Gov Restrictions Announcement 14/06/21

[ordnance]

17 minutes ago, Scully said:

So is that what we do? Wait? How long? Another year? Two? Three? Ten? 
What if it doesn’t mutate into something less harmless? 

 

 My view i think they are right to delay full opening for now.

Edited June 16, 2021 by ordnance

[Mice!]

35 minutes ago, Scully said:

Ive had both jabs, just like the vast majority of those in pubs, or at least the ones I go to anyhow. 
My son is at uni’ in Newcastle, neither him nor any of his mates have had any jab, they’re still going to the pubs regardless, because they want to get on with their lives. 
What do you want to happen? 

Don't say that, your not allowed to be alright!

Those in your out of the way pub might be ok, but the wider areas ie towns are a different case, until the Indian variant kicked off I was convinced everything was going to go to plan, hospital admissions right down, very few deaths, cases down, getting to the point where there was little point them saying on the news about it. 

People are getting on with their lives, that's why I've said the only restriction I see is wearing a mask when indoors,  which is just inconvenient not a big deal.

I'm hoping the next month sees people from the areas with the Indian variant continuing to get the jab, the number of cases dropping not rising and it not spreading further then the final restrictions are lifted.

Imagine this, what if they had said we are lifting all restrictions despite the rising numbers from some areas, then in 6 weeks said oh poo, we got it wrong, we're going to have to go back to a full lockdown, it's much easy to keep things as they are with minimal restrictions than have it escalate and lock us down again.

[Rewulf]

21 minutes ago, ordnance said:

Not necessarily, viruses can over time mutate to be less harmful or even harmless. 

Oh like the flu ? That older people get jabbed for EVERY year.
When is that one going to go away ?
On average ,17000 people die a year from flu, except for last year obviously , where miraculously no one died of it 

1 hour ago, Mice! said:

they have been doing door to door testing in Blackburn trying to get on top of this, but I still doubt everyone is being tested

Lets be brutally honest here, well as honest as I can be without being called a racist by someone.
Most covid flare ups tend to come from areas with high Asian 'diversity', Blackburn, Birmingham, Leicester, areas of London amongst others.
Part of this could be due to a tendency to ignore covid distancing , lockdown and mask rules.
There is also a  particularly low take up of the vaccine amongst this ethnicity for a variety of reasons, trust in government, stories of alcohol in the jab, and the absolute elephant in the room, the fact that many Asian people are here illegally, and have been for years.
I know , prove it ect, but its a fact some people who live and work here, CANT get a jab , because the system wont let them get one, as they arent on the system in their own right.
They piggy back off a cousin , nephew ect when they need something, I knew one family whos taxi ran 24/7 with 4 drivers and one registered, the other 3 used their legal cousins passport to gain entry to the UK , and never went back.
People who work in restaurants, shops and clothes factories, how can they get a jab if they shouldnt even be here ?

This isnt a 'I hate Asians' post , it just is what it is, a reason why.....

The rona is going no where, lets get that straight from the start.

[ordnance]

 

Quote

 

 1 hour ago, ordnance said:

Not necessarily, viruses can over time mutate to be less harmful or even harmless. 

Oh like the flu ? That older people get jabbed for EVERY year.
When is that one going to go away ?
On average ,17000 people die a year from flu, except for last year obviously , where miraculously no one died of it.

 

I never said it could go away, i said viruses can mutate to be less harmful or harmless that's is a scientific fact, but maybe you know better   Try reading my post again slowly. PS No flu deaths 

Quote

Mutations can even lead to a virus becoming so weak that it eventually disappears completely. This was the case, for example, with the severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS) virus.

• Quote

  Of all death occurrences between January and August 2020, there were 48,168 deaths due to the coronavirus (COVID-19) compared with 13,619 deaths due to pneumonia and 394 deaths due to influenza.

   

Edited June 16, 2021 by ordnance

[Scully]

41 minutes ago, Mice! said:

Don't say that, your not allowed to be alright!

Those in your out of the way pub might be ok, but the wider areas ie towns are a different case, until the Indian variant kicked off I was convinced everything was going to go to plan, hospital admissions right down, very few deaths, cases down, getting to the point where there was little point them saying on the news about it. 

People are getting on with their lives, that's why I've said the only restriction I see is wearing a mask when indoors,  which is just inconvenient not a big deal.

I'm hoping the next month sees people from the areas with the Indian variant continuing to get the jab, the number of cases dropping not rising and it not spreading further then the final restrictions are lifted.

Imagine this, what if they had said we are lifting all restrictions despite the rising numbers from some areas, then in 6 weeks said oh poo, we got it wrong, we're going to have to go back to a full lockdown, it's much easy to keep things as they are with minimal restrictions than have it escalate and lock us down again.

You’re not listening. The village pub is full EVERY weekend, with people from the N.East in general and Newcastle in particular. The Wirral, Cheshire and who knows where else. EVERY weekend. And I mean FULL. People from toddlers to grandparents. Mid week they’re working, socialising and babysitting, then on Friday afternoon they drive to this rural caravan site / static home site, where they’re in and out if each other’s caravans all day and all night, and in and out if the pub all day and night. Every weekend from Easter to September. 
They’ve mostly but not all been double jabbed. They just want to get in with their lives.

Either this vaccine is our way out or it isn’t. Otherwise what is the point?
There was seven deaths today. Seven. 
What is the point in imagining things which may, or equally may not happen in six weeks time? If we let ‘what ifs’ dictate policy we’d never get out of bed. 
What has to happen before you will be comfortable with no masks nor social distancing? 

[Mice!]

36 minutes ago, Scully said:

You’re not listening. The village pub is full EVERY weekend, with people from the N.East in general and Newcastle in particular. The Wirral, Cheshire and who knows where else. EVERY weekend. And I mean FULL. People from toddlers to grandparents. Mid week they’re working, socialising and babysitting, then on Friday afternoon they drive to this rural caravan site / static home site, where they’re in and out if each other’s caravans all day and all night, and in and out if the pub all day and night. Every weekend from Easter to September. 
They’ve mostly but not all been double jabbed. They just want to get in with their lives.

Either this vaccine is our way out or it isn’t. Otherwise what is the point?
There was seven deaths today. Seven. 
What is the point in imagining things which may, or equally may not happen in six weeks time? If we let ‘what ifs’ dictate policy we’d never get out of bed. 
What has to happen before you will be comfortable with no masks nor social distancing? 

That's why I was shaking my head then, the idea of choosing to be in close contact with people from all over, for now that seems like a very daft idea indeed.

Like I've said, when cases aren't rising all round the Northwest and further because of this Indian variant then we hopefully remove the last restrictions. 

The vaccine hopefully keeps us out of the hospital and reduces the impact if we get covid, we all know that.

1 hour ago, Rewulf said:

Lets be brutally honest here, well as honest as I can be without being called a racist by someone.
Most covid flare ups tend to come from areas with high Asian 'diversity', Blackburn, Birmingham, Leicester, areas of London amongst others.
Part of this could be due to a tendency to ignore covid distancing , lockdown and mask rules

I agree with all of that, travel to India should have been BANNED and I was shocked it wasn't,  its because of everything you have said we are still seeing some restrictions,  such a large number of the population can't be restricted while everyone else carries on it would be unmanageable.

[Pangolin]

At least we have Swayne and Walker.

 

[Scully]

16 minutes ago, Mice! said:

That's why I was shaking my head then, the idea of choosing to be in close contact with people from all over, for now that seems like a very daft idea indeed.

Like I've said, when cases aren't rising all round the Northwest and further because of this Indian variant then we hopefully remove the last restrictions. 

You’re still not listening. 
Hopefully?
I have had both vaccinations. What more do you suggest I do? What more do you expect of me and others whom have had both vaccinations, before you think we should be able to behave as we did prior to the virus? What more do you think I should do before I can get back to normal? 
I’ll say it again as it’s obviously not getting through.

I HAVE HAD BOTH VACCINATIONS. 

[Mice!]

Just now, Scully said:

You’re still not listening. 
Hopefully?
I have had both vaccinations. What more do you suggest I do? What more do you expect of me and others whom have had both vaccinations, before you think we should be able to behave as we did prior to the virus? What more do you think I should do before I can get back to normal? 
I’ll say it again as it’s obviously not getting through.

I HAVE HAD BOTH VACCINATIONS. 

I hear you, but maybe you aren't listening,  a large part of the population have not had the vaccine,  age, religion,  health reasons which is why we are where we are.

You have been vaccinated and are getting on with your life which is great, you are already doing as you wish, you've made that clear, HOPEFULLY when the areas that haven't been quick to get the jab catch up the Gov will make the decision to say crack on.

 

[Pangolin]

No, a large part have had the vaccine. Over 42million had 1 jab and over 30million have had 2.

Out of those, the vulnerable groups have been covered.

Barely any deaths.

Under 1000 in hospital last week.

Big case numbers that dont cause massive deaths dont count.

The extention is unjust.

 

Edited June 16, 2021 by Pangolin

[Scully]

23 minutes ago, Mice! said:

I hear you, but maybe you aren't listening,  a large part of the population have not had the vaccine,  age, religion,  health reasons which is why we are where we are.

You have been vaccinated and are getting on with your life which is great, you are already doing as you wish, you've made that clear, HOPEFULLY when the areas that haven't been quick to get the jab catch up the Gov will make the decision to say crack on.

 

But you and others like you disapprove of me getting on with my life, you’ve made that clear. I’ve had enough of this government telling me what I must and must not do; I’ve gone along with everything that has been asked of me, for the benefit of not just myself but also those whom I care for.  
I know many others haven’t had  the vaccine, my two kids are amongst them, and they’ve invited me to the pub this weekend for a meal as a Fathers Day treat.
There will be many others of their age and younger in the pub, whom haven’t had the vaccine, but why should I care…..I HAVE HAD BOTH VACCINATIONS! I go to my OH’s parents house almost everyday for a brew ( I tend their garden, cut the lawns etc )  they are in their mid 70’s. They know I go to the pub nearly every Friday night and they know how busy it gets. They don’t mind because they have had both vaccinations. My OH ( their daughter ) is in there everyday at some point, and she has recently returned to work at a very busy restaurant, but her parents don’t mind because they have had both vaccinations.

They recently had their two grandchildren to stay ( aged 16 and 19 ) neither of whom have been vaccinated. They were delighted to see them, because they have had BOTH VACCINATIONS! 
What would you have us all do? 🤷‍♂️

 

[Deker]

On 14/06/2021 at 21:46, Walker570 said:

Didn't bother me a bit. Just went to prove the Government have turned a large number of the population into scaredy cats.

My niece now has panic attacks in public and is dreading the removal of face masks... pre covid she was one of the happiest people I knew with a lovely outlook on life, now she's been given tablets and asked to join the local MIND group 😞

[Mice!]

39 minutes ago, Scully said:

But you and others like you disapprove of me getting on with my life, you’ve made that clear. I’ve had enough of this government telling me what I must and must not do; I’ve gone along with everything that has been asked of me, for the benefit of not just myself but also those whom I care for.  
I know many others haven’t had  the vaccine, my two kids are amongst them, and they’ve invited me to the pub this weekend for a meal as a Fathers Day treat.
There will be many others of their age and younger in the pub, whom haven’t had the vaccine, but why should I care…..I HAVE HAD BOTH VACCINATIONS! I go to my OH’s parents house almost everyday for a brew ( I tend their garden, cut the lawns etc )  they are in their mid 70’s. They know I go to the pub nearly every Friday night and they know how busy it gets. They don’t mind because they have had both vaccinations. My OH ( their daughter ) is in there everyday at some point, and she has recently returned to work at a very busy restaurant, but her parents don’t mind because they have had both vaccinations.

They recently had their two grandchildren to stay ( aged 16 and 19 ) neither of whom have been vaccinated. They were delighted to see them, because they have had BOTH VACCINATIONS! 
What would you have us all do? 🤷‍♂️

 

You've made it clear that you have ignored the rules when it suits, and encouraged your kids to do the same, messed in shops just for fun, that's what I disapprove of, but your happily getting on with things because you have had the jabs,  and from what you have put so have many around you which is great, the nasty Government kept us in lockdown while they tried to give the majority the vaccine and it's been a great success.

If they had shown more resolve and stopped travel earlier to and from many  countries we probably would be out of this now,

Since my m-in-L has had her jabs she's been happy getting on with things, seeing the grandkids going out for meals,  enjoying life.

Like I've asked others, what can't you do at the moment?

1 hour ago, Pangolin said:

No, a large part have had the vaccine. Over 42million had 1 jab and over 30million have had 2.

Out of those, the vulnerable groups have been covered.

Barely any deaths.

Under 1000 in hospital last week.

Big case numbers that dont cause massive deaths dont count.

The extention is unjust.

 

A large part yes, but still millions that haven't, so would you just ignore the areas seeing an increase in cases?

35 minutes ago, Deker said:

My niece now has panic attacks in public and is dreading the removal of face masks... pre covid she was one of the happiest people I knew with a lovely outlook on life, now she's been given tablets and asked to join the local MIND group 😞

That is a real shame.

[Newbie to this]

6 hours ago, Mice! said:

so would you just ignore the areas seeing an increase in cases?

No, maybe they could try a tier system and lockdown just the problem areas. 

Now where did I come up with that idea 

[Pangolin]

9 hours ago, Mice! said:

 

Like I've asked others, what can't you do at the moment?

A large part yes, but still millions that haven't, so would you just ignore the areas seeing an increase in cases?

 

You cant run a businesses at full capacity due to the restrictions, forcing them to run at a handicap, not very capitalist is it.

The rule of 6, the government should have no ruling on how many people you have in your home.

You do something as simple as order a drink from the bar, you have to sit and wait and have it brought to you for no reason at all. Dont say pubs are not essential, but shopping is, its not the point, we live in a country based on such freedoms. To have such freedoms restricted so easily is the issue in principle.

You cant go on holiday abroad without isolations and testing etc. (I wouldnt go because of the hassle and the low level or enjoyment due to covid hysteria).

Rules on social distancing still in place that advise not hugging friends (smh, not that anyone listens).

A rules are still in place you cant escape the moral impact, covid culture and government propaganda, its stained our daily lives now and enough is enough. 

As Deker said about his niece, no need for her to be in thay condition, thats from propaganda and the daily dome of covid fear people are kept under.

My friends daughter is 7, a few months ago she wouldnt give me a high five due to "the rules", she was worried. In no world should a 7 year old be worried about **** like that.

 

 

As for the cases question you asked.

I would remove the restrictions, pay no mind to the rising case numbers as its not leading to deaths and hospitalisations in large numbers, offer the vaccine to those in their 20s if they want it.

I dont how many times I can say the rising cases dont matter if barely anyone is dying, its not difficult to understand.

We have tens of millions of cases of the common cold every year, if it was killing 10 people a week and had millions of postive cases a week, we wouldnt have any type of restrictions. Why treat covid any different now we have a vaccine, this will be the way we have to treat it as a society or we wont move on.

 

 

2 hours ago, Newbie to this said:

No, maybe they could try a tier system and lockdown just the problem areas. 

Now where did I come up with that idea 

Hell no, no tier system, just remove the restrictions.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Pangolin

[Scully]

9 hours ago, Mice! said:

You've made it clear that you have ignored the rules when it suits, and encouraged your kids to do the same, messed in shops just for fun, that's what I disapprove of, but your happily getting on with things because you have had the jabs,  and from what you have put so have many around you which is great, the nasty Government kept us in lockdown while they tried to give the majority the vaccine and it's been a great success.

If they had shown more resolve and stopped travel earlier to and from many  countries we probably would be out of this now,

Since my m-in-L has had her jabs she's been happy getting on with things, seeing the grandkids going out for meals,  enjoying life.

Like I've asked others, what can't you do at the moment?

 

Really? I haven’t messed around in shops just for fun, I’ve worn a mask because I’m expected to and sanitised my hands before going into those shops, so putting items back on shelves just to mess with people heads is just that, messing with the idiocy of it all. I’ve sanitised my hands and am wearing a mask, so if folk can’t cope with that then that’s their problem. What more am I expected to do. I haven’t done anything which has breached restrictions enough to put anyone at risk, unlike some of those who have held a regular ‘speakeasy’. 
I’ve done everything that has been asked of me, more so than some of those in the media and some of those whom have actually set the rules! 
I haven’t encouraged my kids to disregard anything, I’ve merely told them to get on with their lives, and not to bring it home. 
Enough is enough. I have had both vaccinations yet I won’t get in shops if I don’t wear a mask. 
What more am I expected to do? Tell me. 
As an aside, as it was mentioned in another post, my OH is having her second jab this morning, and I’m having to go with her as she has grown quite anxious about driving into town, having not driven anywhere since the start of last lockdown. She was never a very confident driver anyhow, and this hasn’t helped.
Apparently there has been a surge in road traffic now ( and judging by the A66 it would seem to be so ) as people are now reluctant to use public transport or car share for work purposes and school runs.  If it was government policy and media’s intention to scare folk, it would seem it’s worked. 
We now have some SAGE woman advising that it would be beneficial to continue wearing masks forever. Way to go. 🤷‍♂️
What are you expecting to happen before we can get back to normal? An entirely vaccinated population isn’t going to happen, so when do you suggest we end this? 

[Rewulf]

From the Bruges group Facebook page.

"We have at least one newspaper prepared to tell the truth about the ‘third wave’. We’ve been here before with the Government press conferences and presentations where only selected figures and partial graphs are shown to persuade the generally willing public to bow down to further restrictions. More often than is accidental we’re presented with ‘data’ (ie guesses) from doom laden models and expurgated NHS/PHE figures. The current crop, now being used to justify endless restrictions on our liberty, are particularly concerning. Are ministers really as gullible as they appear to be?
————

Take a closer look: doom-laden graphs from Downing Street fail to tell the full story
Henry Bodkin HEALTH CORRESPONDENT, Alex Clark DATA PROJECT EDITOR both of the Daily Telegraph 

As ever at Downing Street press conferences, Boris Johnson’s scientific advisers deployed their graphs skilfully to back up the warnings of potential catastrophe.

The all-too-familiar vertiginous lines were intended to leave the public in no doubt about the consequences of not delaying the nation’s freedom from Covid restrictions until July 19.

But take a closer look and the choice of graphs is arguably disingenuous: the slides are most revealing for what they failed to include.

On hospital admissions, we were shown a graph comparing the change in the proportion of under and over-65s admitted to hospital in January and in May-June.

This showed a big jump in the under-65s column, a point Prof Chris Whitty, England’s Chief Medical Officer, took pains to emphasise.

image
The problem is that this fails to show just how much lower the raw numbers are now.

In reality, there were 95,172 admissions for Covid in England between Jan 1 and 28, compared with 2,851 between May 16 and June 12.

However, a brief glance at the Downing Street graph – and that’s all the general public will have had the chance to do – could well give the impression that the situation in hospitals is worse than last winter.

This comparison is also weakened by the Government’s choice of timing.

Cases are generally distributed in younger age groups towards the start of a period of opening up, as these people are more likely to return to work in person or to socialise.

In September, at the start of the second wave, those aged 18 to 64 comprised 51 per cent of admissions compared with 60 per cent in May.

This was higher than it was for the over-65 age group.

The Daily Telegraph’s own graph – showing, crucially, the actual numbers of patients in hospitals – demonstrates how incomparably better the current situation is.

image
Yesterday morning, Sir Simon Stevens, the chief executive of NHS England, disclosed that just 1 per cent of hospital beds are currently occupied by Covid patients, with most of those young.

Sir Simon also said hospitals are in a “much better position” than last year.

The age distribution has “flipped” he said, so those under-65 now make up 70 per cent of cases.

The second graph deployed by Prof Whitty to illustrate the supposed pressure felt by hospitals was problematic in a different way.

It showed the average number of weekly hospital admissions per 100,000 for both the North West and England as a whole.

Snaking left to right by month, the lines appear to rise sharply – particularly for the North West – in the past two weeks.

The problem is one of scale.

The rise in the North West is significant but, again, it pales in comparison with the number of admissions seen in the second wave.

image
Hospital admissions are at around five per 100,000 people as of June 12, compared with around 20 per 100,000 at the end of December and then over 40 by the peak.

This was in no way evident at Monday night’s Downing Street briefing.

On the far left of the government graph, you can just about see the end of the gentle downhill slope, denoting the conclusion of the second wave at the start of April.

However, it would have been far more informative to have shown the colossal mountain of the second wave itself, so the public could have seen how much bigger it was than the recent uptick.

The same criticism can be made of the graphs showing the weekly increase in cases, which were also only presented from the beginning of April, rather than December or January.

Properly understanding this metric was further hampered by the failure to set out how the cases break down by age.

Most of England’s new cases are now among the young.

Across all ages, the latest daily rate in England is 67.1 per 100,000 (as of June 9), but for those under-60s the rate is 84.1 per 100,000, and for those over 60 it is just 12.6 per 100,000.

‘We cannot determine with confidence whether taking step 4 of the roadmap on June 21 would result in a peak that might put un-sustainable pressure on the NHS’
Downing Street’s choice of graphs needs to be viewed in the context that its own modellers have already admitted that they do not know whether releasing restrictions on June 21 would have caused unsustainable pressure on the NHS.

They warned that the models had struggled to “reconcile” the rapid growth in delta (or Indian) variant cases with the largely flat admissions in hospitals.

“SPI-M cannot determine with confidence whether taking step 4 of the roadmap on June 21 would result in a peak that might put unsustainable pressure on the NHS,” they said.

This encapsulates the tension between the different language used to describe the current Covid situation in the NHS and Downing Street respectively.

Last week, Chris Hospon, who represents hospital bosses as chief executive of NHS Providers, declared the link between Covid cases, hospital admissions and deaths to be officially “broken”. However, according to Mr Johnson and his advisers, it is merely “weakened”.

Scientists criticised the graphs used at the press conferences as ‘riddled with errors’
Downing Street has run into trouble over its use of graphs and statistics at its Covid press conferences. Last autumn, it was forced to acknowledge “a mistake” in the official forecasts that projected 1,500 deaths a day by the start of December.

That warning had helped push Britain into the November lockdown.

The Daily Telegraph disclosed how officials quietly revised down the total, and the real death toll was less than a third of that over the period. Some scientists criticised the graphs used at Monday’s news conferences as “riddled with errors”, suggesting that forecasts had been “systematically exaggerated” to make the case for lockdown.

Undoubtedly, the risk of unlocking British society has changed as a result of the delta variant but when compared with the turn of the year, it is clear the scale of a “third wave” is not in the same league as those we have already faced."

[udderlyoffroad]

1 hour ago, Pangolin said:

I would remove the restrictions, pay no mind to the rising case numbers as its not leading to deaths and hospitalisations in large numbers, offer the vaccine to those in their 20s if they want it

The state of New York yesterday removed all restrictions, and it seems they have a similar percentage of the population vaccinated.

Brace yourself for a surge....of nothing.   And certainly a "nothing to see here" from the UK media...

37 minutes ago, Scully said:

What are you expecting to happen before we can get back to normal?

Seems a couple of posters on here are not willing to accept *any* casualties due to COVID but @Deker's niece is just accepted as "collateral damage" and it's a "shame".

More people are killed on the roads every day than die from Covid, and all the vulnerable (who wish to be) are vaccinated, and yet we are still maintain this charade which is killing our mental and physical health, as well as our economy.

[Pangolin]

16 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

From the Bruges group Facebook page.

 

This is what the public and restriction supporters completely overlook.

As I said before, the extension is not backed by health justifications, its a political one.

When will people stop willingly eating this **** sandwich?

9 minutes ago, udderlyoffroad said:

The state of New York yesterday removed all restrictions, and it seems they have a similar percentage of the population vaccinated.

Brace yourself for a surge....of nothing.   And certainly a "nothing to see here" from the UK 

What a surprise........

I bet theyre more densely populated too.

Edited June 17, 2021 by Pangolin

[Pangolin]

It would seem they didnt used up to date data either.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9695199/Data-used-Boris-Johnson-delay-Freedom-Day-date-MPs-told.html

Edited June 17, 2021 by Pangolin

[udderlyoffroad]

2 minutes ago, Pangolin said:

It would seem they didnt used up to date data either.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-9695199/Data-used-Boris-Johnson-delay-Freedom-Day-date-MPs-told.html

I try to avoid getting into discussions with lockdown enthusiasts about Chris Whitty's Powerpoint slides.  Plenty of knowledgeable people have pointed out the selective presentation of the data, but it gains no traction amongst the big broadcasters.

I watched the first 2 minutes of his most recent one, and he'd done that old trick of using increases in percentages instead actual numbers.

It was so obvious, but it would seem a sizable proportion of the population fall for it hook, line, sinker and copy of angling times.   Probably the same people who proudly proclaim "I've never used the maths I was taught at school in real life"...

[Rewulf]

I heard an interesting theory about the continued use of restrictions, I can't vouch for its accuracy though, but it goes something like this.. 

The vaccine hasn't had 'proper' testing, it's very widespread use is allowed under state of emergency rules, due to the 'pandemic' 

Ergo, if restrictions are relaxed, state of emergency is no more, and effectively the pandemic is over, in reality its been over for a while, but governments don't want to let go. 

This basically means vaccine roll out would have to cease? 

I would be more sceptical, but the way SAGE  are manipulating the figures is an absolute give away there's a different agenda, and not a good one. 

[udderlyoffroad]

 

 

13 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

I would be more sceptical, but the way SAGE  are manipulating the figures is an absolute give away there's a different agenda, and not a good one. 

Personally I don't think there's any great conspiracy, just public health officials being given too much power and absolutely crapping themselves at the thought of giving it up.   

Seems to be a particularly British problem too, as the rest of Europe and the  US opening up, with similar or lower rates of vaccination.  But remember the late 90s, how long we weren't allowed to buy meat on the bone for, following the BSE crisis?  Public health officials in the UK are some of the most nannying in the world, and bafflingly, we let them be!

The only thing that will change the status quo?  Well, there's going to be an absolute stink when the British public realise that the little bits of card they got given following their jab will not be accepted by the EU as proof of anything.  Not for any public health reason of course, but more because the EU is still trying to punish the UK at every turn for leaving.  Obviously, their various member states' tourism-driven economies be damned...

[Newbie to this]

7 hours ago, Pangolin said:

Hell no, no tier system, just remove the restrictions.

It was sarcastic 

[Walker570]

8 hours ago, Pangolin said:

You cant run a businesses at full capacity due to the restrictions, forcing them to run at a handicap, not very capitalist is it.

The rule of 6, the government should have no ruling on how many people you have in your home.

You do something as simple as order a drink from the bar, you have to sit and wait and have it brought to you for no reason at all. Dont say pubs are not essential, but shopping is, its not the point, we live in a country based on such freedoms. To have such freedoms restricted so easily is the issue in principle.

You cant go on holiday abroad without isolations and testing etc. (I wouldnt go because of the hassle and the low level or enjoyment due to covid hysteria).

Rules on social distancing still in place that advise not hugging friends (smh, not that anyone listens).

A rules are still in place you cant escape the moral impact, covid culture and government propaganda, its stained our daily lives now and enough is enough. 

As Deker said about his niece, no need for her to be in thay condition, thats from propaganda and the daily dome of covid fear people are kept under.

My friends daughter is 7, a few months ago she wouldnt give me a high five due to "the rules", she was worried. In no world should a 7 year old be worried about **** like that.

 

 

As for the cases question you asked.

I would remove the restrictions, pay no mind to the rising case numbers as its not leading to deaths and hospitalisations in large numbers, offer the vaccine to those in their 20s if they want it.

I dont how many times I can say the rising cases dont matter if barely anyone is dying, its not difficult to understand.

We have tens of millions of cases of the common cold every year, if it was killing 10 people a week and had millions of postive cases a week, we wouldnt have any type of restrictions. Why treat covid any different now we have a vaccine, this will be the way we have to treat it as a society or we wont move on.

 

 

Hell no, no tier system, just remove the restrictions.

Puts it in a nutshell.  Get on and enjoy the life you have because believe me hopefully you will look back and wonder where it all went.  Those two young kids prove my point. We have two young women friends who are paranoid and I do not believe either of them will ever get over it.  One spends the day going around wiping surfaces.  Shame on thosw who have brought it to this.