wall thickness

[Petay]

looking at older English SbS. I know anything below 0.20" is what's considered out of proof but how quickly do barrels wear? if I look at a gun and minimum wall thickness is 0.24" is that 5k shells away from dying of 50k shells away from dying?

Also assuming walls wearing down can be sorted with sleeving?

Edited October 13, 2022 by Petay

[matone]

Wall thickness is generally only lost due to honing barrels to remove pitting or lighter corrosion damage or in the process of dent removal and re blacking. Look after your gun with proper cleaning and you`ll not see it decrease in your lifetime !!!

[Dave at kelton]

As above, barrels will not wear thin from shooting only remedial work from cleaning off to re black to lapping out to remove pits or dents. Some high end guns were though made with thin walls to reduce weight and improve handling. As far as I am aware proof makes no reference to wall thickness so thin barrels do not render a gun out of proof.

th point with having a thin walled gun is that damage might render it unrepairable. Qualified gunsmiths will confirm or put me right.

[bruno22rf]

Having bought a good few old English guns I asked my local gunsmith about this (ex Boss barrel maker), he said that the pressure on the barrels after the first few inches is negligible and that the tubes can be paper thin and still be usable.

[London Best]

As the others have correctly said, barrel do not wear thin from shooting.

[JohnfromUK]

Agree with the above.  However, what is also an important consideration is resistance to handling damage.  By that I mean denting and bruising from knocks and handling.  Many English guns (which were made for fine and fast handling) actually began life with quite thin walls. 

Obviously, thin walls dent more easily - but not perhaps so obvious is that thin barrel walls can loose a bit more from a gunsmith 'raising' dents, and that can leave even thinner patches. 

Very little (immeasurable) loss is due to normal usage (i.e. cartridge loads whizzing up the barrels!).  Most wall thickness loss happens from fine boring to remove pitting/corrosion.  Some (localised) from removing dents.  Some (external and slight, but still part of the thickness, though not the bore used in proof) from re-blacking/browning.

Sleeving is not cheap and badly reduces a gun's value.  On a strict economic basis, it is unlikely to be cost effective - but it can give a new life to a treasured old family heirloom.  Even when carefully done (and it can be done very well, but is costly) - there will be a noticeable difference in weight and balance (the new tubes will be thicker and heavier) - and that may turn a light fast handling gun into a heavier and less 'dynamic' gun.

[Walker570]

My Army & Navy 16 gauge is now well over 100yrs old and when I acquired it I had it np[ proofed from black powder. The 'smith' said the walls where thin but it passed will flying colours.    It is damascus barrelled .

Just to pre date any comments from the PW Clown Dept.  I did not by it new

Edited October 13, 2022 by Walker570

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Lol!

[Gunman]

All depends on the steel the barrels were made from . No hard and fast rules . The .020" was a device used by auction houses to cover their backs and has nothing to do with proof , which is based on bore size alone ,[ rightly or wrongly in some folks opinions ] . As long as the bores are clean , there is no riveling , bulges or external pits/ rust then all should be OK for standard loads . What you should watch out for is specific thin spots and loose ribs .

[Fil]

On 13/10/2022 at 06:30, bruno22rf said:

Having bought a good few old English guns I asked my local gunsmith about this (ex Boss barrel maker), he said that the pressure on the barrels after the first few inches is negligible and that the tubes can be paper thin and still be usable.

Yes he is correct. (And I may have had a few beers with him) After about 5-9 inches the shot is travelling.

My Clarke Damascus barrelled BLE has a thin spot from a very nasty dent that was repaired rather crudely by some try hard "smithy". It was bored out a lot to lose the dent repair internally. I measured it .015  at 9" from the muzzle in one spot. I've shot some hellish birds over the ten years I've owned it. It doesn't bother me one bit. I just need to be careful not to knock it as it will dent rather easily. Beauty of a gun though. 

And as Gunman says. Proof is measured by bore size alone. Auction houses use .020 as "below the recommended minimum".