Crowds at Nottingham Arbetorium

[Pangolin]

Someone in another thread said they wouldn't attend the Game Fair which is in July and outside, but its up to them I suppose.

As for the girl getting a ####ing for being in the park, well in that household I hope they are disinfecting all mail through the door, all groceries that come into the house that have being handled by dozens of people if they are really that concerned about it, I bet it poses a far higher risk than being outdoors.

 

 

Edited April 12, 2021 by Pangolin

[Mice!]

2 hours ago, Rewulf said:

Are tobacco companies guilty of murder , because they sell a product that is known to cause cancer

I'd say yes, still baffles me that cigarettes are allowed to be sold, almost as if people are making money from them!

2 hours ago, Rewulf said:

But...But... What if ?
How do you know they are not vulnerable , infected ?
Are you sure , why take the risk ??

How do I know my own family members aren't vulnerable?? Really!!

We actually did the lateral flow tests on the Saturday anyway just to be on the safe side, it's pretty easy these days to keep safe with people you know.

2 hours ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Keeping our young locked up like this is doing no-one any favours.

How are the young locked up? They are back at school, it's far from normal but outdoor sport has started up again, kids can and are playing outdoors.

I've actually just got back from a physio appointment,  people in beer gardens,  the gym car park was full, things are moving along nicely.

2 hours ago, udderlyoffroad said:

To pick just one example: Breast cancer treatment referrals are 33% of normal levels.  Breast cancer doesn't just give up because we're locked down.

Can't answer that one, and I agree cancer doesn't just go away. 

[Rewulf]

1 minute ago, Mice! said:

I'd say yes, still baffles me that cigarettes are allowed to be sold, almost as if people are making money from them!

Cars , yes they kill people too , and *gasp* guns ,best ban those too ?
Personal choice , absolutely lethal , that someones selfish actions might endanger someone elses life , best ban freedom of choice while were here.......

4 minutes ago, Mice! said:

We actually did the lateral flow tests on the Saturday anyway just to be on the safe side, it's pretty easy these days to keep safe with people you know.

Is it , is it really ?
Lateral flow tests are what 70 % accurate ?
People you 'know' could be asymptomatic ?

I wouldnt risk it , you might 'kill' someone 

[Scully]

3 hours ago, Rewulf said:

Its daft quotes like that , that make it so much harder keep any kind of normality in this world today.
How can we ever move on from this , when some of the population are looking suspiciously at others, particularly the young , as being stupid and reckless, and inexplicably , as 'killers' ?

People die every day from disease, some of it transmissable, are the hospitals and nursing staff 'killers' because a patient gets infected within a hospital and dies ?
Are tobacco companies guilty of murder , because they sell a product that is known to cause cancer ?
Are pharma companies guilty of medical negligence because some vaccines lead to health complications and sometimes death ?
The girl did not break the law, but she is still guilty anyway.

Twisted logic.

But...But... What if ?
How do you know they are not vulnerable , infected ?
Are you sure , why take the risk ??

 

This. I’m heartily fed up with the mentality of some folk who have obviously lost the ability to think rationally for themselves. If you want to go around in a sanitised bubble then by all means do so, but please stop telling others what they should and shouldn’t be doing. It’s irritating and not your place to do so. 
An old dear I was working for told me she was ‘allowed’ back out now! When I asked her what she meant she told me she had been told by her GP that she must stay in as much as possible til ‘all this is over’. As annoyed as I was at the arrogance of her GP, I just didn’t have the heart to tell her that she only had to shield if she wanted to, the choice was entirely hers. 
I was going into a supermarket locally, via an escalator, and a woman perhaps slightly older than me was stood in front. She had on a home made mask and was busy wiping sanitiser on her hands from a dispenser she had in a pocket. Coming towards us on the ‘up’ escalator were two young girls, chatting. Neither were wearing masks. 
The dear in front of me said to them ‘excuse me’ and then pointed at her own mask. The two girls looked at her and one said ‘ Oh **** off!’ I just burst out laughing.
I know exactly how they feel. 😀

[udderlyoffroad]

31 minutes ago, Scully said:

This. I’m heartily fed up with the mentality of some folk who have obviously lost the ability to think rationally for themselves. If you want to go around in a sanitised bubble then by all means do so, but please stop telling others what they should and shouldn’t be doing. It’s irritating and not your place to do so. 

+1

Comes back to "everyone believes what they themselves are doing to be at, or just below, the limit of acceptable".

All these people who are happy to go in supermarkets but have otherwise shut themselves away for this past year, I think are either willfully blind or just otherwise suffering from some form of myopia, about just what it takes to keep the economy moving.

As for these 'are we allowed to' merchants...I genuinely don't know what to tell them. 

You're allowed to do whatever you like, unless it is specifically prohibited by law.  And that means in the UK an act of parliament or statutory instrument, not government guidance.

There are legal systems where everything is forbidden unless specifically permitted, but the UK is not such a place.

Mind you, these are the same people, who come the lock down were ringing their FEO to ask whether they were allowed to go shooting.

[Pangolin]

Well, im in the gym, not a mask in sight, what a great sight it is.

[ordnance]

Quote

As for the girl getting a ####ing for being in the park, well in that household I hope they are disinfecting all mail through the door, all groceries that come into the house that have being handled by dozens of people if they are really that concerned about it, I bet it poses a far higher risk than being outdoors.

You can wash your hands after handling them items, you can't un-breath someone's germs / virus. 

[das]

On 02/04/2021 at 20:53, Scully said:

Yes, you’re right. I’m not making excuses for them, nor justifying it, nor condoning it. They’re kids doing what kids do, just add alcohol. 
No doubt the rozzers will take care of it. 

Kids are they? Not the kids I remember when I was one, just a bunch of young hooligans who only care how much ale they can throw down their necks, noisy and throw their rubbish all over the place. Doing what kids do?  Jist a load of sadcocks.

[Pangolin]

[Scully]

Just now, Pangolin said:

I feel your pain! 😀

4 minutes ago, das said:

Kids are they? Not the kids I remember when I was one, just a bunch of young hooligans who only care how much ale they can throw down their necks, noisy and throw their rubbish all over the place. Doing what kids do?  Jist a load of sadcocks.

Oh please! 😂

[Pangolin]

4 minutes ago, Scully said:

I feel your pain! 😀

I wish Christopher Hitchens was still alive to give his commentary on Covid. Its like pulling teeth at the min.

Edited April 12, 2021 by Pangolin

[ordnance]

Quote

An old dear I was working for told me she was ‘allowed’ back out now! When I asked her what she meant she told me she had been told by her GP that she must stay in as much as possible til ‘all this is over’. As annoyed as I was at the arrogance of her GP, I just didn’t have the heart to tell her that she only had to shield if she wanted to, the choice was entirely hers.

I doubt she is a stupit / nieve as you arrogantly think. Doctors give orders all the time, stop drinking, stop eating so much, people regularly ignore such orders / advice. I am sure she was well aware she could take or leave the doctors orders / advice. 

Quote

 I was going into a supermarket locally, via an escalator, and a woman perhaps slightly older than me was stood in front. She had on a home made mask and was busy wiping sanitiser on her hands from a dispenser she had in a pocket. Coming towards us on the ‘up’ escalator were two young girls, chatting. Neither were wearing masks. 
The dear in front of me said to them ‘excuse me’ and then pointed at her own mask. The two girls looked at her and one said ‘ Oh **** off!’ I just burst out laughing.
I know exactly how they feel

I don't see anything funny about that either, for some CEV people have being shielding its a big step for then to get out and about. Wearing a mask would show some consideration for other people, rather than people being selfish and only thinking of themselves, if the virus was killing younger people the teenagers might have a different attitude. 

Edited April 12, 2021 by ordnance

[Scully]

17 minutes ago, ordnance said:

I doubt she is a stupit / nieve as you arrogantly think. Doctors give orders all the time, stop drinking, stop eating so much, people regularly ignore such orders / advice. I am sure she was well aware she could take or leave the doctors orders / advice. 

I don't see anything funny about that either, for some CEV people have being shielding its a big step for then to get out and about. Wearing a mask would show some consideration for other people, rather than people being selfish and only thinking of themselves, if the virus was killing younger people the teenagers might have a different attitude. 

She isn’t stupid at all, she’s a well respected, former international, classically trained musician, now retired. Prior to the pandemic she was planning a solo tour of Russia at the age of 81, against her GP’s advice due to being prescribed a course of steroids for an ailment. 
We have known each other for years and I have every respect for her. She doesn’t think I’m arrogant either, actually she thinks I’m a ‘very nice man’. 🙂
Like many intelligent people, she has been scared witless by the daily, non stop hysterical scaremongering and negative outlook which has dominated our daily lives for the past year or so, and she isn’t the only one. 

The incident on the escalator took place last year, and I wasn’t wearing a mask either as we hadn’t yet entered the supermarket. The two girls didn’t need to wear masks either, and they were leaving. 
 

[ordnance]

Quote

We have known each other for years and I have every respect for her. She doesn’t think I’m arrogant either, actually she thinks I’m a ‘very nice man’. 🙂

I am sure you are 😄my point there are a lot of people out there that are at very high risk if they catch CV19 not just elderly, so i don't blame them for being cautious, or getting annoyed when they see people disregarding common sense advice. 

Edited April 12, 2021 by ordnance

[udderlyoffroad]

13 hours ago, ordnance said:

when they see people disregarding common sense advice. 

Advice.   Advice.  Not law.  And one person's definition of 'common sense' is another's definition of insanity.

 

19 hours ago, Mice! said:

How are the young locked up? They are back at school, it's far from normal but outdoor sport has started up again, kids can and are playing outdoors.

I've actually just got back from a physio appointment,  people in beer gardens,  the gym car park was full, things are moving along nicely.

You're not serious?!

They have to wear masks till May 17th for 7hours a day, despite the risks to them being minimal

Things are moving along nicely!  I honestly don't know where to begin.  It's another 5 weeks before pubs can even serve indoors.

HMP England might be fine for you, but for a lot of people it continues to cause a mental health catastrophe that will make deaths 'with' COVID look petty.

 

19 hours ago, Mice! said:

Can't answer that one, and I agree cancer doesn't just go away. 

Are you starting to get it? 

People WILL die as a direct result of this lockdown.   Whether through entirely preventable physical illnesses or through their own hand, the death toll, will, I'm convinced, dwarf the ludicrous "deaths with COVID" figure.

And all the "I'm alright Jacks" on PW and elsewhere can't even acknowledge that lockdown even has a negative side, and tell me to "Just put a mask on and don't make a fuss".

[Scully]

I’ll just leave this here: 

[Dave-G]

10 minutes ago, Scully said:

I’ll just leave this here: 

One of the best I've seen.

[Rewulf]

3 hours ago, Scully said:

I’ll just leave this here: 

And half an hour into the flight the drinks/snack trolley comes round, and everyone takes their masks off 

[Pangolin]

1 minute ago, Rewulf said:

And half an hour into the flight the drinks/snack trolley comes round, and everyone takes their masks off 

Yes but thats within the rules so you are absolutely safe, Boris and Hancock said so....haha

[Mice!]

6 hours ago, udderlyoffroad said:

You're not serious?!

They have to wear masks till May 17th for 7hours a day, despite the risks to them being minimal

Things are moving along nicely!  I honestly don't know where to begin.  It's another 5 weeks before pubs can even serve indoors.

HMP England might be fine for you, but for a lot of people it continues to cause a mental health catastrophe that will make deaths 'with' COVID look petty.

I asked my nephew the other day about having to wear a mask in school his reply was it's no big deal.

Chatting to friends with kids at high schools they've said the cases have come right down possibly because of the mask wearing,  they might not be affected by it, but they can still spread the love, have you not realised this yet, you don't have to become Ill to pass it on to other people.

I wore a mask all day Wednesday and Thursday morning doing a course, I was the only person wearing one at my desk, I did it to see what the fuss is about, you only had to wear them if moving around,  I wasn't exerting myself sitting in a classroom environment but it was no big deal, it's just a mask.

The pubs might not be open indoors but they are serving outside and people are loving it despite the cool evening temperatures,  you seem to have forgotten that the shops have reopened,  I'm sure if asked pubs or shops then the shops would win, although it might be close.

Add to this sports teams have restarted,  so you can golf, play football or go the gym, pop the shops and get a pint, that's hardly prison life is it, take a look at france or Spain see how they are getting on, I'd say again we're moving along nicely. 

6 hours ago, udderlyoffroad said:

People WILL die as a direct result of this lockdown.   Whether through entirely preventable physical illnesses or through their own hand, the death toll, will, I'm convinced, dwarf the ludicrous "deaths with COVID" figure.

And all the "I'm alright Jacks" on PW and elsewhere can't even acknowledge that lockdown even has a negative side, and tell me to "Just put a mask on and don't make a fuss".

I don't doubt that there are going to be other effects, but all treatments haven't stopped, a relative of mine found a lump after xmas, has now been through all the necessary procedures and been given the all clear, whilst we were in lockdown.

This week the caravan park has reopened,  it's been so nice seeing people milling around,  especially the old folk who have probably stayed home, they might not have been here without the lockdown or jab who knows?

Maybe things are improving and some can't see it??

And its sunny 🙂

 

 

[udderlyoffroad]

I honestly don't know where to begin with that post @Mice! 

2 hours ago, Mice! said:

have you not realised this yet, you don't have to become Ill to pass it on to other people.

I understand how an airborne virus works thanks.

I'll go further: Given there's no putting the genie back in its bottle, and that kids in the main are unaffected by it, there's an argument for kids actually getting it.  All their vulnerable relatives have been vaccinated, no?

2 hours ago, Mice! said:

It but it was no big deal, it's just a mask.

Are you so unempathetic that you can't see it's not a big deal for you, but other people might feel different?

It's not a big deal for me, personally, either, for short periods.

Doesn't make it right.

2 hours ago, Mice! said:

The pubs might not be open indoors but they are serving outside and people are loving it despite the cool evening temperatures

There is no reason hospitality can't reopen fully now. 

2 hours ago, Mice! said:

you seem to have forgotten that the shops have reopened,  I'm sure if asked pubs or shops then the shops would win, although it might be close.

What nonsense false dichotomy is this?  Why on earth would that even be a question?

Have you really become so conditioned that you're grateful that legitimate businesses are allowed to trade?

 

2 hours ago, Mice! said:

Add to this sports teams have restarted,  so you can golf, play football or go the gym, pop the shops and get a pint, that's hardly prison life is it,

Ok.  Try leaving the country.  Or going to another part of the country.  Or taking your missus to a restaurant for dinner.  Or doing anything normal in a free country.

You may be happy, I'm seething.

2 hours ago, Mice! said:

take a look at france or Spain see how they are getting on, I'd say again we're moving along nicely. 

I see your France and Spain example and raise you Texas or Florida.  No restrictions or social distancing and of course they're dropping like flies....oh, wait, they're not.

We are going ridiculously slowly, and even if you're alright Jack (and again, the forum swear filter won't let me say what I think of that attitude) how about at least acknowledging that we were told ad nauseum that it would be data not dates.  And we're sticking rigidly to dates, despite the data.

 

2 hours ago, Mice! said:

I don't doubt that there are going to be other effects, but all treatments haven't stopped, a relative of mine found a lump after xmas, has now been through all the necessary procedures and been given the all clear, whilst we were in lockdown.

Good for him.  Many others will not be so lucky.

As for referring to all those will die before their time needlessly as 'other effects', just wow. 

I can't work out if you're just not thinking about it because the truth is so horrible, or you just don't care.

Our cancer survival rates were an international embarrassment before the pandemic.  They'll be atrocious now.

[Mice!]

37 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

understand how an airborne virus works thanks.

I'll go further: Given there's no putting the genie back in its bottle, and that kids in the main are unaffected by it, there's an argument for kids actually getting it.  All their vulnerable relatives have been vaccinated, no?

The kids might well have already had it? The schools were closing years left right and centre,  kids were taking the virus home to parents,  if masks in school stop that then great, we know the kids aren't getting sick, but they pass it on.

I was happy seeing the local college kids all walking down the street without a care or mask the other day, loads of them,  several had masks around there chins,  because they probably have to wear them in class, I can't see a reason for wearing them outdoors unless you are vulnerable. 

39 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Are you so unempathetic that you can't see it's not a big deal for you, but other people might feel different?

It's not a big deal for me, personally, either, for short periods.

Doesn't make it right.

I'm sure the percentage of people with a real issue over wearing a mask is very, very small,  most just don't like being told what to do, several on here have made that clear,  it's not often these days you see someone in a shop not wearing a mask, staff included. 

46 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

Ok.  Try leaving the country.  Or going to another part of the country.  Or taking your missus to a restaurant for dinner.  Or doing anything normal in a free country.

You may be happy, I'm seething.

Firstly I'm not interested in leaving the country,  going out for a meal would be nice yes, but I'm grateful that my family and friends are fit , healthy and still here, we've met up when allowed, and followed the rules. To my knowledge none of us has had covid?

Me personally and my friends and family and there families have had an inconvenient year, we've still worked,  some from home, the kids have gone to school when possible, that's why I'm not seething, because personally it's been inconvenient. 

58 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

As for referring to all those will die before their time needlessly as 'other effects', just wow. 

I haven't said those diing are other effects, there are 100,000+ people who died before their time because of covid, I'm saying there will be other effects because of covid, the missed treatments for people needing it will probably be the biggest one without a doubt. The NHS staff must be cream crackered given the last twelve months. The aviation industry and holiday industry will have taken a massive hit, so will the hospitality sector but what was the alternative?

Have you tried getting a builder/plumber/spark to look at a job? They are flat out and into next year for new jobs, many areas are like this, it's not all doom and gloom,  house are selling as soon as they go up.

 

[udderlyoffroad]

11 hours ago, Mice! said:

if masks in school stop that then great,

Seriously this is tedious now.  Kids need to develop, they're behind enough as it is, and missing the social cues and normal interaction will harm their development.  There's plenty of research on this.  Kids having to wear masks in school is batsh** stupid, and just teaching union backside covering of the worst kind.  And the worst part is, the government just rolled over and acquiesced to their demands.

 

11 hours ago, Mice! said:

I'm sure the percentage of people with a real issue over wearing a mask is very, very small

Oh that's ok then, you're sure?

 

11 hours ago, Mice! said:

Me personally and my friends and family and there families have had an inconvenient year, we've still worked,  some from home, the kids have gone to school when possible, that's why I'm not seething, because personally it's been inconvenient. 

One last time:  You and your kin might be ok.  Many are not, directly as a result of these restrictions.

The cure is way worse than the disease.

11 hours ago, Mice! said:

Firstly I'm not interested in leaving the country,

And Breathe.

You might not be.

Some people have family spread across the globe, and haven't seen them in over a year.  In some cases, time is not on their side as it is.  We'll never get this year back.

 

11 hours ago, Mice! said:

I haven't said those diing are other effects, there are 100,000+ people who died before their time because of covid,

That figure is total shash, as you well know.

 

11 hours ago, Mice! said:

The NHS staff must be cream crackered given the last twelve months.

Some front line NHS stuff have had a terrible year, others have sat thumb up posterior on empty wards.

And even discounting the human cost for a minute, if we carry on as we are there'll be no money to pay for these 'heroes'

11 hours ago, Mice! said:

The aviation industry and holiday industry will have taken a massive hit, so will the hospitality sector but what was the alternative?

Very simply that shielding be based on your clinical risk, not your geographic area! 

Anyway that argument is now over, we've been through 12+months Prison Britannia, the question is now, why are we still locked up?  We have reached herd immunity.  No more excuses.