provisional Proof marks on tubes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigman Posted August 30, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 That's great cheers guys , anybody know much about Jeffrey's of Guildford ? There's not a lot of info on the net Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B25Modelman Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 That's great cheers guys , anybody know much about Jeffrey's of Guildford ? There's not a lot of info on the net http://www.exploringsurreyspast.org.uk/GetRecord/SHCOL_7059 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Boggy Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 If that`s the serial number on the barrels i.e. 5135, then according to Nigel Brown, it was made/sold around 1924/25. Again, according to Brown -: "This Guildford business was originally Richard Jeffery first recorded in 1850. Samuel Richard was then recorded c.1883 and it was certainly still going in the late 1980s perhaps into the 1990s. The various Jeffery businesses in the West Country and the south of England were all at some stage related. Latterly post WW11 this Guildford business was using Webley & Scott barrels and actions for many of its guns or even having them made up entirely and retailing them in association with their name. Sometimes the Webley No. was used in conjunction with the Jeffery one." Also Brown records -: "Richard Jeffery,17High St,Guildford,Surrey 1850, 137 High St. 1857-c78, Samuel Richard Jeffery s.a.c1883-c1909, S.R.Jeffery & Son s.a. c1913-c32, S.R.Jeffery & Son Ltd.s.a.c1934-57, 134 High St. by1963-82, Jefferys of Guildford s.a. by 1984-88 (q.v.A.R.& H.V. Jeffery Ltd)" The address on the rib should tie the date down to one of the above. Some more pictures of the gun and/or confirmation of the serial number would be most interesting. Hope the above helps. OB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
B25Modelman Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 (edited) Think 1971...I bought my first shotgun, a Baikal single for £15, it was a private transaction and from a guy living in Farnham. I only owned it for a short period wanting to 'up my game' to a sbs double which I bought around 1973 from my aunties catalogue, Kay's (more below). Yes, back then shotguns were sold out of those weekly pay catalogues. One sbs double led to another and another (the last a Sable) until I came upon the world of over and unders. To get to my point, at that time good friend and mate, Steve (now departed), also decided that he wanted to get a gun so he made a trip S R Jeffery, Guildford for a look see and by pure chance on a very good day. Jeffery's had just received, on that day, an AYA 25 sidelock (25" barrels) which had been ordered by a well to do business man who had, a week or so before, been committed for financial fraud so he was not going to be around to finalise the deal. So Jefferey's were lumbered with a high value gun that would probably sit in their rack for many months, if not years. Steve was there, he had heard the story/problem, was hooked, made an offer and they accepted. I wish I could remember what he paid but for sure it was a lovely gun, cased and with all the bling. I also wish I knew what happened to that gun following his early departure from this planet. Ref the first catalogue gun. My auntie ordered it for me but one week later it had not arrived, two weeks later still no gun. The catalogue confirmed it had been shipped. Three weeks later, I happened to open the door to an old, rarely entered, shed at the bottom of our garden and what should be stood there leaning against the wall but a cardboard box....yes, it was the gun. The posty must have delivered it on a day nobody was home and popped it into the shed without leaving his calling card. Unfortunately that gun had to be returned because the right barrel had an upward sweep at its very end. Confirmed by eccentric circles up the bore. It was replaced and the replacement was not lost. I have the original Guarantee and manufacturers certificates for both guns. Essex non ejectors, from the Laurona Arms Eibar factory. Also in my docs I have this photograph, S Jeffery Watch & Clock Maker and R Jeffery Gun Maker at 15 and 16 the Borough Farnham in 1885. There must have been some connection. Edited August 30, 2016 by B25Modelman Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunman Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 1905 / 1924 Birmingham proof .2&1/2" or 1&1/8 oz of shot. Cant quite make out the letters CH& ?? which is probably the makers mark .The 51 and the 35 are id marks stamped by one of several Birmingham repair shops if for instance the barrels had been re-blacked or had other work done and the blacker had in the region of 80 to 100 pair of barrels a week it was easy to get them mixed hence some shops put these codes on the barrels and action flats . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 Who's a LUCKY boy then! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Old Boggy Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 1905 / 1924 Birmingham proof .2&1/2" or 1&1/8 oz of shot. Cant quite make out the letters CH& ?? which is probably the makers mark .The 51 and the 35 are id marks stamped by one of several Birmingham repair shops if for instance the barrels had been re-blacked or had other work done and the blacker had in the region of 80 to 100 pair of barrels a week it was easy to get them mixed hence some shops put these codes on the barrels and action flats . Thanks for clarifying the barrel marks Gunman, I thought wrongly that they constituted the serial number. The info I gave regarding serial number / date of manufacture is therefore incorrect. Sorry Bigman. Out of interest, what is the serial number on the action flats ? This might then give the approximate date of manufacture. OB Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigman Posted August 30, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 Great infomation guys thank you I'll get some better quality pics of the full gun up asap she's rather nice but lots of pitting in the 30in barrels and on the action I'm going to get it check out before I give her a shoot , Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
panoma1 Posted August 30, 2016 Report Share Posted August 30, 2016 (edited) 1905 / 1924 Birmingham proof .2&1/2" or 1&1/8 oz of shot. Cant quite make out the letters CH& ?? which is probably the makers mark .The 51 and the 35 are id marks stamped by one of several Birmingham repair shops if for instance the barrels had been re-blacked or had other work done and the blacker had in the region of 80 to 100 pair of barrels a week it was easy to get them mixed hence some shops put these codes on the barrels and action flats . It may be my eyes but I can't see any CH&?? Mark???...but I can see a CHOKE..... Edited August 30, 2016 by panoma1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigman Posted August 31, 2016 Author Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 Done my best with the pics there off the iPad, she's not in the mood for taking pictures ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Walker570 Posted August 31, 2016 Report Share Posted August 31, 2016 I'd bet that gun could write a few good books on it's escapades. Hope you get it fettled up sufficiently to enjoy shooting with it. I own a couple of shotguns of that era and a little earlier and try to take them out for a walk at least once a season. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 From what i can see. The 12C in the diamond is the gauge of the shotgun. ( 12 bore cartridges - standard chamber ) The 13's stamped on the tubes further up indicate that when proofed the 13 gauge wooden plug fitted to a depth of 9 inches from the breach face. The bore measurement 9 inches from the breach when made should have been somewhere around .710 - somewhere around because these plugs gave a ball park figure not a definitive numerical value. This is useful information to know as if you measured the bores now with a bore micrometer at 9 inches from the breach face you would get a reading; this reading would tell you how much work has been done to the inside of the barrels since new - over time pitts are lapped out and over cleaning can wear the bores - If the value is more than 10 thousands of an inch than the .710 value it was proofed at the gun is out of proof. An out of proof gun is not necessarily dangerous but is illegal to sell. The choke stamp is self explanatory it informs that there is a degree of constriction in the boring of the barrel towards the muzzle. To accurately measure the chokes you can use the same tool ( bore micrometer ) inserted to a depth of 14 inches from the muzzle and the collar tightened so as to give a reading; the collar is slackened off and pulled slowly out of the barrel till it just gives a reading and the difference between these two measurements is you choke measured in thousands of an inch. 0.005 = Improved Cylinder. 0.010 = Quarter Choke. 0.020 = Half Choke 0.030 = Three Quarter Choke 0.040 = Full Choke. Marks on the tubes are provisional proofs. - Just marks put on the gun early on to save gun makers working on barrels with flaws in them. The remaining marks. BV surmounted by a crown. - Birmingham mark for view proof - Barrels are carefully examined for quality - poorly worked barrels are rejected at this stage. BP surmounted by a crown. - Birmingham definitive proof mark. NP surmounted by a crown. - Birmingham mark for barrels proofed for Nitro powders. Didn't know that the numbers on the flats were reference numbers for workshops - cool to know! If people are interested in learning about proof marks - The gun and its development by the gun maker Greener it is the best reference book - pages 288 on wards will give you all the info you need fortunately the book has been made available online and can be found at this link. https://archive.org/details/gunitsdevelopmen00greerich Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigman Posted September 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Cheers buddy very interesting reading thank you Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted September 1, 2016 Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Crying shame it will not fit you Mate, bring it up and I will look after it for you! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigman Posted September 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted September 1, 2016 Crying shame it will not fit you Mate, bring it up and I will look after it for you! Nice try buddy I'll work around its smallness ;-) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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