Taz07733 Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Hi guys I'm after some advice for a friend who recently approached me asking what he should do with an old hammer gun he had found wrapped in sacking in a barn he was clearing out.... the gun is in poor condition but as far as I can tell from what he has told me it's very much live he wanted to pass the gun over to me as a Certificate holder but the only advice I could give him was to hand it over to the police Any advice would be much appreciated Dave Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Hand it into an RFD they can enter it into there register they 'sell' it to a SGC if it's in proof etc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunman Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Some police forces will accept this as long as the hander in gives full details ,name and address and proof of identity . Cleveland police ,a fine upstanding bunch of men and women say that if a dealer takes in a gun such as this then the dealer is in possession of an unlicensed and therefore illegal "weapon". The police in such a case should issue a temporary certificate to hold and dispose ,usualy valid for 30 days ,used to be a form 111.How ever many police forces are reluctant to issue these for reasons I do not understand . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TIGHTCHOKE Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Go to a friendly RFD, not the Police! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aga man Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 as welshwarrior says take to your rfd. i did the same with a gun i found in a loft. it was hassle free and if it's in proof [doubtful] he/she could have it put onto your certificate or otherwise disposed of. Go to a friendly RFD, not the Police! probably what i was trying say too Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz07733 Posted March 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Guys .... Thanks for the advice I will ask him to look and see if it has any proof marks and hand it in to an rfd ........ He says I can have the gun but I don't want to risk my certificate ........ Or freedom Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunman Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Proof has nothing to do with putting a gun on a certificate as there is nothing in law to prevent anyone from owning or using an out of proof or unproofed gun . Any gun that is un proved or is out of proof should be considered to be un safe . It is a matter for the individual concerned . A dealer can only recommend .It is illegal to , hold , expose or offer for sale a gun that has not been duly proofed or that is out of proof . Not to own . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 Having done this a few times the easiest method is for you as a SGC holder( not your unlicensed friend) to take the gun to your local RFD and ask him to have a look at it and offer to pay him for his time. If the gun is worthless, beyond repair or you dont want it simply give him the gun to do with as he wants .If you want the gun ask him to enter it on his register after which he 'sells' you it back for the amount you are paying him for his trouble. If the gun is unproved he can simply 'gift' it back to you; if it is out of proof he can still do the same but the onus is on you to decide if you want to risk firing it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quint Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 I'd be asking myself a couple of questions before I tried to transfer the gun to an RFD. Does he know the history of the gun or the previous owner? What is a shotgun doing in a barn wrapped in sacking? Here's a scenario, he's taken a gun for which he has no certificate and handed it to an RFD. Checks are made on the serial number and it was stolen... At the point of taking it to the RFD does he have "lawful authority or reasonable excuse"? Possibly but he'd still have to answer some questions if turns out to be moody i.e. handling stolen goods! For the sake of an old hammer gun is it worth the hassle? If I had absolutely no idea as to the history of a firearm found in a sack I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole, I wouldn't even take it to the police station, I'd make them come out and collect it! You could always enquire about getting it back from the police at a later stage. I'm with you Taz07733 I wouldn't risk my certificate or freedom either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Taz07733 Posted March 10, 2014 Author Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 I'd be asking myself a couple of questions before I tried to transfer the gun to an RFD. Does he know the history of the gun or the previous owner? What is a shotgun doing in a barn wrapped in sacking? Here's a scenario, he's taken a gun for which he has no certificate and handed it to an RFD. Checks are made on the serial number and it was stolen... At the point of taking it to the RFD does he have "lawful authority or reasonable excuse"? Possibly but he'd still have to answer some questions if turns out to be moody i.e. handling stolen goods! For the sake of an old hammer gun is it worth the hassle? If I had absolutely no idea as to the history of a firearm found in a sack I wouldn't touch it with a barge pole, I wouldn't even take it to the police station, I'd make them come out and collect it! You could always enquire about getting it back from the police at a later stage. I'm with you Taz07733 I wouldn't risk my certificate or freedom either. Tbh I don't think it's worth the hassle either chances are it's unusable or even dangerous probs best for me to advise him to have the police collect it Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robbiep Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 THere is an entire section on this in the Home Office guidance. Basically, it states that if a person walks into a police station, then there should be no obstructions whatsoever to them handing in an unlicenced gun, and the police MUST NOT, unless there are good grounds to suspect that the gun has been used for crime, require any details at all. It goes on to explain that in the event of an old relative dying, old firearms being found, etc, then the most important thing is to ensure that they do not fall into criminal hands. Everything else is secondary to that. Now ... my experience, as this has happened to me. A relative round at my house, and 'as I'm a shooter' he hands me an old gun of his (1940s rusty 22LR rifle), and asks if I want it. I check it is clear, explain that I don't have a FAC, so will not be able to keep it. However, I can arrange for it to be disposed of safely. He agrees, and does not want to get any money for it. I phone my FEO and explain the situation, and he tells me to put it into cabinet and he will be up for it. He did not, at any time, ask where it had come from, and I told him it was from an elderly relative who had had it for years. He collects gun, and after one glance at it says that it has obviously not been used for crime, and will be destroyed. That's it. Sorted Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sanibel686 Posted March 10, 2014 Report Share Posted March 10, 2014 (edited) Some police forces will accept this as long as the hander in gives full details ,name and address and proof of identity . Cleveland police ,a fine upstanding bunch of men and women say that if a dealer takes in a gun such as this then the dealer is in possession of an unlicensed and therefore illegal "weapon". The police in such a case should issue a temporary certificate to hold and dispose ,usualy valid for 30 days ,used to be a form 111.How ever many police forces are reluctant to issue these for reasons I do not understand . Is this a quote from back when certain Cleveland police officers may have had a vested interest as they were then reselling them out the back door? I don't think it's accurate nowadays, it's quite acceptable for an RFD to take in a gun, "bring it in to the system" and resell it. Edited March 10, 2014 by sanibel686 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cottonseed Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 (edited) There is no way in a million years I would contact the police about the discovery of an unregistered gun. There are cases where entirely innocent people have been prosecuted for unlawful possession in those circumstances. Unless you get a sensible copper, you can end up in trouble, as most police over-react to anything to do with firearms. Dump it on an RFD and pay his handling charge for disposal or registration and back on the market. It may have to be checked for previous involvement in a crime--in which case the finder may have to make a statement--but having submitted it to an RFD, at least it isn't in your possession. ***************************************************************** Edited March 11, 2014 by Cranfield An unacceptable suggestion has been removed. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Some police forces will accept this as long as the hander in gives full details ,name and address and proof of identity .Had similar experience with South Wales but all sorted in the end, if its out of proof dealer can't legally sell it back to you tho. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Had similar experience with South Wales but all sorted in the end, if its out of proof dealer can't legally sell it back to you tho. Correct, but he can 'gift' it back to you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Correct, but he can 'gift' it back to you. Interesting I didn't think they could, good to know. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
welshwarrior Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Correct, but he can 'gift' it back to you. I wouldn't as the RFD is the expert and can be held liable even if they give it away. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BattleFieldRelics Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 There is no way in a million years I would contact the police about the discovery of an unregistered gun. There are cases where entirely innocent people have been prosecuted for unlawful possession in those circumstances. Unless you get a sensible copper, you can end up in trouble, as most police over-react to anything to do with firearms. Dump it on an RFD and pay his handling charge for disposal or registration and back on the market. It may have to be checked for previous involvement in a crime--in which case the finder may have to make a statement--but having submitted it to an RFD, at least it isn't in your possession.******************************************************** There's currently a case going on at the moment where a guy found a sawn off in his back garden (thrown over the fence that backs onto a common) . He took it down the police station and they are trying to prosecute him. RFD is the route to go, They quite often accept things anonymously. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HDAV Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 There's currently a case going on at the moment where a guy found a sawn off in his back garden (thrown over the fence that backs onto a common) . He took it down the police station and they are trying to prosecute him. RFD is the route to go, They quite often accept things anonymously. Another one? http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1236976/Soldier-given-suspended-sentence-handing-shotgun-police-given-award-instead.html Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 I wouldn't as the RFD is the expert and can be held liable even if they give it away.This is how I came to own an unproved gun. It is an offence to sell an out of proof or unproved gun but not an offence to 'give' or 'gift' one. When my RFD wrote it onto my FAC he simply wrote 'given' instead of sold. Perfectly legit'. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gunman Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Is this a quote from back when certain Cleveland police officers may have had a vested interest as they were then reselling them out the back door? I don't think it's accurate nowadays, it's quite acceptable for an RFD to take in a gun, "bring it in to the system" and resell it. That was Durham . Working for an RFD all I can say is we have to cover our backs as there are a lot of self important police officers who will take any excuse to find fault and make waves .Not to go into detail but I have had run ins over similar in the past . Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris Bb Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 There's currently a case going on at the moment where a guy found a sawn off in his back garden (thrown over the fence that backs onto a common) . He took it down the police station and they are trying to prosecute him. RFD is the route to go, They quite often accept things anonymously. A legal barn/loft find I'd take to an RFD. Something as illegal as a sawn-off, I'd find a very deep reservoir or somewhere similar. No way would I involve the police. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Essex Hunter Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 Hi guys I'm after some advice for a friend who recently approached me asking what he should do with an old hammer gun he had found wrapped in sacking in a barn he was clearing out.... the gun is in poor condition but as far as I can tell from what he has told me it's very much live he wanted to pass the gun over to me as a Certificate holder but the only advice I could give him was to hand it over to the police Any advice would be much appreciated Dave You can hand it in to the gun shop or police etc, however how important is it to own that gun....In the whole picture! not really!! Far to much hassle for something of very little value or usage.... TEH Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fandango Posted March 11, 2014 Report Share Posted March 11, 2014 would love to know what calibre it is i.e 12g or better still "bigger",,,,, could worth a small fortune Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord Geordie Posted March 12, 2014 Report Share Posted March 12, 2014 would love to know what calibre it is i.e 12g or better still "bigger",,,,, could worth a small fortune Think piccies of said hammer gun would be nice! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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