Thunderbird Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 Tripe He's right. At the range some of use I was scoring alarmingly accurately (for me) at 100 meters using a muzzle loading 357 Mag and it was the first time I ever used one. I might have done better with a proper handgun and tailored ammo. Like I said earlier, for me the sport of handgun shooting probably lacks longevity and I would get a bit bored. However having said that I would probably not get bored if I could set up a few targets, sit on my stoop, and bang away at them. Like I said, on the fence. That's where the targets would be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spanj Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 A lot of shooters on here show the same level of ignorance about handguns as the average Joe shows about shotguns or rifles. All the 'Walt' and 'why would you want one' comments could be directed at anyone, who owns any kind of gun, by those who don't do it. In the 80s and 90s I was a very active target pistol shooter and loved it. People who weren't around then perhaps don't realise how popular it was. It was far and away the most popular target sport primarily because it was so accessible and unpretentious. you could build a 25 metre range in places where you could never have a clay range or centrefire rifle range, and be reasonably competitive in some disciplines with a WW2 revolver which cost a hundred quid. Pistol clubs were on industrial estates, in TA barracks, in old quarries and in just about every town in the country. It was a freindly, accessible sport and the atmosphere in most clubs was like a groups of mates playing darts or bowls. I was in the the Army at the time, and moved around a lot. I never had trouble finding a pistol club wherever I lived and in some places I joined clubs which shot in police station basements with friendly competitions between cops and civvies. It seems unusual now, and pistols seem exotic and different to some on here, and because of that a little odd, but beleive me that is a recent thing. When I started, pistols were common, unremarkable and fun. They hadn't been demonized by the media in the way they have now, a smear campaign that too many people on here have bought in to. Don't moan when the smear campaign evcentully extends to your chosen sport and you get branded a Walt/Wierdo/potential serial killer for wanting a shotgun or air rifle. When pistols were banned I gave up shooting for 15 years because I was so disgusted at having my legally owned property confiscated and being treated as a potential fruit loop, especailly as i was serving at the time and expected to carry a gun when it suited, but not trusted to do so when it didnt. I had no interest at the time in rifles or shotguns. I regret that now and enjoy shooting again but really miss shooting skittles, PP1, practical, long range pistol and all the other disciplines. I currently shoot a Lee Enfield No4 .303 bolt action. Its not the most accurate rifle in the world, but it's fun to try and master the crude iron sights, and to enjoy the history and engineering. Knowing it might have been carried at Arnhem, Tobruk, Imjin or Suez. I used to feel exactly the same about my Webley Mk6 .455 revolver, with the added bonus that I could shoot it at a local council owned range after work every week, and not once a month on a gallery range that's a 70 mile round trip with the Lee Enfield. Does that make me a Walt? These polls and petitions are a waste of time in my opinion, though I understand why people try. I seriously doubt widespread pistol ownership is ever coming back. That is sad, but not half a sad as how selfish, intolerant and "I'm all right jack” too many shooters are. A prediction for you. About 10 years after the last legally owned shotgun and .22 rabbit rifle has been handed in, people will talk about those that owned them like some on here talk about pistol shooters now. Walt's, wierdos and fantasists. As a persecuted minority, sometimes we deserve all we get and are our own worst enemies. Well said............ we are absolutely our own worst enemies. I am fairly certain that I will see the end of private gun ownership in my lifetime and it saddens me. What saddens me more is the attitude of some fellow shooters and our organisations Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ordnance Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 Like I said, on the fence. That's where the targets would be. I wouldn't call your post below sitting on the fence. That's not suggesting that all who want them are such, only the likelihood is that with the ban repealed it's a statistical probability that we will one day see another Dunblane or similar. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 I wouldn't call your post below sitting on the fence. That's not suggesting that all who want them are such, only the likelihood is that with the ban repealed it's a statistical probability that we will one day see another Dunblane or similar. Aren't we likely to see this regardless of the legalities of ownership? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 thats brilliant blunderbuss i think ur right ive never shot handguns and dont wish to,but i think it was wrong to penalise the majority for one screwball,i was stopped in the street after dunblane an asked to sign a petition to stop handguns which i refused,guns dont kill people,,,,people kill people,,,,lets get handguns back where they belong in the hands of responsible shooters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 Aren't we likely to see this regardless of the legalities of ownership? Statistical probability is empirical. That's all I'm saying. I've got nothing against people pursuing their sport. My point was that I personally don't think the ban will be repealed, however unfortunate that may be. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 Statistical probability is empirical. That's all I'm saying. I've got nothing against people pursuing their sport. My point was that I personally don't think the ban will be repealed, however unfortunate that may be. I tend to agree with that. Anyone think of something that was banned/outlawed becoming legal (sodomy, homosexuality, racial segregation etc don't apply) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thunderbird Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 I tend to agree with that. Anyone think of something that was banned/outlawed becoming legal (sodomy, homosexuality, racial segregation etc don't apply) That's the thing, once a liberty is removed it doesn't come back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 What do you want? in one breath you tell us all to stop being so apathetic and to speak out,in the next breath you ask why we even bother. Every time a poll like this is raised and no one votes to keep shooting it will be waved in your face as proof the public do not want shooting,if you vote it will knock them back when they see a vocal majority want shooting,and if poll after poll shows people want shooting they will stop banging their drum to stop shooting. So what do you want shooters to be silent or vocal? make your mind up. Have you actually read the wording on that so called poll.why should criminals be the only ones to have guns to kill innocent people and police.and you think that is a basis for being taken seriously.REALLY Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted January 29, 2014 Report Share Posted January 29, 2014 Have you actually read the wording on that so called poll.why should criminals be the only ones to have guns to kill innocent people and police.and you think that is a basis for being taken seriously.REALLY Mick i like a debate and can follow most peoples train of thought,and agree/not agree, but on threads that we have been on you say one thing and then on another say the opposite, i was citing your postings where you encourage people to be vocal and reproach those that are silent,yet a while later act with complete apathy when people are doing what you wanted them to do. Sorry mate but you don't make a complete argument on most of your posts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Mick i like a debate and can follow most peoples train of thought,and agree/not agree, but on threads that we have been on you say one thing and then on another say the opposite, i was citing your postings where you encourage people to be vocal and reproach those that are silent,yet a while later act with complete apathy when people are doing what you wanted them to do. Sorry mate but you don't make a complete argument on most of your posts. I think you know that my reference to stepping up was with regard to joining one of the organisations and giving them the weight of numbers to act on our behalf.and not take on the establishment alone.as for debate I see very little evidence of that on pw.I will say it again and hopefully you and others will now realise what I am saying pay up join basc give them the power of numbers to go up against the establishment for the shooting public.or you could just keep your money in your pocket and whinge on forums because that will do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I think you know that my reference to stepping up was with regard to joining one of the organisations and giving them the weight of numbers to act on our behalf.and not take on the establishment alone.as for debate I see very little evidence of that on pw.I will say it again and hopefully you and others will now realise what I am saying pay up join basc give them the power of numbers to go up against the establishment for the shooting public.or you could just keep your money in your pocket and whinge on forums because that will do it. You make the presumption that most of us are not members of shooting organisations already,and that we speak as individuals,well the majority of us are already members of BASC but we can also be vocal ourselves. Nothing like thinking you are the only one in the BASC is there ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I tend to agree with that. Anyone think of something that was banned/outlawed becoming legal (sodomy, homosexuality, racial segregation etc don't apply) The consuming of alcohol, as in prohibition? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 You make the presumption that most of us are not members of shooting organisations already,and that we speak as individuals,well the majority of us are already members of BASC but we can also be vocal ourselves. Nothing like thinking you are the only one in the BASC is there ! and there you go making more assumptions there are around 700 thousand fac/sgc on issue in the UK and basc boasts a membership of some 120 thousand the cpsa around 23 thousand.so facts and figures not presumption.just to throw a extra into the mix I think it should be compulsory to be a member of basc or cpsa and that the two should be affiliated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kes Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 and there you go making more assumptions there are around 700 thousand fac/sgc on issue in the UK and basc boasts a membership of some 120 thousand the cpsa around 23 thousand.so facts and figures not presumption.just to throw a extra into the mix I think it should be compulsory to be a member of basc or cpsa and that the two should be affiliated. I was glad you took a holiday after the last row, maybe you should consider another. If I was charitable, I would call you forthright, sadly I'm not anymore, cant you try and be sensible? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welsh1 Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Im sorry but i am out of this,you live in a different world. You are doing it again,demanding we are forced to join an organisation while in the same breath stating we should all be members of an organisation to stop things being imposed on us,do you not see the irony. Wouldnt it be great if the government insisted we all joined an organisation,and then announced it would be a state run one. I will bow out now as it is more fun slowley banging my head against a brick wall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Tripe Eh??? in one post you agree with someone who says they don't think the general public should be allowed to own handguns, then you say you have no opinion on it!? Make your mind up and try at least to be consistent! . Does that include rubbishing handgun accuracy and questioning why anyone would want one? I came int computers very late in life and just wish I knew how to pick small parts of posts out so as to take them out of context.a handgun would not be the first choice for a shot at a rabbit at say 100 to 150 yards and why would you say that was.the stalker does not pick a handgun over his rifle when up in the highlands for deer again why do you think that is.at the moment you have no handguns and in the real world there is no immediate plans for them to be returned to you.however if they were to be offered with the condition that they were stored at a secure range when not in use it seems that most would refuse so I ask how serious are you about having your sport back every door has to open a little to start with.all this thread started over a so called poll by a National newspaper which upon Reading it is plain that the intent is to just inflame opinion against the shooting man.can anyone tell me the last time that any of the nationals published anything positive about shooting.after all we have the worlds greatest shot in George digweed 22 world titles Olympic gold 2012 the youngest ever winner of a world title and junior sports personality of the year amber hill.with that kind of excellence in any other sport it would be all over the paper.the only publicity we ever get is bad and this latest poll is no different.the wording on the wording on the reason for the return of handguns given in the poll is designed to inflame.right now I am ready for all the Clint eastwoods to reply with how they could shoot the acorn off a tree at 500 yards with their pistols.atb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Im sorry but i am out of this,you live in a different world. You are doing it again,demanding we are forced to join an organisation while in the same breath stating we should all be members of an organisation to stop things being imposed on us,do you not see the irony. Wouldnt it be great if the government insisted we all joined an organisation,and then announced it would be a state run one. I will bow out now as it is more fun slowley banging my head against a brick wall. I am not demanding anything it was my understanding that a forum was for different views on a range of topics to be aired however it seems you can post anything as long as you follow the rest of the flock.the world I live in is one where i have been able to shoot for over forty years so far.i wonder how many of our grandchildren will be able to say the same.good luck for the future. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
demonwolf444 Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 A lot of shooters on here show the same level of ignorance about handguns as the average Joe shows about shotguns or rifles. All the 'Walt' and 'why would you want one' comments could be directed at anyone, who owns any kind of gun, by those who don't do it. In the 80s and 90s I was a very active target pistol shooter and loved it. People who weren't around then perhaps don't realise how popular it was. It was far and away the most popular target sport primarily because it was so accessible and unpretentious. you could build a 25 metre range in places where you could never have a clay range or centrefire rifle range, and be reasonably competitive in some disciplines with a WW2 revolver which cost a hundred quid. Pistol clubs were on industrial estates, in TA barracks, in old quarries and in just about every town in the country. It was a freindly, accessible sport and the atmosphere in most clubs was like a groups of mates playing darts or bowls. I was in the the Army at the time, and moved around a lot. I never had trouble finding a pistol club wherever I lived and in some places I joined clubs which shot in police station basements with friendly competitions between cops and civvies. It seems unusual now, and pistols seem exotic and different to some on here, and because of that a little odd, but beleive me that is a recent thing. When I started, pistols were common, unremarkable and fun. They hadn't been demonized by the media in the way they have now, a smear campaign that too many people on here have bought in to. Don't moan when the smear campaign evcentully extends to your chosen sport and you get branded a Walt/Wierdo/potential serial killer for wanting a shotgun or air rifle. When pistols were banned I gave up shooting for 15 years because I was so disgusted at having my legally owned property confiscated and being treated as a potential fruit loop, especailly as i was serving at the time and expected to carry a gun when it suited, but not trusted to do so when it didnt. I had no interest at the time in rifles or shotguns. I regret that now and enjoy shooting again but really miss shooting skittles, PP1, practical, long range pistol and all the other disciplines. I currently shoot a Lee Enfield No4 .303 bolt action. Its not the most accurate rifle in the world, but it's fun to try and master the crude iron sights, and to enjoy the history and engineering. Knowing it might have been carried at Arnhem, Tobruk, Imjin or Suez. I used to feel exactly the same about my Webley Mk6 .455 revolver, with the added bonus that I could shoot it at a local council owned range after work every week, and not once a month on a gallery range that's a 70 mile round trip with the Lee Enfield. Does that make me a Walt? These polls and petitions are a waste of time in my opinion, though I understand why people try. I seriously doubt widespread pistol ownership is ever coming back. That is sad, but not half a sad as how selfish, intolerant and "I'm all right jack” too many shooters are. A prediction for you. About 10 years after the last legally owned shotgun and .22 rabbit rifle has been handed in, people will talk about those that owned them like some on here talk about pistol shooters now. Walt's, wierdos and fantasists. As a persecuted minority, sometimes we deserve all we get and are our own worst enemies. Interesting post from a different perspective, thanks. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 I think it should be compulsory to be a member of basc or cpsa Terrible idea. They would be able to set their prices as high as they like fully knowing people would be forced to taking out a policy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brett1985 Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 (edited) Terrible idea. They would be able to set their prices as high as they like fully knowing people would be forced to taking out a policy. agreed, although i would like to believe that it would possibly mean a drop in premiums as it would cause some competition between the companies... but we all know the likeliness of that. Edited January 30, 2014 by brett1985 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 Terrible idea. They would be able to set their prices as high as they like fully knowing people would be forced to taking out a policy. well I still think that there is a need for an organization to protect the future of country sports and that all those who enjoy them should pay into it.as has been said many times there is safety in numbers.but as this is a free country you are free to watch them disappear if you wish.atb Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Imperfection Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 well I still think that there is a need for an organization to protect the future of country sports and that all those who enjoy them should pay into it.as has been said many times there is safety in numbers.but as this is a free country you are free to watch them disappear if you wish.atb I quite agree,but since there isnt unity with some UK shooters we're doomed anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mossy835 Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 we are not like the usa,they stick together,and stand for there rights. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Blunderbuss Posted January 30, 2014 Report Share Posted January 30, 2014 (edited) I came int computers very late in life and just wish I knew how to pick small parts of posts out so as to take them out of context.a handgun would not be the first choice for a shot at a rabbit at say 100 to 150 yards and why would you say that was.the stalker does not pick a handgun over his rifle when up in the highlands for deer again why do you think that is.at the moment you have no handguns and in the real world there is no immediate plans for them to be returned to you.however if they were to be offered with the condition that they were stored at a secure range when not in use it seems that most would refuse so I ask how serious are you about having your sport back every door has to open a little to start with.all this thread started over a so called poll by a National newspaper which upon Reading it is plain that the intent is to just inflame opinion against the shooting man.can anyone tell me the last time that any of the nationals published anything positive about shooting.after all we have the worlds greatest shot in George digweed 22 world titles Olympic gold 2012 the youngest ever winner of a world title and junior sports personality of the year amber hill.with that kind of excellence in any other sport it would be all over the paper.the only publicity we ever get is bad and this latest poll is no different.the wording on the wording on the reason for the return of handguns given in the poll is designed to inflame.right now I am ready for all the Clint eastwoods to reply with how they could shoot the acorn off a tree at 500 yards with their pistols.atbI don't understand the logic of your post at all. Who, (apart from you) is talking about shooting rabbits or deer with a handgun? Who claimed handguns were as accurate as rifles? You seem to be under the mistaken idea that live quarry shooting is the be all and end all and target shooting is less important? I do both and neither is more worthy than the other. If live quarry shooters are prepared to throw target shooters to the wolves, why shouldn't target shooters (including clay shooters) stab stalkers or pigeon shooters in the back? Why should target shooters (rifle or pistol if the latter were allowed) be prevented from keeping their own property, their legally owned sports equipment at home? If pistols should be locked in a club, why shouldn't a clay shooter have to lock his gun at the clay club or in a gun shop? What about a recreational pigeon shooter, does he really, really need to keep his gun at home following your logic? Or an occasional stalker? You see where your line of reasoning leads. Also, if handguns should stay banned because they are less accurate than rifles, maybe rifles with iron sights should be banned? Bipods and heavy barrels compulsory? Prone shots only? Etc etc.......... By the way, as I said earlier in this thread, as much as I loved pistol shooting, I'm a realist. Widespread pistol ownership is never coming back. Sadly, I think there is a realistic chance of recreational civilian gun ownership full stop coming to an end in my lifetime. The one thing guaranteed to hasten that is blinkered shooters thinking that their own narrow bit of the sport, whatever it might be, is the only bit which matters. Edited January 30, 2014 by Blunderbuss Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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