Glensman Posted October 11, 2012 Report Share Posted October 11, 2012 So... My Dad had a farm years ago that had a wooden house in it. He lived in the house for a while then went back to the middle east. Basically the farm passed into a family member's hands and I have just bought it back to keep it in the family. About 15 years ago vandals burnt out the wooden house which was in bad shape anyway. The field has since been ploughed so all traces are gone... The long and the short of it is that I was at the solicitors today and he gave me the Land & Property Services maps for the area and the house still appears on the maps. Now, my question is, if I rebuild the house- am I ok? I would be building out of wood again... The thing is if Land & Property Services were to check Google Earth they would see that the house was not there in the past, so they would catch me out if I tried to say it was the Same house. Any advice? Anyone know where I stand? I'll take guesses- but obviously an informed opinion would be better!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WelshLamb Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Why not just ask your local planning office? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 It's a tough one. I've just been working on a site where an old stone barn needed rebuilding and the planners were a pain even though some of the structure is still standing! It's worth asking though because without them it could be ordered down again of you go ahead anyway I think? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Ask permission and they say "no" then you're screwed. Get advice now and hatch a cunning plan then all options remain open. See a specialist planning consult before putting the balloon up anywhere Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 (edited) It would seem logical that they should allow permission for a 'like for like' development. However, 'you' should go and see your local DC officer and explain the succession of events and that you now have bought the land and intend to live there and work it. Check your local councils planning policies first (local plan or LDF or maybe still the UDP) and see if it supported. To be honest I do not see how they could resist it. If you are really determined, see a local planning consultant first and set out what you are hoping for and ask their opinion and how they would approach it. Ask 2 and see which you prefer. All advice up to commissioning is almost certainly free and the first key meeting with the local DC officer may go better with a professional there. Make sure you ask for a proposal with fees if you are going to use one though. I would not expect fees to exceed £1000 for something like this and you still have the choice not to commission but do it yourself. Cheers p/s. You can appeal, either against non determination (8weeks), or a 'No' should you wish to, but getting the approach right first time is always better. If the planning process is 'alien' to you, better to get a consultant on board from the start. Edited October 12, 2012 by Kes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AVB Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 I bet that they would prosecute you first for demolishing the building without permission. Then refuse permission to rebuild it. You are screwed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glensman Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Thanks for the advice guys. I think it's off to the planning consultant I go. I was talking to a local farmer lately about planning permission for a shed. The way he put it was: 'Anyone who asked permission for a shed never built a shed yet.' I wonder do the planning office use google maps or do they rely solely on their own maps? Because by their own maps, I have a house... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mungler Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 'Anyone who asked permission for a shed never built a shed yet.' Spot on. Very funny and very true. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Any evidence is critical and will carry weight. You may need to say why it was demolished so a good 'story; will help. Dad emigrated house deteriorated - old construction , not repairable so removed prior to application. etc - as you are asking a planning consultant see what they advise but ANY evidence is good. Especially their plans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paul223 Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 not my sort of thing but I'd have thought pictures of the old log cabin could be of help, plus when the old place was tourched would there be any record of it on fire, news paper clippings 'n' stuff do the google earth pics show any markings where it lay was planning granted for it in the first place, and if so can you obtain a copy i also think a pro would be the way to go Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glensman Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Any evidence is critical and will carry weight. You may need to say why it was demolished so a good 'story; will help. Dad emigrated house deteriorated - old construction , not repairable so removed prior to application. etc - as you are asking a planning consultant see what they advise but ANY evidence is good. Especially their plans. Really the only evidence I have it their own maps, as well as a census that shows Dad and my aunt living in the house- but that's going WAY back... I reckon it's time to talk to the planning consultant and start parting with some more hard earned... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oscarsdad Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Can you put it on top of a sunken flat bed with the wheels still on - then it is a "mobile" home and I beleive (according to that bloke McCloud who just did that on the telly) you don't need planning permission. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asa Bear Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 I'm sure timber structures are classed as "temporary" so whack one up and if they ask tell em it's coming down "soon" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asa Bear Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 http://www.timberbuildingsuk.co.uk/department/planning_permission Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glensman Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 http://www.timberbui...ning_permission The problem there is that it is being classed as an outbuilding of the original. My problem is that it Is the original Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Asa Bear Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Tell them you're living in the "temporary" log cabin whilst you save up for the permanent mansion you intend to build. On a serious note, if you're replacing a house damaged by fire that had stood on the same site for a number of years I can't see the problem. As Mungler has already said (no not fists flailing) get some legal advice _before_ speaking to the planning office. Good luck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
al4x Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 As mungler said a planning consultant is the way forward from the start. He will know if there are any hoops to jump through or indeed whether its a lost cause so could save you a packet straight away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zapp Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Give Harrycatcat1 a shout, he is a planning officer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 I helped a friend with a situation nearly the same a couple of years ago, only difference was the original dwelling was a prefab. Basically the dwelling had been in situ since the early 50's, it was unused and burnt down in the mid 80's, the site was reduced to rubble, all usable material was cleared and the rest leveled. Mid 90's my friend wanted to re-build the pre-fab in the same materials, size and style. He went to a consultant and they confirmed that it wouldn't be an issue to invite the local planning officer to survey and comment, then submit a proposal to reinstate the dwelling. It was refused point blank as (as they put it) it had been a derelict site for so long - they deemed it a non- requirement. Since we have re-applied twice, the first (I was not party too) was turned down because the evidence was inconclusive. The latest I have helped to put together a lot of evidence of the dwellings existence pictures, local authority bills and testimonies - we are awaiting a response....but I don't hold my breath... We have even tried the agricultural use line with them to see if it sways a vote... T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tweedledee Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 if you bang a caravan on it for 2 years does that not get you a site??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
harrycatcat1 Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Give Harrycatcat1 a shout, he is a planning officer. As they used to say at Kwik Save "when its gone its gone" I am afraid you will have to start all over again. With regards to the tell them its a "temporary structure" theory dont bother, an 8x6 shed requires planning permission in certain circumstances. Get some professional planning advice from someone that is local to you Regards Hcc Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ack-ack Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 Give Harrycatcat1 a shout, he is a planning officer. And he played a part in helping me get the dream job I now find myself in. Good old HCC! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mikky Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 the farmer up the road got planning permission for stables for eight horses........2 years on it looks remarkedly like a 5 bedroom bungalow mikky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tommo Posted October 12, 2012 Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 No - we were told ten years... T Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Glensman Posted October 12, 2012 Author Report Share Posted October 12, 2012 As they used to say at Kwik Save "when its gone its gone" I am afraid you will have to start all over again. With regards to the tell them its a "temporary structure" theory dont bother, an 8x6 shed requires planning permission in certain circumstances. Get some professional planning advice from someone that is local to you Regards Hcc Thanks for the advice (and everyone else). I'll go see my local planning consultant. I wouldn't be averse to bending the rules ever so slightly if it helped me. But one question- are they likely to use Google Maps to show it wasn't there for the last, well, ages? As I say, it's on their latest maps... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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