Request for advice.

[PeakeR456]

Please can I get some advice regarding the DryFire simulation system and professional coaching?

I am thinking of investing in a complete DryFire system, I want to compete at a higher Level in Sporting, Skeet and OT.

I understand that it is no substitute for shooting live, however, I can’t afford and I don’t have the opportunity to shoot the amount of targets that I want to.  With the DryFire system I would shoot every day.  I would still shoot every Sunday live at CPSA registered shoots.  My aspersion is to get a coach to work with me once a month (A coach that could take me from a B shot to AA shot).  

As you can probably tell I want to be a competitive shotgun shot and I am finding that I am not improving at the rate I want to due to cost and time.  I love this sport it’s fantastic, therefore, I am happy to invest in things that work.

Questions

Is it realistic with lead and clay presentation? 

Has the system improved your scores across all disciplines?

Has anyone used the course design software to set clays that they struggle with and it has fixed there problems?

Can anyone recommend a high calibre coach that has a proven track record in the Devon region, that would take me from a B class shot to AA shot and beyond? 

Any advice you can provide me would be greatly appreciated.

Regards Richie

Edited August 12, 2018 by PeakeR456

[V8 90]

.

Edited August 12, 2018 by V8 90

[Gordon R]

Richie - aside from the large font - which is off-putting - I am a bit confused. You don't have the money to shoot as much as you would like, but can afford to shoot once a week and pay a coach. Given the additional cost of the Dry Fire Simulator - you need plenty of room and darkness - I would have thought you would be better getting some lessons. No coach can ensure you go from B to AA and beyond. To get to AA and beyond, you need some natural ability.

As V8 90 says - try one of the three - skeet or sporting would be easier than OT.

There are a couple of grounds in North Devon with decent coaches.

[PeakeR456]

Gordon,  Sorry for the font, I cut and pasted the tex from a set of notes I have.  

To clarify and stop any confusion, to shoot 100 to 150 birds each day would be ridiculously expensive,  however,  I can afford to shoot every Sunday and do.  I would like invest in a coach if my results increased.  

Over time say 3 months with DryFire system would have paid for itself (equivalently).  

I want to be a top shot, so it comes down to nature or nurture.  Surly a top coach and a increased training rate, like any sport would progress your abilities?

hope that makes sense!

Thank you for your reply.

Edited August 12, 2018 by PeakeR456

[PeakeR456]

V8 90,

I shoot in the  armed service and emergency service league which Concentrate on English sporting, however, when we shoot with other international (US) elements they consecrate on Skeet and OT.  I am ok at Sporting but would like an understanding of the other disciplines which is why I though DryFire could fix this.

Thank you for your reply.

[Westley]

It may be worth considering how many of the British Teams use this method for training 

[Hamster]

Hi Richie, 

Do you know of a top level golfer, racing driver,  fighter pilot, clay pigeon shooter (in any discipline),  jockey,  skier or tennis player who managed to get there via computer simulation games ? 

I certainly don't, I had to google what DryFire looked like but can tell you there would be a world of difference between actual targets and those, even putting aside the variations you will encounter out in the field such as wind, weather, visibility and of course the terrain, the fact remains that the physical skill of breaking a given target is barely half your trouble(s). There is just soooooo much more to putting in the kinds of scores that will place you in AA than such simulations can offer, many (even relatively gifted) people don't manage it in their life time despite shooting every week. Lets not even get into the technical side such as recoil management, the guns suitability (as opposed to fit alone), your subconscious getting in tune with the various sight pictures (which will in turn depend on target distances/orientations/speeds/etc/etc), even the time it takes for pellets to get to the target area will be different to an electronic signal; this aspect may in fact hinder you if anything. 

Sorry to sound unhelpful but if you truly want to get better there is no substitute for real world competition "experience", one of the hardest things to learn for instance is hitting easy targets (or not missing them). By all means invest in the system but at best it will be an aid in speeding up the "muscle memory" phase, as others have said AA needs a bit of natural talent too in any case, volume alone won't necessarily help.

[PeakeR456]

Thank you for your honesty.  This is what I wanted  genuine opinions.  I would like get someone opinion from someone who has had one.

[B&W FOX]

Sporting is not an Olympic Competition. You need to find a ground that shoots Skeet or Trap and the layouts and targets are regulated.

One clay is all it takes from qualifying  or  getting into the squad for winning or not. It not just about the shooting side of things its about your mental ability and how to move forward and stay focused. Every clay you call is your first not number 53 or 74, concentration is everything

https://www.issf-sports.org/news_multimedia/video.ashx

At the top of their game!

 

 

[Gordon R]

Hamster has it nailed.

[billytheghillie]

why not buy your own clay trap, promatic etc.

[welshwarrior]

Ok so three disciplines B to AA why not focus on one.  

A top coach will specialise in a discipline and will not be cheap.  

So my advice locate your disciple then find a coach you gel with very important.  I’ve just taken a C class to A class in 3 months four other coaches have failed to get him to B but we just clicked and it’s worked very fast.  That relationship is key.  

[buze]

I'm reaching the stage when I'm borderline 'good', but I know that no amount of shooting will help after a certain level, you need to find someone being able to pick holes into your shooting to bump you along. Also, I think at a certain stage, the shooting bit is less important, and it's all *in your head*. I'm sure theres a million (including me) who *technically* could shoot a 100 straight sporting, but MOST of the misses past a certain level have little to do with your shooting, they are all in preparation, concentration, and mental.

I had a single lesson with @welshwarrior and 2 minutes in he already had found a 'hole' in my shooting, something I had overlooked completely, seems simple when you think about it afterward, but it helped a lot.

I realise finding a GOOD coach is hard, I've tried quite a few, and quite frankly, most of them are entirely useless. I don't want to know what 'lead' I need, it's pointless. I want to know how to concentrate on 5 pairs, I want to know how to be able to reproduce the same shooting from pair #1 to pair #5, that sort of stuff.

[welshwarrior]

On 31/08/2018 at 22:40, buze said:

I'm reaching the stage when I'm borderline 'good', but I know that no amount of shooting will help after a certain level, you need to find someone being able to pick holes into your shooting to bump you along. Also, I think at a certain stage, the shooting bit is less important, and it's all *in your head*. I'm sure theres a million (including me) who *technically* could shoot a 100 straight sporting, but MOST of the misses past a certain level have little to do with your shooting, they are all in preparation, concentration, and mental.

I had a single lesson with @welshwarrior and 2 minutes in he already had found a 'hole' in my shooting, something I had overlooked completely, seems simple when you think about it afterward, but it helped a lot.

I realise finding a GOOD coach is hard, I've tried quite a few, and quite frankly, most of them are entirely useless. I don't want to know what 'lead' I need, it's pointless. I want to know how to concentrate on 5 pairs, I want to know how to be able to reproduce the same shooting from pair #1 to pair #5, that sort of stuff.

Buze

glad it helped and hope to see you about now I’m out and about a bit more myself again.  

[Gordon R]

Buze - it's a fair point, that is often overlooked.

[Wb123]

Assuming going from B to AA is a three year project (a wild guess), and 150 clays a week plus a lesson a month, plus fuel competition entires and travel for three years is what it will take  a dryfire system is a fairly small investment in the context of the overall likely cost (back of my beermat £400 a month for three years coming just shy of £15k, dryfire being a grand perhaps one and a half but retaining fifty percent if sold off at the end of the project, and either reducing the number of paid targets shot or reducing the time taken and overall spend).

 

I have no interest in competitive shooting, but do use every simulation aid available for my rather motor skill focused professional work. Nobody gets any good at the real thing by simulation alone but you dont get to the table without mastering the basics in simulation. There is in my experience no substitute when things get tough for hours getting slick with your kit, even if only practicing certain parts of a task. I think if i had the space and were interested in becoming a competitive shot a dryfire system would be a no brainer. To be fair if I had the space I would be tempted just for entertainment. 

[buze]

if you want to learn by repetition, just dry mount in your lounge, pointing at your wall/mirror/whatever, and do that hundreds of times if you wish -- I think that's accepted as being pretty good idea to improve your mount anyway. 

Being a techy, I would also be very very tempted by a techy short of shortcut. Whatever it takes, like shotkam etc, however, I don't think they /work/ or help that much -- I think it's more important to save time by not repeating the same mistakes over and over (you COULD, with a dry fire) but being good at analysing what you are doing wrong, and if you are lucky, find a coach to pick up on stuff you don't find by yourself.

I also thought a lot about getting a dry-fire gizmo a while back, and instead I picked up Skeet for about a year or so. Skeet is pretty much like a video game anyway, you have to handle speed/wind/angle/concentration and if you do the round by yourself, it's very quick.

My logic at the time for not getting a dry-fire system was that more than half of the shot is done by focussing on a point >=20 yards away; the dry-fire will have you focus 5 yards away (at best) so you'll never really have the same 'sight picture', you won't train your brain to pick up distances/speed. All you'll do is get good at a video game and yes perhaps you'll get better physically (altho, not on fast crossers, or pairs that involve footing changes, or birds that are over 20 degrees off the horizon, etc etc etc) but if you just want THAT part of the training, then following the lines of the ceiling in your lounge will do the same.

 

[Salopian]

To the OP , contact Andrea Roach at Dryfire , she is most helpful and will answer any of your queries.