More BBC bs - Britains Next Air Disaster

[saddler]

The new BBC presenter, ex-RM Sniper Aldo Kane, has been plinking at a drone with his .308 "as that's what the Police would use"

The laugh out loud part - if he wasn't shooting into a hillside "this bullet would travel 10 miles!!"

He's a **** poor shot to boot....

[sam triple]

Refuse to watch the bbc at the moment 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

My Son has not bothered to get a TV Licence and I am seriously considering cancelling mine.

[NoBodyImportant]

That’s actually very hard.  We have tried to shoots  r/c plane down with 10/22s and 50 round drums.  

[wascal]

8 hours ago, NoBodyImportant said:

That’s actually very hard.  We have tried to shoots  r/c plane down with 10/22s and 50 round drums.  

 

It's still hard on full auto 😎

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR5BtXP0s0o&ab_channel=MichaelRezin

[chrisjpainter]

20 hours ago, saddler said:

The new BBC presenter, ex-RM Sniper Aldo Kane, has been plinking at a drone with his .308 "as that's what the Police would use"

The laugh out loud part - if he wasn't shooting into a hillside "this bullet would travel 10 miles!!"

He's a **** poor shot to boot....

Just watched the footage. 300 metres aiming at a subtly shifting target in windy conditions? 

Even at 200m the drone was still moving around and it was still windy and he took it out in three shots. That's not '**** poor' at all. 

[saddler]

Surely the issue, aside from the cartridge that travels "10 miles" is that you'd never choose a .308 to shoot drones in the first place?
(or at least, not in a population density like is found in the UK & similar First World countries)

10-bore semi auto or pump or some such; bigger wider payload, less downrange disturbance outside of the target area

[chrisjpainter]

55 minutes ago, saddler said:

Surely the issue, aside from the cartridge that travels "10 miles" is that you'd never choose a .308 to shoot drones in the first place?
(or at least, not in a population density like is found in the UK & similar First World countries)

10-bore semi auto or pump or some such; bigger wider payload, less downrange disturbance outside of the target area

He covers that in the documentary...

[NoBodyImportant]

8 hours ago, wascal said:

 

It's still hard on full auto 😎

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR5BtXP0s0o&ab_channel=MichaelRezin

Fun fact:  when you go to these machine gun shoots half the spectators are from Europe or Canada.  Huge following from Poland, Germany, and the UK.  

[wascal]

6 hours ago, NoBodyImportant said:

Fun fact:  when you go to these machine gun shoots half the spectators are from Europe or Canada.  Huge following from Poland, Germany, and the UK.  

I went last October .  Left with a big smile  😀

[Scully]

15 hours ago, wascal said:

 

It's still hard on full auto 😎

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RR5BtXP0s0o&ab_channel=MichaelRezin

Fabulous! 😀 What a fantastic way to spend a day....and **** off politicians to boot. 👍

[NoBodyImportant]

1 hour ago, wascal said:

I went last October .  Left with a big smile  😀

I was at knobscreek machinegun festival last October.  I too had a big smile.  It’s the same set up,  People shooting guns into cars and stuff. 

Edited July 3, 2019 by NoBodyImportant

[KB1]

On 01/07/2019 at 21:58, saddler said:

The new BBC presenter, ex-RM Sniper Aldo Kane, has been plinking at a drone with his .308 "as that's what the Police would use"

The laugh out loud part - if he wasn't shooting into a hillside "this bullet would travel 10 miles!!"

He's a **** poor shot to boot....

I'm struggling to see what the 'laugh out loud' part is……. anyone help?😳

[chrisjpainter]

19 hours ago, KB1 said:

I'm struggling to see what the 'laugh out loud' part is……. anyone help?😳

The distance. A .308 would run out of energy well before the 10 mile mark, even if you set it at a perfect angle. But that is the only thing. If you watch the whole programme, everything else is spot on. He talks about the suitability of the chosen weapon and the safety concerns and all that jazz. He answers a question that i think most people who have little understanding of firearms (so NOT the PW community!) are asking very well. 

 

On 02/07/2019 at 18:54, saddler said:

Surely the issue, aside from the cartridge that travels "10 miles" is that you'd never choose a .308 to shoot drones in the first place?
(or at least, not in a population density like is found in the UK & similar First World countries)

10-bore semi auto or pump or some such; bigger wider payload, less downrange disturbance outside of the target area

And entirely ineffective. You'd have to be moronically close to the drone to have even a snowball's chance in hell of hitting it and what do you think the drone pilot's going to do when he sees a chap walk out with a shotgun and stand underneath the drone? Pop it straight up well out of range - if it's not already. Like you say, laugh out loud.

Edited July 4, 2019 by chrisjpainter

[KB1]

1 hour ago, chrisjpainter said:

The distance. A .308 would run out of energy well before the 10 mile mark

How far would it travel then, if shot into the air?

[Rewulf]

Around 3 miles at optimum angle , depends on weight , BC , barrel length ect.

[KB1]

4 hours ago, Rewulf said:

Around 3 miles at optimum angle , depends on weight , BC , barrel length ect.

Thats somewhere in the region of what I was thinking……  However, after doing a bit of googling on .308 ballistics I found that "If shot into the air at an angle of 45 degrees, the bullet would reach a height of up to 4.5 miles", so given that it would then have to drop 4.5 miles, that seems to suggest that Aldo Kane knows what he's talking about🤔

Edited July 4, 2019 by KB1

[Rewulf]

7 minutes ago, KB1 said:

Thats somewhere in the region of what I was thinking……  However, after doing a bit of googling on .308 ballistics I found that "If shot into the air at an angle of 45 degrees, the bullet would reach a height of up to 4.5 miles", so given that it would then have to drop 4.5 miles, that seems to suggest that Aldo Kane knows what he's talking about🤔

That is not correct.
Probably speculation , and 45 degrees is not the optimum angle for max range.

https://www.nrafamily.org/articles/2016/11/22/gun-safety-ammunition-maximum-range/

[Rewulf]

Ill add to this from my limited knowledge of ballistics.

When a projectile of a given weight loses enough speed/energy, it de stabilises , this causes it to 'tumble'
Once it starts doing that it loses virtually ALL of its aerodynamic efficiency ( BC )
At this point  gravity has more effect and it falls to earth rapidly, the heavier the projectile , and higher the muzzle velocity , the longer it will stay stable.

Even a .50 BMG round cannot achieve 10 mile range.

[KB1]

10 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

Ill add to this from my limited knowledge of ballistics.

When a projectile of a given weight loses enough speed/energy, it de stabilises , this causes it to 'tumble'
Once it starts doing that it loses virtually ALL of its aerodynamic efficiency ( BC )
At this point  gravity has more effect and it falls to earth rapidly, the heavier the projectile , and higher the muzzle velocity , the longer it will stay stable.

Even a .50 BMG round cannot achieve 10 mile range.

I too, have a limited knowledge of ballistics, but am interested in why someone (Aldo Kane) with purported knowledge of such, would make such a reckless statement on TV in full view of his peers if it weren't remotely true😳  

I get the physics behind it all, but I'm going to take the lazy route using google etc, before possibly sitting down and doing the maths, in order that I can satisfy my curiosity 🤔

[joejoe]

Perhaps he meant 10 kilometres. Plus the point was you don’t know where the bullet will land.

[Rewulf]

28 minutes ago, KB1 said:

I too, have a limited knowledge of ballistics, but am interested in why someone (Aldo Kane) with purported knowledge of such, would make such a reckless statement on TV in full view of his peers if it weren't remotely true😳  

I get the physics behind it all, but I'm going to take the lazy route using google etc, before possibly sitting down and doing the maths, in order that I can satisfy my curiosity 🤔

No idea why he made such a bizarre claim, its fairly common knowledge amongst even the most casually interested in ballistics that 10 miles isnt do able with a .308, a .338 or like I say , a .50 cal.

The difference between 'effective ' ranges and maximum ranges differ in the respect of, is the projectile capable of the accuracy necessary to HIT the target at the range engaged.
Effective range for .308 is anything between 800 and 1200 yards depending on who you talk to.

After that it loses sufficient energy to remain stable, thats not to say it wont kill you if it hits you somewhere delicate, but once that stability is lost, its going to rapidly lose energy..and height.

Max range is how far it can physically travel before falling to earth, an interesting thing you can google is 'Indirect machine gun fire' used in WW1 and 2 , where a .303 Vickers gun (very similar ballistics to 308) was used rather like an artillery piece to rain down fire on soldiers in trenches, at 3000 yards it was unlikely to actually hit anyone, or indeed kill them, but as a psycological or suppressive  weapon it could be deemed effective.

8 minutes ago, joejoe said:

Perhaps he meant 10 kilometres. Plus the point was you don’t know where the bullet will land.

Still not possible, maybe 5 km at optimum angle.

Edited July 4, 2019 by Rewulf
Not 6km

[KB1]

27 minutes ago, Rewulf said:

No idea why he made such a bizarre claim, its fairly common knowledge amongst even the most casually interested in ballistics that 10 miles isnt do able with a .308, a .338 or like I say , a .50 cal.

The difference between 'effective ' ranges and maximum ranges differ in the respect of, is the projectile capable of the accuracy necessary to HIT the target at the range engaged.
Effective range for .308 is anything between 800 and 1200 yards depending on who you talk to.

After that it loses sufficient energy to remain stable, thats not to say it wont kill you if it hits you somewhere delicate, but once that stability is lost, its going to rapidly lose energy..and height.

Max range is how far it can physically travel before falling to earth, an interesting thing you can google is 'Indirect machine gun fire' used in WW1 and 2 , where a .303 Vickers gun (very similar ballistics to 308) was used rather like an artillery piece to rain down fire on soldiers in trenches, at 3000 yards it was unlikely to actually hit anyone, or indeed kill them, but as a psycological or suppressive  weapon it could be deemed effective.

Still not possible, maybe 5 km at optimum angle.

Ahhhh but…..  The ballistic charts are based on a level barrel and friction at ground level.

If you shoot into the sky at 2½ times the speed of sound the bullet will experience a lot less resistance from the less dense air etc, etc so there might be something in it…….

Not sure why your using a .50 cal as a 'bigger and better' comparison though, as that is slower than a .308 and attracts far more drag resistance😳

Anyhow, I do appreciate your response to my posts though…..  In the meantime (If I don't lose interest) I may do a bit more digging; if only to satisfy my own curiosity 👍

[Rewulf]

5 minutes ago, KB1 said:

Ahhhh but…..  The ballistic charts are based on a level barrel and friction at ground level.

Not a problem 

The idea of the graph was to show how rapidly the projectile loses energy/speed / height  after its initial 'flatter' trajectory.

At a level barrel , before its even reached it effective range , its dropped 35 feet !
So if the barrel is set at its optimum angle of around 30 degrees, the next time it crosses the  0 feet line is when it has reached its max range.

If you are good at maths, you can work that one out !

11 minutes ago, KB1 said:

Not sure why your using a .50 cal as a 'bigger and better' comparison though, as that is slower than a .308 and attracts far more drag resistance😳

A 50 cal has around 4-5 x the muzzle energy of a 308, the bullet being around 4-5 x heavier at a similar velocity to the 308, will remain stable and travel further.
I have heard around the 5 mile mark for max distance.

[KB1]

Just now, Rewulf said:

Not a problem 

The idea of the graph was to show how rapidly the projectile loses energy/speed / height  after its initial 'flatter' trajectory.

At a level barrel , before its even reached it effective range , its dropped 35 feet !
So if the barrel is set at its optimum angle of around 30 degrees, the next time it crosses the  0 feet line is when it has reached its max range.

If you are good at maths, you can work that one out !

A 50 cal has around 4-5 x the muzzle energy of a 308, the bullet being around 4-5 x heavier at a similar velocity to the 308, will remain stable and travel further.
I have heard around the 5 mile mark for max distance.

I'm still digging😀