bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 It's a supposedly free world CT; good luck with that. Personally I'm not too bothered whether it's paid for by the NHS or not; it's not for me to decide, but I am bothered about some of the pig ignorant intolerant comments on here regarding people of cross gender. Lobby with all your might against what you see as a gross mis-spending of NHS funds, but please don't oppose it for the reasons Mick does. It didn't take him long to show his true colours by making the jump from accepting gay or cross gender to accepting pedophilia. Scully I could not give a monkeys if some woman wants to be a man I do not care if that person then wants to have a child so no problem there.i could not care less if someone wants to be gay. We have accepted gay relationships into our society we then made it legal for these to have rights via civil partnerships that not being enough we then accept gay marriage.so what is next as it seems the more that wider society accepts the more that is wanted.so perhaps my suggestion about paedophilia was not that extreme.my sole objection to NHS paying for gender change is that if the person did not get it they would still be able to live a full and healthy life unlike others waiting for treatment. It's a supposedly free world CT; good luck with that. Personally I'm not too bothered whether it's paid for by the NHS or not; it's not for me to decide, but I am bothered about some of the pig ignorant intolerant comments on here regarding people of cross gender. Lobby with all your might against what you see as a gross mis-spending of NHS funds, but please don't oppose it for the reasons Mick does. It didn't take him long to show his true colours by making the jump from accepting gay or cross gender to accepting pedophilia. Scully I could not give a monkeys if some woman wants to be a man I do not care if that person then wants to have a child so no problem there.i could not care less if someone wants to be gay. We have accepted gay relationships into our society we then made it legal for these to have rights via civil partnerships that not being enough we then accept gay marriage.so what is next as it seems the more that wider society accepts the more that is wanted.so perhaps my suggestion about paedophilia was not that extreme.my sole objection to NHS paying for gender change is that if the person did not get it they would still be able to live a full and healthy life unlike others waiting for treatment. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Like I said, they're human too Mick and I'd be amongst the first to criticise, but where would we be today if scientists stopped trying for fear of failing? As tragic as failings can and will be, make a list of all sciences failings against their successes, or make a list of everything we have today which is due to science and scientists. I would have to agree some good things have come from the sciences.however some very bad as well only it seems when the bad is highlighted those highlighting it are branded as bigots and ignorant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Scully I could not give a monkeys if some woman wants to be a man I do not care if that person then wants to have a child so no problem there.i could not care less if someone wants to be gay. We have accepted gay relationships into our society we then made it legal for these to have rights via civil partnerships that not being enough we then accept gay marriage.so what is next as it seems the more that wider society accepts the more that is wanted.so perhaps my suggestion about paedophilia was not that extreme.my sole objection to NHS paying for gender change is that if the person did not get it they would still be able to live a full and healthy life unlike others waiting for treatment. I don't believe you Mick. Several comments you've made in this thread ( I can quote them if you like ) have clearly shown you to be a blinkered bigot. The only thing in this post I do believe is that you honestly believe your comment outrageously linking the acceptance of being gay to the acceptance of pedophilia 'was not that extreme', and that despite all my attempts to explain, you still can't accept being gay is not a lifestyle choice.....'I could not care less if someone wants to be gay'. No one 'wants' to be gay anymore than they want to be straight for crying out loud; they never had the choice. It's genetics Mick; all part of an individuals chemical make up. What does it take to get it through to you? Despite claiming otherwise, everything you've posted in this thread clearly shows that you do care Mick, very much. It is attitudes such as yours which has, over the years, helped generate and foster the self loathing and fear in individuals who happen to be gay and lesbian. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 I would have to agree some good things have come from the sciences.however some very bad as well only it seems when the bad is highlighted those highlighting it are branded as bigots and ignorant. Gordon Bennett!! Somebody help me PPLLLLEEEEAAAASSSSEEEE!!!!! You're not a bigot or ignorant because of your attitude against scientists, BUT BECAUSE OF YOUR ATTITUDE TOWARDS THOSE OF CROSS GENDER! I'll ask my daughter if she knows how I can spell it out in even bigger letters! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old'un Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Scully I must ask why you see someone as ignorant and bigoted just because their opinions don't match yours. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Paddy Galore! Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 I don't see why we should fund someone's life choice on the nhs, going off on a tangent though, are we cloning human organs for transplant yet? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 (edited) Gordon Bennett!! Somebody help me PPLLLLEEEEAAAASSSSEEEE!!!!! You're not a bigot or ignorant because of your attitude against scientists, BUT BECAUSE OF YOUR ATTITUDE TOWARDS THOSE OF CROSS GENDER! I'll ask my daughter if she knows how I can spell it out in even bigger letters! Oh right I am beginning to see now so because I object to my and others taxes funding what is no more than a lifestyle change I am a bigot.well I also objected to my taxes going to the Eu to be wasted by unelected nobody's and propping up other countries so voted to leave does that make me a bigot on that also.oh no it can't be as you were in favour of out and you could never possibly be a bigot.i had to go to the local shop just now and could not help but notice the front page of the newspapers.it would seem that some scientists have linked statins with the rise in diabetes now if this is found to be so do we put the statins in the good or the bad box. Edited August 4, 2016 by bostonmick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
secretagentmole Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Oh right I am beginning to see now so because I object to my and others taxes funding what is no more than a lifestyle change I am a bigot.well I also objected to my taxes going to the Eu to be wasted by unelected nobody's and propping up other countries so voted to leave does that make me a bigot on that also.oh no it can't be as you were in favour of out and you could never possibly be a bigot.i had to go to the local shop just now and could not help but notice the front page of the newspapers.it would seem that some scientists have linked statins with the rise in diabetes now if this is found to be so do we put the statins in the good or the bad box. Most diabetics are put onto Statins by their doctors.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Most diabetics are put onto Statins by their doctors.... maybe i am not a scientist so would not know,i think from what i saw of the article they are saying if you take statins it increases your chance of diabetes.being tight and a sceptic i do not buy newspapers or believe most of what they report. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 I don't see why we should fund someone's life choice on the nhs, going off on a tangent though, are we cloning human organs for transplant yet? Im not sure being transgender is a life style choice any more than being gay (as everyone on here clearly supports ) as an aside several sportsmen on here may suffer from deafness due to their hobby /lifestyle choice im hoping they dont expect the NHS to help them with that, incidently good to see you back Paddy Galore Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Scully I must ask why you see someone as ignorant and bigoted just because their opinions don't match yours. Because it is for reasons of ignorant bigotry and intolerance such as his towards those who are gay, lesbian, bi or cross gender, and describing them as 'it' or 'sexual deviants' and outrageously asking if we are to accept pedophilia just because we should accept transgender, that has forced for generations such people to live with self loathing and fear in the belief that they are some sort of sub human species not worthy of acceptance by mainstream society. Some have killed themselves as a result. What threat or danger to other individuals and society in general do they pose to generate such a reaction? It isn't a disease; you can't catch gay. I know two fathers who have disowned their sons because they turned out to be gay. I cannot fathom how much that must have hurt; when your Dad turns his back on you. One father was even heard telling someone in the pub he only has one son, when in fact he has identical twin sons, but one happens to be gay. He moved away some years ago and i haven't seen him since. I think that is incredibly sad. I can understand and accept intolerance of those who wish others harm, of whatever gender or sexual leaning, but discrimination such as this, based on ignorance, is beyond me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Yellow Bear Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Im not sure being transgender is a life style choice any more than being gay (as everyone on here clearly supports ) as an aside several sportsmen on here may suffer from deafness due to their hobby /lifestyle choice im hoping they dont expect the NHS to help them with that, incidently good to see you back Paddy Galore You have obviously never tried to even get a hearing test on the NHS!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Im not sure being transgender is a life style choice any more than being gay (as everyone on here clearly supports ) as an aside several sportsmen on here may suffer from deafness due to their hobby /lifestyle choice im hoping they dont expect the NHS to help them with that, incidently good to see you back Paddy Galore but being gay does not involve the nhs spending hundreds of thousands of pounds on surgery and treatment they just go and get on with it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
islandgun Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 You have obviously never tried to even get a hearing test on the NHS!! No they just did all those tests when I had my bits cut off Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Because it is for reasons of ignorant bigotry and intolerance such as his towards those who are gay, lesbian, bi or cross gender, and describing them as 'it' or 'sexual deviants' and outrageously asking if we are to accept pedophilia just because we should accept transgender, that has forced for generations such people to live with self loathing and fear in the belief that they are some sort of sub human species not worthy of acceptance by mainstream society. Some have killed themselves as a result. What threat or danger to other individuals and society in general do they pose to generate such a reaction? It isn't a disease; you can't catch gay. I know two fathers who have disowned their sons because they turned out to be gay. I cannot fathom how much that must have hurt; when your Dad turns his back on you. One father was even heard telling someone in the pub he only has one son, when in fact he has identical twin sons, but one happens to be gay. He moved away some years ago and i haven't seen him since. I think that is incredibly sad. I can understand and accept intolerance of those who wish others harm, of whatever gender or sexual leaning, but discrimination such as this, based on ignorance, is beyond me. i never described gays or lesbians as deviants,i did say that nhs funds should not be squandered on what ammounts to no more than sexual deviance.i also do not remember saying anything about bi sexuals,in fact i think you are the first to bring them into the topic possibly to further your own posts.as for passing any judgement on fathers who disowned their gay sons what gives you the right do you know the full story behind it.i doubt it..if any of my children had decided they were gay it would not bother me however if they wanted to change sex.(which by the way is not biologicaly possible)i might have something to say.but then i am a bigot.i must be as scully has decreed so Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Gordon Bennett!! Somebody help me PPLLLLEEEEAAAASSSSEEEE!!!!! You're not a bigot or ignorant because of your attitude against scientists, BUT BECAUSE OF YOUR ATTITUDE TOWARDS THOSE OF CROSS GENDER! I'll ask my daughter if she knows how I can spell it out in even bigger letters! scully , you cant force mick to like it , were all different and you shouldnt force others into your way of thinking , thats just not right , mick is just as entitled to his opinions as you are , youre acting like a 1950s homophobe by trying to shout him down and belittle him. we dont all think that homosexuality is great , you might , but some of us dont . ive got several gay mates and theyre nice folks(both male and female) , but i find the thought of the physical act quite repulsive , that doesnt make me homophobic , it just makes me straight . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Velocette Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Hear hear,,he's perpetually trying to force an "ought from an is" and as a result loses any moral high ground . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 i never described gays or lesbians as deviants,i did say that nhs funds should not be squandered on what ammounts to no more than sexual deviance.i also do not remember saying anything about bi sexuals,in fact i think you are the first to bring them into the topic possibly to further your own posts.as for passing any judgement on fathers who disowned their gay sons what gives you the right do you know the full story behind it.i doubt it..if any of my children had decided they were gay it would not bother me however if they wanted to change sex.(which by the way is not biologicaly possible)i might have something to say.but then i am a bigot.i must be as scully has decreed so At least you got that right. Do I really have to go through all that and explain it yet again? Really? Give me strength. I can't be bothered Mick to be honest; I've spent enough time debating with you over the years to realise it's a complete and utter waste of time. I think I've had enough. Regarding the two fathers, I know them personally, and have done so since I was a small child. I have worked with both of them at various times over the years and know their circumstances very well, and their gay sons, and yes, I know the full story behind 'it'. One was a proper hard lad and forever fighting when younger and a womaniser who once left his pregnant bride standing in church while he took another woman off for the day. His boss sacked him for that but was forced to reinstate him when the other all male staff all walked out in support. Rumour had it at the time that they were scared of him. He now actually owns that same business but is well into his 60's now, so he has passed it onto one of the twins, but simply wont allow anyone to refer to his gay son at all. All was rosy in the family until the gay one gave him the news. His rejection of him led to the break up of his relationship with the twins Mother. The other is just simply totally indifferent to the existence of his gay son who took and passed his class1 in the hope his Dad would employ him as a sort of ice breaker in their relationship. He refuses to do so. His son is surprisingly very happy, and claims he is the only gay in the village with his class1. That's it Mick; we're done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 At least you got that right. Do I really have to go through all that and explain it yet again? Really? Give me strength. I can't be bothered Mick to be honest; I've spent enough time debating with you over the years to realise it's a complete and utter waste of time. I think I've had enough. Regarding the two fathers, I know them personally, and have done so since I was a small child. I have worked with both of them at various times over the years and know their circumstances very well, and their gay sons, and yes, I know the full story behind 'it'. One was a proper hard lad and forever fighting when younger and a womaniser who once left his pregnant bride standing in church while he took another woman off for the day. His boss sacked him for that but was forced to reinstate him when the other all male staff all walked out in support. Rumour had it at the time that they were scared of him. He now actually owns that same business but is well into his 60's now, so he has passed it onto one of the twins, but simply wont allow anyone to refer to his gay son at all. All was rosy in the family until the gay one gave him the news. His rejection of him led to the break up of his relationship with the twins Mother. The other is just simply totally indifferent to the existence of his gay son who took and passed his class1 in the hope his Dad would employ him as a sort of ice breaker in their relationship. He refuses to do so. His son is surprisingly very happy, and claims he is the only gay in the village with his class1. That's it Mick; we're done. you dont debate scully,you tell others they are all wrong and then announce your reasons why and that is it.and i must say that over the time i have been on this forum i will say that you must know more people than anyone else i have ever heard of,you seem to know someone to suit every occassion . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 scully , you cant force mick to like it , were all different and you shouldnt force others into your way of thinking , thats just not right , mick is just as entitled to his opinions as you are , youre acting like a 1950s homophobe EH? by trying to shout him down and belittle him. we dont all think that homosexuality is great , you might , but some of us dont . ive got several gay mates and theyre nice folks(both male and female) , but i find the thought of the physical act quite repulsive , that doesnt make me homophobic , it just makes me straight . For crying out loud! I'm not trying to force anyone to 'like it'; I'm trying to explain it in the hope they'll understand it and therefore be more tolerant towards it! Some are so blinkered they can't seem to grasp the fact it isn't a lifestyle choice but part of a persons chemical make up. What do I have to do to make it any clearer? No one has to 'like it'; merely understand it. The actual act doesn't appeal to me either ( when did I claim it was 'great'? ) but I'm not about to call anyone a deviant because of it either. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 you dont debate scully,you tell others they are all wrong and then announce your reasons why and that is it.Ok Mick, final attempt. You're right and I'm wrong. They re deviants and accepting cross gender operations is on a slippery slope to society accepting pedophila. Happy? and i must say that over the time i have been on this forum i will say that you must know more people than anyone else i have ever heard of,you seem to know someone to suit every occassion .I do know a lot of people Mick; perhaps I get out more than you. You asked if I knew the story behind 'it', and I do, and you're still not happy. I can't win either way it would seem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mel b3 Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Youre making me chuckle here. Youre trying to explain it in the same way that 1950s doctors tried to explain to gay men that they had a sickness of the mind lol. A gay person will see things their way and a straight person will see things their way , you really shouldnt be so intolerant of the opinions of others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bostonmick Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 (edited) you dont debate scully,you tell others they are all wrong and then announce your reasons why and that is it.Ok Mick, final attempt. You're right and I'm wrong. They re deviants and accepting cross gender operations is on a slippery slope to society accepting pedophila. DO YOU REALISE THAT IT WAS NOT LONG AGO THAT DAVID CAMERON REJECTED OUTRIGHT A CALL FROM A HEALTH OFFICIALS OFFICE FOR THE AGE OF CONSENT TO BE CHANGED TO 15 SO PERHAPS THE SLIPPERY SLOPE IS NOT THAT FAR OFF.Happy? and i must say that over the time i have been on this forum i will say that you must know more people than anyone else i have ever heard of,you seem to know someone to suit every occassion .I do know a lot of people Mick; perhaps I get out more than you. You asked if I knew the story behind 'it', and I do, and you're still not happy. I can't win either way it would seem. Sorry but I am very happy always am.i also never said in any post I did not accept cross gender operations only that I don't accept the NHS funding them.if people want to change their body I am happy for them to do it just not happy for my taxes going to pay for it.i do not tell anybody how to live their life. Good luck to them as the saying goes you pays your money you takes your choice. I can't believe they have not locked this one yet. Edited August 4, 2016 by bostonmick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
four-wheel-drive Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 (edited) xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx Edited August 5, 2016 by four-wheel-drive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scully Posted August 4, 2016 Report Share Posted August 4, 2016 Sorry but I am very happy always am.i also never said in any post I did not accept cross gender operations only that I don't accept the NHS funding them.if people want to change their body I am happy for them to do it just not happy for my taxes going to pay for it.i do not tell anybody how to live their life. Good luck to them as the saying goes you pays your money you takes your choice. I can't believe they have not locked this one yet. You have referred to cross gender people in this thread as 'sexual deviants', 'freaks' and 'it'. You have also questioned how long it would be, given our tolerance of such people, before the age of consent is lowered and pedophilia was accepted as part of a tolerant society, and thereby insinuate the two as linked. Regarding your post ( well done on inserting it into a post by the way ) referring to Cameron; he rejected outright any suggestion the age of consent should be lowered to 15. He REJECTED it MIck; understand? REJECTED. However don't be surprised at some point in the future if it is lowered; many girls are sexually active at 13, never mind 15. I often had sex with a 14 year old, but she didn't mind as I was 14 also. If the age of consent is lowered to 15 or even 14, you do realise it will be enshrined in law and therefore not a slippery slope to pedophila, but quite legal......don't you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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