Westley Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 Having just watched on TV, the Border Agency (formerly Customs and Excise) carrying out 'raids' on shops for stocking and selling counterfeit and dangerous vapes, in particular to Children, I can only smile at their 'success rate'. To avoid being accused of entrapment, they are obliged to phone the shop they are about to raid and tell them they are coming. Failure to do this, and the Border Agency could be accused of 'entrapment ' Couple this with another programme I watched, where a team of detectives kept watch on a crew of four very violent men, for a period of FIVE weeks, in order to catch them actually committing a robbery on some poor OAP's home, before arresting them ?? I hate to think of what could have happened IF that robbery had gone wrong, and the occupants had suffered serious injury or worse. Yep, the Lunatics are most certainly running the asylum ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vmaxphil Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 Bit like with neighbours with loud music, the council tell them they are being monitored for 3 weeks, unsurprisingly they shut up for 3 weeks then carry on Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted December 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 Maybe this is the way forward ? If this method was applied to other offences such as drugs possession and dealing. No need to send 3 van loads of Bobbies, just phone the Offenders, tell them you are on your way, after checking it is convenient to call, then send 1 Bobby around. If he does not get a reply, he could leave a note with the Station phone number on, and ask the occupants to make a more convenient appointment. Of course the problems I can forsee here would be a drop in the number of arrests, that would lead to the legal profession NOT being able to milk the Legal Aid System as much. That would then lead to them complaining to their former Colleagues, most of whom are now MP's, they in turn would be forced to pull stronger on the strings of the Chief Constables, via their local Crime Commissioners, to find something for these poorly paid Barristers to do ? On the other hand the Private Security companies that are now running the prisons, would be delighted. Due to a severe drop in numbers of prison inmates, they would be forced to lay off their front line staff, but of course, still expect the same amount of money for doing far less work. The CPS, well I don't really know what alternative employment they could be found ? None of them are clever enough to become Defence Lawyers and thus make a fortune out of our legal system, that is why they are in the CPS in the first place. Property conveyancing ? I suppose that would be an option or 'No win, No fee' ambulance chasers would be another. Perhaps it is time we had a General Election and we vote in a different Political Party who can change thing for the better A Happy Christmas and a er...semi prosperous New Year to one and all ! Westley. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 To the best of my knowledge (I could be wrong) there are no entrapment laws in the uk. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCat Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 2 hours ago, 12gauge82 said: To the best of my knowledge (I could be wrong) there are no entrapment laws in the uk. R v loosely 2001, s78 pace and r v sang 1980 are relevant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 4 minutes ago, GingerCat said: R v loosely 2001, s78 pace and r v sang 1980 are relevant. What a large but informative subject, I stand corrected (well sort of anyway). Ive made a start reading it and will finish it over the next couple of days as I get time. Thanks for posting 👍 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GingerCat Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 5 minutes ago, 12gauge82 said: What a large but informative subject, I stand corrected (well sort of anyway). Ive made a start reading it and will finish it over the next couple of days as I get time. Thanks for posting 👍 To save you time - there is no defence of entrapment in the uk but the evidence won't be heard if unfair so there won't be a trial. It has to be "laid on" so to speak. If I used a man at a bus stop as a metaphor then in the uk there has to be an actual bus (criminal act) for him to get on in the first place. In the states they will build the bus, the road and populate the stop with others to make it attractive. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 who needs entrapment when once police here decide your guilty their entire resources go into convicting you instead of establishing the truth and that’s wrong on every level Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westley Posted December 16, 2023 Author Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 13 minutes ago, clangerman said: who needs entrapment when once police here decide your guilty their entire resources go into convicting you instead of establishing the truth and that’s wrong on every level They are not doing too well in catching those e-bikes and scooters, by all accounts ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
clangerman Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 3 minutes ago, Westley said: They are not doing too well in catching those e-bikes and scooters, by all accounts ! that’s why everyone is now using them to shift their drugs mate lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
12gauge82 Posted December 16, 2023 Report Share Posted December 16, 2023 1 hour ago, GingerCat said: To save you time - there is no defence of entrapment in the uk but the evidence won't be heard if unfair so there won't be a trial. It has to be "laid on" so to speak. If I used a man at a bus stop as a metaphor then in the uk there has to be an actual bus (criminal act) for him to get on in the first place. In the states they will build the bus, the road and populate the stop with others to make it attractive. Thanks for that and what an excellent description of the test for court. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeon controller Posted December 20, 2023 Report Share Posted December 20, 2023 On 16/12/2023 at 20:15, clangerman said: that’s why everyone is now using them to shift their drugs mate lol We have lots of electric bikes running along the canal tow path at night from the city to the posh estates in the countryside. When walking the dog late along the canal we have queues under the bridges, I spoke to a local Bobby and he said they were aware but it’s small fry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted December 20, 2023 Report Share Posted December 20, 2023 2 minutes ago, pigeon controller said: We have lots of electric bikes running along the canal tow path at night from the city to the posh estates in the countryside. When walking the dog late along the canal we have queues under the bridges, I spoke to a local Bobby and he said they were aware but it’s small fry. What a wonderful contribution from pc49? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pigeon controller Posted December 20, 2023 Report Share Posted December 20, 2023 3 hours ago, old man said: What a wonderful contribution from pc49? My dad was PC 254 Warwickshire!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted December 21, 2023 Report Share Posted December 21, 2023 11 hours ago, pigeon controller said: My dad was PC 254 Warwickshire!!! Ditto 271 Derbyshire. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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