pull-bang-miss Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 After the infamous Ashley Cole incident i decided to have a quick search to see if any other air rifle incidents had occured but maybe didnt make the National news. I was shocked to say the least, anything from shooting cars, trains, passers by and even in once case killing a donkey. .....as well as past cases involving fatalities. Did anyone else know that there was this many incidents involving air rifles? http://www.bbc.co.uk/search/news/?q=air%20rifle It got me thinking, we know that unfortunately it is the case (as always) that the minority ruin it for majority but maybe licensing and training is the answer. This could then stop any idiot buying an air rifle and using it irresponsibly and putting the sport in a bad light, but on the flip side could possibly deter interested parties from taking up the sport with the hassle/expense of certification & security. Im struggling to make the decision and find myself sat on the fence. So, what do you PW users think should air guns be licensed with security or without or are they fine the way they are? (this is by no means a Troll post, i am just interested as to where everybody else sits on the matter) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bleeh Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 Let's do the same thing with 'Knife'. http://www.bbc.co.uk/search/news/knife Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 The Donkey one i thought was very bad. If only we could find a way to limit/ban the idiots from breathing we could all relax enjoy life much better. I too am on the fence with this one... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 Let's do the same thing with 'Knife'. http://www.bbc.co.uk/search/news/knife Very good point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devon Fox Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 (edited) The Donkey one i thought was very bad. If only we could find a way to limit/ban the idiots from breathing we could all relax enjoy life much better. I too am on the fence with this one... On the fence as well - most shooters start off with airguns at a Young age, I am sure my parents would have not allowed me to have one when I was a kiddy if there was a licensing/application system to go through. There is no doubt we need to stop numpties getting airguns - but how I do not know? Edited March 3, 2011 by Devon Fox Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poontang Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 I jumped off the fence ages ago. ALL airguns should be licenced. At the very least registered. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Spaniel Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 well we have some idiot down in somerset at present shooting swans.....i think its with an air riffle.....there are some idiots out there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breastman Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 The statistics for the criminal use of air rifles/pistols have shown a steady decrease in the last 5 years and they weren't particular shocking in the first place. Licensing/registration would be a massive time/money burdon on the Police, and can anyone tell me who funds the police?? The time/money spent would be massively disproportionate to the supposed benefits. Only one thing needs to happen; judges need to impose the maximum fine/sentence possible each and everytime, no matter the circumstances in there is no doubt the offence has been committed using EXISTING legislation (inc. some which was only introduced in 2010!) P.S. I do not own or have any interest in airguns whatsoever Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ajb403 Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 well we have some idiot down in somerset at present shooting swans.....i think its with an air riffle.....there are some idiots out there Aye that was an air rifle, there's a hefty reward for information about who did it too: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-somerset-12623183 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
arjimlad Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 Given the large number of unlicensed airguns available to utter imbeciles and evildoers generally, in what way would licensing solve the problem ? Another offence to charge them with if they are ever caught ? More expense & hassle for the law abiding majority & more state interference. Locking up to keep away from youngsters I have no problem with in principle. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vampire Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 I jumped off the fence ages ago. ALL airguns should be licenced. At the very least registered. +1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 It's already illegal to shoot swans,so how would licensing airguns have prevented it.If they had been stoned to death would we be advocating the licensing of stones?It is also illegal to stab someone with a knife....do we blame the person or the tool? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pegasus bridge Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 like most shooters - i started with air rifles - but the fact is - a lot of halfwits have also got them - i think we should licence them BUT nowhere near to the same degree as the FAC - perhaps a simple registration scheme ; restricting those who have been in trouble with the law ; and a penalty of losing the rifle if they get in trouble with the law - i think this would be a really good incentive to keep your nose clean. I know they responsibility of having an FAC/ SGC now is always at the forefront of my mind when any potential to have a 'brush with the law' arises - i would not want a stupid mistake to take away the sport i love - and i'm sure this would work for teenagers with air rifles. I also think shooting organisations would have a part to play in this ; in allowing lads (and girls of course) to have a route to using air rifles responsibly. Luckily for me - although i grew up in a big city - i had access (albeit twice a year) to a farm to shoot on - but i'm sure alot of people wouldnt have this. Its a tough problem to deal with - but i think we should take steps before it gets all draconian. like most things in life- it only takes a couple of halfwits to spoil everyones fun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pegasus bridge Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 It's already illegal to shoot swans,so how would licensing airguns have prevented it.If they had been stoned to death would we be advocating the licensing of stones?It is also illegal to stab someone with a knife....do we blame the person or the tool? because if the scum bag doing this had gone through a basic licencing system he might have a) not been granted one or B) not wanted to take such a risk when is more 'visible' or risk losing the licence - how many times do we hear of repeated issues with animals being illegally shot with a shotgun or rifle?... (nowhere near as many times as the air rifle ) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 they put a ban on knifes did it help no,do the same with air rifles will it help no.so whats the point. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 I despair at the people who think licensing is the answer to anything Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poontang Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 I despair at the people who think licensing is the answer to anything And your answer to the problem is? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 And your answer to the problem is? Punish people who break the law, not those who don't. Licensing achieves nothing but a mountain of pointless bureacracy and ultimately legislation that removes our guns completely. In my opinion people who welcome restrictions should have their own guns removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silverhawk Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 I think a relaxed licence system would be a good idea but, Even if they put them on licence imagine how many wont be registerd from people that already own them.Just like those brocock pistols theres still loads that was never handed in or put on fac.And imagine all the extra work load the licence departments will have.Some people on here have been waiting months for variations so what will it be then years?? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poontang Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 Punish people who break the law, not those who don't. Licensing achieves nothing but a mountain of pointless bureacracy and ultimately legislation that removes our guns completely. In my opinion people who welcome restrictions should have their own guns removed. Those breaking the law are punished. The problem, as always, is catching them, and whether they recieve tough enough penalties. A different subject altogether. How does licensing punish genuine shooters? There are far more criminal acts involving airguns than there are involving shotguns/live rifles. There's one good reason for that......licensing. Licensing works. It works by weeding out the majority of idiots/nutters at source. It works by giving genuine shooters the responsibility of being a gun owner, and as often expressed on here, it keeps genuine shooters on the straight and narrow where they may have 'strayed' in the past. Most importantly it works because the vast majority of licenced shooters are sensible, law abiding individuals. When push comes to shove the likes of BASC can point to the numbers of legally held firearms/shooters and show that they're very little threat to the public. This was shown at the Home Affairs Committee recently. How would they have been able to defend the shooting community if every Tom, **** and Harry had access to firearms? The simple answer is they couldn't, and it would be far easier for the government to put a blanket ban on all guns. It may be pointless bureacracy in your eyes but it's only through licensing that any of us have any guns at all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Breastman Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 Those breaking the law are punished. Not according to the news articles i see The problem, as always, is catching them, and whether they recieve tough enough penalties. One thing i agree with you on A different subject altogether. How does licensing punish genuine shooters? By FLD's making up rules as they go along which stop GENUINE shooters enjoying their sport unmolested and having to comply with requirements which aren't set in the legislation but that we know we have to otherwise daddy will take our toys off us. There are far more criminal acts involving airguns than there are involving shotguns/live rifles. There's one good reason for that......licensing. Possibly, but imho its more to do with the fact MOST people wouldn't put a firearm in the hands of a untrained child or an idiot, who, lets face it are the problem when it comes to airguns. The second main reason for more airgun abuse, again imo, is price. You can go to most markets or carboot sales and get a £50 rifle or £15 pistol Licensing works. Prove it! Oh wait you can't . . . Just the same way as i can't prove licensing doesn't work, i can however prove its cost a shed load of money and police time (By prove it i mean prove that licensing has saved lives btw) It works by weeding out the majority of idiots/nutters at source. It works by giving genuine shooters the responsibility of being a gun owner, and as often expressed on here, it keeps genuine shooters on the straight and narrow where they may have 'strayed' in the past. The current legislation would do this but it is rarely enforced and therefore not taken seriously Most importantly it works because the vast majority of licenced shooters are sensible, law abiding individuals. When push comes to shove the likes of BASC can point to the numbers of legally held firearms/shooters and show that they're very little threat to the public. This was shown at the Home Affairs Committee recently. How would they have been able to defend the shooting community if every Tom, **** and Harry had access to firearms? The simple answer is they couldn't,Why?If more people had access to guns and gun training maybe the HASC wouldn't have need to be formed in the first place and it would be far easier for the government to put a blanket ban on all guns. No it wouldn't or they would've done it by now. Even the corrupt, anti-gun agenda harris-holes that are politicians these days recognise they can't destroy legitimate pastimes/sports without a better reason than even mass-murder It may be pointless bureacracy in your eyes but it's only through licensing that any of us have any guns at all. WOW! Just wow, spoken like a true victim of indoctrination. Even if you only read the Wikipedia version of the history of firearms licensing in this country i think you'll find it has little to do with subjects/civilians KEEPING guns :o The easiest way to 'solve' the 'problem' in my view would be to down the same route that airsoft guns are restricted. i.e. that you have to be an active member of a club or association. Unfortunately there thousands of people who don't live near airgun clubs so it would be unfair on those people. However if a tough choice had to be made, i know which option i'd be taking Mark Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 We're just going round in circles. It is already illegal to shoot swans;licensing airguns will not make it MORE illegal.If the antidote to criminal activity was to implement the licensing of inanimate objects,there wouldn't be any crime.You can license anything and everything if you so want,but if the criminal intent is there then a a license is irrelevant. There are far many more stabbings than shootings in this country,yet it is illegal to stab someone.LOgic follows that if the answer is licensing,then knives must surely be licensed. I understand what you're saying poontang,perhaps a licensing system would deter those with no legitimate intent regards airguns,but there are millions in circulation.License airguns by all means,but for anyone to believe that the issue of a license is some sort of 'cure all' is just plain fantasy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sitsinhedges Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 Even the Police don't want a million air rifles licensed because they realise it would be expensive and nigh on impossible to administer for little benefit. Let's face it, if you really wanted to hurt someone you would be straight in the kitchen for a carving knife before an airgun. Maybe we should licence kitchen knives as far more people are killed and injured by them, and those who get refused a licence can eat with their hands Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
masterzone2 Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 Ok this may meet some sort of middle ground we don't want them on FAC as it would slow the system down So what about allowing them only to those who have an FAC or SGC on an open system like the SGC? you simply buy them on SGC/FAC and the only condition is you can't sell them to those with out fac/sgc it may seam a bit of a hassle but whats the alternative??? Allow anyone to have them? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hoTshoT-16 Posted March 3, 2011 Report Share Posted March 3, 2011 I jumped off the fence ages ago. ALL airguns should be licenced. At the very least registered. +2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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