Camerons dad and his off shore tax haven

[MrM]

Why would people go to a rich persons tax avoidance law firm in Panama to invest in a scheme in Dublin? Don't understand?

 

He was asked that question. The fund was originally in Panama, but moved to Dublin. Apparently a lot of hedge funds use these sort of places mainly because it is easier to set up and administer them there. However as AVB points out, there very many different reasons that money is held in Panama, Bermuda etc - and yes a lot of them being extremely nefarious. It just appears that fund that David Cameron had shares in set up by his dad was bordering on inept rather than dodgy as it wasn't exactly tax efficient!

Edited April 8, 2016 by MrM

[old'un]

It now appears that this "dodgy immoral" tax evasion fund is in reality a (now) Dublin based Distributor hedge fund, where all dividend taxes are paid in the holders country - in fact the sort of fund pretty much all pensions invest in! As a tax lawyer said on breakfast this morning, it would the last place he would advise any of his clients to put their money if they were looking to minimise tax liability.

Yep..I watched the same bit of news this morning and the reporter was hoping to get a bit of mileage from the tax lawyer about this fund but when he came back and said it was the type of fund that most of the pensions companies are invested in there was deadly silence in the studio, needles to say the interview was then cut short.

 

So now we have Labour MP's calling for DC's resignation because he did not tell the media earlier in the week, what!!

[buze]

 

He was asked that question. The fund was originally in Panama, but moved to Dublin. Apparently a lot of hedge funds use these sort of places mainly because it is easier to set up and administer them there. However as AVB points out, there very many different reasons that money is held in Panama, Bermuda etc - and yes a lot of them being extremely nefarious. It just appears that fund that David Cameron had shares in set up by his dad was bordering on inept rather than dodgy as it wasn't exactly tax efficient!

 

Well, it can also be called laundering. A good way to launder money is to pass it around a place where you know you're going to lose some anyway, that's why casinos are popular -- money in, lose some, clean money out.

[AVB]

 

Well, it can also be called laundering. A good way to launder money is to pass it around a place where you know you're going to lose some anyway, that's why casinos are popular -- money in, lose some, clean money out.

 

 

Jesus you are so out of your depth here. Let's close down casinos as everything through them is dirty money.

[SNS]

Well, it can also be called laundering. A good way to launder money is to pass it around a place where you know you're going to lose some anyway, that's why casinos are popular -- money in, lose some, clean money out.

This is becoming truly hilarious.

 

Actually I can sell you a bomb proof tax avoidance scheme if you like - earn less money, you'll pay less tax then

[MrM]

 

Well, it can also be called laundering. A good way to launder money is to pass it around a place where you know you're going to lose some anyway, that's why casinos are popular -- money in, lose some, clean money out.

 

Not sure what you're saying here - are you suggesting that these distributor hedge funds such as the one DC had his shares in are set up for money laundering, or that money laundering goes on in these tax havens? If it's the first then I trust that you aren't lining their pockets by putting money into a pension, if its the second then that is what I was saying about nefarious activities going on. The press seems to have made a somewhat libellous connection between his fund and the unsavoury dealings out there.

Edited April 8, 2016 by MrM

[JRDS]

 

It now appears that this "dodgy immoral" tax evasion fund is in reality a (now) Dublin based Distributor hedge fund, where all dividend taxes are paid in the holders country - in fact the sort of fund pretty much all pensions invest in! As a tax lawyer said on breakfast this morning, it would the last place he would advise any of his clients to put their money if they were looking to minimise tax liability.

They moved it to Dublin when he became PM so he obviously knew it was dodgy hence the move. Its called closing the stable door after the horse has bolted and its all coming home to roost.

[CharlieT]

Seems to me this whole damn silly nonsense is based on nothing more than envy, class hatred and ignorance.

 

I trust that those who object to legal, tax efficient investments stand by their moral high ground and refuse to accept their private pensions when the time comes.

[MrM]

They moved it to Dublin when he became PM so he obviously knew it was dodgy hence the move. Its called closing the stable door after the horse has bolted and its all coming home to roost.

 

You have personal insight into Blairmore Holdings? What proof do you have it was dodgy?

Edited April 8, 2016 by MrM

[Jaymo]

Sooooo many 'Armchair' Experts it's laughable........

[Chris Bb]

Seems to me this whole damn silly nonsense is based on nothing more than envy, class hatred and ignorance.

 

I trust that those who object to legal, tax efficient investments stand by their moral high ground and refuse to accept their private pensions when the time comes.

 

This.

[keg]

 

This.

+1

I dislike most of the press but I want them to shake him like a rat at the moment . Legal does not mean Right . I hope DC gets stiffed over this and when the EU vote uppercuts him and the wonderful Mr Osborne .Ace .

Taxes are legal. not moral. Tinge of green envy i think, he has done nothing wrong.

[keg]

Dunno, to be absolutely clear about this I am not worried about the guy who makes £100k extra by playing the system legally because he will re-spend it, my problem is with the Starbucks and Amazons of this world who drain the economy without replenishing it, they play the system too (legally) as do Philip Green and Bernie Ecclestone but the fact remains they earn the money but refuse to pay tax and the reason they can do it is because loopholes are deliberately left open for them.

 

could you tell me more about these loopholes that are deliberately left open ? I think I'd like to use some

So what they pay in NI etc for their staff plus teh wages that teh staff spend in their local community is not replenishing ?

[toontastic]

Legal does not mean Right .

Are you a LACS troll.

[keg]

More popcorn please. Some weird and wonderful ideas on here about how much tax should be paid. Taxed morally or otherwise.

 

If we all paid our fair share ( personal and corporate) the world would be perfect with no potholes etc.

 

Ah...Utopia

[Hamster]

More popcorn please. Some weird and wonderful ideas on here about how much tax should be paid. Taxed morally or otherwise.

 

If we all paid our fair share ( personal and corporate) the world would be perfect with no potholes etc.

 

Ah...Utopia

 

The non tax paying idle rich love you.

 

I love how some think it's envy, envy of what ? It's disgust, it's repulsion that ordinary people have to pay taxes but that certain groups have loopholes created to avoid paying tax which will absolutely mean less money available to be spent on the country's infrastructure. How anyone can deny that is mind boggling.

 

If paying taxes is so wrong and mood selective why not do away with them entirely ? People keep mentioning Cameron but the subject is a billion times bigger than he is, the figures stolen and stashed run in the trillions.

[subsonicnat]

If paying taxes is so wrong and mood selective why not do away with them entirely ? People keep mentioning Cameron but the subject is a billion times bigger than he is, the figures stolen and stashed run in the trillions.

 

Now that is plain truth.

[panoma1]

If paying taxes is so wrong and mood selective why not do away with them entirely ? People keep mentioning Cameron but the subject is a billion times bigger than he is, the figures stolen and stashed run in the trillions.

Now that is plain truth.

Yep do away with tax! At least make it a choice.....anyone who doesn't pay gets no NHS, if they have a heart attack lifting their money out of their strong room! Or they or their dependants need a lung transplant or kidney transplant, no police when some scrote turns em over and steals all their money or burgles their house, or pinches their Bentley.....and on! and on! and on!.........in fact they get nothing, no help no support because they contribute nothing............but perhaps they can get all that paid for in Panama?

[AVB]

Yep do away with tax! At least make it a choice.....anyone who doesn't pay gets no NHS, if they have a heart attack lifting their money out of their strong room! Or they or their dependants need a lung transplant or kidney transplant, no police when some scrote turns em over and steals all their money or burgles their house, or pinches their Bentley.....and on! and on! and on!.........in fact they get nothing, no help no support because they contribute nothing............but perhaps they can get all that paid for in Panama?

 

Now there is some merit in that. I have private health insurance so no need for NHS. My children go to a private school so no need for eduction. According to many on here the police are useless so obviously I can do without them. I don't intend to start a war so no need for armed forces. What else? I am employed so no need for benefits. Private pension so I'll forgo my state pension. So yes I would happily pay less than than the 47% I pay for not getting any of the 'benefits' that I don't get. anyway.

[MrM]

 

The non tax paying idle rich love you.

 

but that certain groups have loopholes created to avoid paying tax

 

I assume by loopholes you are also referring to the builder mate who'll do the job for 50 quid cash to keep it off the books?

Edited April 8, 2016 by MrM

[norfolk dumpling]

I've got my bus pass now. I've also has my winter fuel payment so in rolling in it. Looking forward to my state pension next year and with our 2 private pensions we are looking for an offshore fund to mitigate our tax liabilities. Having paid tax - and quite a chunk at the higher level - for 47 years and still doing so in my retirement if feel it is time to try to avoid paying some!

 

I must say were I lucky enough to have a few million stashed away earning, say 5%, and HMRC took half of my interest every year I would be looking seriously to avoid some if not all of this especially if my wealth had already accumulated whilst paying 50% tax!

[SNS]

Now there is some merit in that. I have private health insurance so no need for NHS. My children go to a private school so no need for eduction. According to many on here the police are useless so obviously I can do without them. I don't intend to start a war so no need for armed forces. What else? I am employed so no need for benefits. Private pension so I'll forgo my state pension. So yes I would happily pay less than than the 47% I pay for not getting any of the 'benefits' that I don't get. anyway.

 

+1. And I pay even more tax !

[Hamster]

I assume by loopholes you are also referring to the builder mate who'll do the job for 50 quid cash to keep it off the books?

 

Good try but weak argument nonetheless. Getting a deal off someone by paying cash has existed since time immemorial, it isn't a loophole, strictly speaking it is illegal if the builder does not declare the money, the law is clear on that because it affects the small guy.

 

The amnesia the law conveniently suffers from is when it comes to big money it is literally NOT illegal to pull a few tricks here and there where million/billions are concerned so long as you follow the correct route of the loop holes left and designed to help the super rich. I am at a loss why some are being so facetious and obtuse in admitting the difference.

 

The builder trousering 4 grand readies in a good year will spend that in his local community because he has no other choice, it's chicken feed. The white collar criminal who trousers £50m will use it as a weapon of influence, why else do you think countries don't just get together one week end and stop the nonsense once and for all ? These loop holes could be closed in literally days.

 

Bankers telling us they're worth £1m bonuses or else they'll leave and work abroad will soon work for £85 grand salaries if all countries came together and called time up . They won't because they support each other's crimes and refuse to let the good times end.

[panoma1]

Strictly speaking If someone pays a Window Cleaner, Plumber, Builder etc in cash, that is perfectly legal and proper, it is then up to the recipient to declare it to HMRC and pay the relevant tax on it....is it not?

Edited April 8, 2016 by panoma1

[MrM]

Strictly speaking If someone pays a Window Cleaner, Plumber, Builder etc in cash, that is perfectly legal and proper, it is then up to the recipient to declare it to HMRC and pay the relevant tax on it....is it not?

 

Yes of course - my point was the window cleaner, plumber, builder who doesn't declare it , as Hamster agrees is illegal. 1000 builders "trousering" £4000 and not paying tax is the same as one "rich toff" putting £4m in an offshore fund. Neither pays tax - difference is one is illegal one isn't. So why are we more concerned about the legal ones rather than the real criminals?

Edited April 8, 2016 by MrM