pinfireman Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 2 hours ago, Rewulf said: Why is it baffling ? The man needed a rest from it all. To say that all hes capable of is heckling and rhetoric, shows that your judgement is severely impaired, and slewed towards a left wing , remain agenda. Correct! The only Party Leader not to have been given police protection during the Referendum.............his kids threatened, fake news used against him! He was the bogeyman that threatened the Establishment, and for that alone he deserves a medal ! Without him, and his party, there would NEVER have been a referendum! 2 hours ago, toxo said: Farage stepped away because the job was done! How could anyone foresee our own parliament having the audacity to put themselves above the will of the people they are supposed to represent! Correct! 1 hour ago, JohnfromUK said: Not always at all, Blair was hugely pro Europe, as was Brown and Harold Wilson held a referendum in 1975 and campaigned for remain as did most of his senior team including Denis Healey, Jim Callaghan and Roy Jenkins. Kinnock was also very pro Europe as Labour (opposition) leader. True! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinfireman Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Raja Clavata said: The cause being? If you read back from yesterday I was asking how we start making progress on reconciliation of the people, in our democracy it is supposed to be the people that are sovereign. Nothing philosophical about that. I actually don't understand your point about philosophy. Surely this is more about ideology. Reconciliation? You mean sit on our hands, and do nothing, whilst the troughers in Parliament continue to take the urine? It seems all you want us to do is be good little boys, and not rock the boat? If our ancestors had done this, we would NEVER have had a vote! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 4 minutes ago, pinfireman said: Please quote how Farage mislead us? It seems as though you are trying to besmirch any opposition that might spring up after the May sellout? Here's one for starters; his immediate backtracking over the £350M per week. I'm doing nothing of the sort fella, I'm just a normal bloke with different views to you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinfireman Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 1 hour ago, Rewulf said: Excellent! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 I am unclear as to why Nigel Farage is suddenly taking stick. Out of the shambles negotiations and Labour's complete lack of policy, he is the only one to emerge with any credit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinfireman Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 1 minute ago, Raja Clavata said: Here's one for starters; his immediate backtracking over the £350M per week. I'm doing nothing of the sort fella, I'm just a normal bloke with different views to you. Please give us something other than the £350 million...whick the LEAVE Campaign came up with! Lead by Dominic Cummings, not Farage................it,s the ONLY thing Remoaners can come up with....How about ALL the fake promises and threats from Remain,s Project Fear? Just now, Gordon R said: I am unclear as to why Nigel Farage is suddenly taking stick. Out of the shambles negotiations and Labour's complete lack of policy, he is the only one to emerge with any credit. Easy Gordon, because the Remoaners are aware that he alone can stir up opposition to May,s sellout! All the other Leavers have been silenced! It,s a pre-emptive strike against Farage and his new party. 5 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: Here's one for starters; his immediate backtracking over the £350M per week. I'm doing nothing of the sort fella, I'm just a normal bloke with different views to you. Somehow Raja, I doubt that..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, pinfireman said: Please give us something other than the £350 million...whick the LEAVE Campaign came up with! Lead by Dominic Cummings, not Farage................it,s the ONLY thing Remoaners can come up with....How about ALL the fake promises and threats from Remain,s Project Fear? Easy Gordon, because the Remoaners are aware that he alone can stir up opposition to May,s sellout! All the other Leavers have been silenced! It,s a pre-emptive strike against Farage and his new party. Somehow Raja, I doubt that..... 2. Lies over UK immigration 3. Lies over global immigration 4. Lies over the EU being unelected 5. Lies over the proportion of UK law derived from the EU He talks well, he like many of his populist brethren talk in sound bites and use phrases that appeal to all our individual and collective biases whilst throwing in lies and untruths. Can you not see the irony of constantly referring to remainers as remoaners - this is likely to come back and bite some people (hard!) I'm not singling Farage out but he sold you a pup then all but disappeared. To be fair he does deserve credit for distancing himself from UKIP. Sorry but you doubt what? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 17 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: Can you not see the irony of constantly referring to remainers as remoaners - this is likely to come back and bite some people (hard!) Whys that then ? I can see the irony of you moaning about it 😃 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 Just now, Rewulf said: Whys that then ? I can see the irony of you moaning about it 😃 Fickleness on this thread, there was gloating and cause for celebration a couple days ago swiftly followed by bemoaning the events in parliament yesterday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 11 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: Fickleness on this thread Terrible isnt it ? You would be right here doing the same if we had a leave government and remain won. How would YOU feel if remain had got 52% of the vote but we ended up leaving anyway, after a long drawn out abuse of democratic process ? Its that smug attitude where you think youre on the right side of the divide that gets me, try walking in someone elses shoes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsdon Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 2 hours ago, Rewulf said: A Churchill 'quote' ? Funny. Here is the the real thing from a letter to Anthony Eden written in October 1942.. 'Hard as it is to say now.. I look forward to a United States of Europe, in which the barriers between the nations will be greatly minimised and unrestricted travel will be possible.' Or from his 1946 speech in Zurich...‘We must build a kind of United States of Europe.. The structure of the United States of Europe, if well and truly built, will be such as to make the material strength of a single state less important.. If at first all the States of Europe are not willing or able to join the Union, we must nevertheless proceed to assemble and combine those who will and those who can.' You do Churchill a disservice by making him out to be some kind of petty little John Bull. He was very much an internationalist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
old man Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 3 hours ago, JohnfromUK said: Not always at all, Blair was hugely pro Europe, as was Brown and Harold Wilson held a referendum in 1975 and campaigned for remain as did most of his senior team including Denis Healey, Jim Callaghan and Roy Jenkins. Kinnock was also very pro Europe as Labour (opposition) leader. Thank you John, I had forgotten about the liebors. Age and boredom possibly dimming care. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 10 minutes ago, Retsdon said: A Churchill 'quote' ? Funny. A. Its not a Churchill quote, read the top 10 minutes ago, Retsdon said: 'Hard as it is to say now.. I look forward to a United States of Europe, in which the barriers between the nations will be greatly minimised and unrestricted travel will be possible.' B. He also stated 'We are with Europe but not of it' and 'If it is choice between Europe and the open sea, Britain will always choose the open sea' He like the idea of a U.S. of E , but he never intended Britain to join it , much less be governed by it. 19 minutes ago, Retsdon said: You do Churchill a disservice by making him out to be some kind of petty little John Bull. He was very much an internationalist. A petty John Bull ? He a also, according to some, a white supremacist and 'colonialist' You remember your Labour remainers dissing him off as a villain 2 weeks a go, and you tell me I do him a disservice ? Hilarious ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 48 minutes ago, Rewulf said: Terrible isnt it ? You would be right here doing the same if we had a leave government and remain won. How would YOU feel if remain had got 52% of the vote but we ended up leaving anyway, after a long drawn out abuse of democratic process ? Its that smug attitude where you think youre on the right side of the divide that gets me, try walking in someone elses shoes. Yes, it is terrible.That's the tragedy of all this, whatever happens around 50% of the population are doing to be seriously disenfranchised. It's nigh on hopeless and precisely why there should have been no referendum in the first place. I'm not intentionally being smug, there's still a long way for this to go and I reckon it's gonna run and run and run, meanwhile pretty much everything else is on the back-burner. If the EU is a nefarious as soon would suggest then they must be truly rubbing their hands together in glee. Very sad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 1 minute ago, Raja Clavata said: Yes, it is terrible.That's the tragedy of all this, whatever happens around 50% of the population are doing to be seriously disenfranchised. It's nigh on hopeless and precisely why there should have been no referendum in the first place. That is truly disastrous ! Its a good job when we have a general election, everyone in the country gets the political party they voted for into power 😆 And no referendum ? Why not just ignore the electorate anyway and not give them one ? Its not like were going to vote to leave anyway is it ? Or if the SHTF , we'll just stall, and then ignore the leave result anyway, who cares about majority votes and democracy eh ? Jesus ! 6 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: I'm not intentionally being smug, there's still a long way for this to go and I reckon it's gonna run and run and run, meanwhile pretty much everything else is on the back-burner. If the EU is a nefarious as soon would suggest then they must be truly rubbing their hands together in glee. Very sad. They are rubbing their hands 😂 drawing up the jobs list for whoever has 'helped ' wreck the process, have you not seen their behaviour ? If they take their eyes away from us for a minute, they might notice the rest of Europe crumbling and burning around them. If youre going to be a remain fan boy, at least keep up to date with whats happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 Why should there have been no referendum in the first place? We are one of the few countries putting money into the EU, with little to show for it. The referendum was long overdue. We might as well cancel all elections, as the losers will feel disenfranchised. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 Just now, Gordon R said: Why should there have been no referendum in the first place? We are one of the few countries putting money into the EU, with little to show for it. The referendum was long overdue. We might as well cancel all elections, as the losers will feel disenfranchised. Stating the obvious but election results normally last five years. You were implying Brexit should persist for at least a generation? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon R Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 Now just where did I imply that? As we are stating the obvious, to you at least, should we have only stayed in Europe providing we had a referendum every five years? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 4 minutes ago, Rewulf said: They are rubbing their hands 😂 drawing up the jobs list for whoever has 'helped ' wreck the process, have you not seen their behaviour ? If they take their eyes away from us for a minute, they might notice the rest of Europe crumbling and burning around them. If youre going to be a remain fan boy, at least keep up to date with whats happening. Yes i have seen the behaviour and detest it and I'm not pro EU. I think we want to see the same end goal but clearly have different views on the best way to achieve it. I was trying to show empathy here and you bring up "remain fan boy", well yes I'd rather be a remain fan boy than an Osama Bin Brexit fantasist. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Retsdon Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 7 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: there's still a long way for this to go and I reckon it's gonna run and run and run, Go and ask the Swiss about that. They're locked in never ending negotiation with the EU. And that's one of the points that the hardliners never seem able to grasp. No matter what happens in March, the UK will not be 'free of' the EU. It won't be the end, it will get the start. We'll just be at the start of an extremely long and tortuous journey of negotiation with a bigger and stronger neighbour who by dint of it's geographic location and power we will be forced into accomodating time and time again - because unfortunately that's just how the real world works. There are going to be a lot of very, very disillusioned people about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 On 26/02/2019 at 09:29, Gordon R said: If there is another referendum, democracy will not have been served. The last vote was on the basis of a once in a generation. Anyone who failed to grasp what was actually said is an idiot. Right there sir! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 1 minute ago, Raja Clavata said: I was trying to show empathy here and you bring up "remain fan boy" I dont need empathy, and you seem to fight the remain corner well, so if the cap fits... 3 minutes ago, Raja Clavata said: an Osama Bin Brexit fantasist. That is genuinely funny ! But could be a hate crime , watch yourself Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 Just now, Retsdon said: Go and ask the Swiss about that. They're locked in never ending negotiation with the EU. And that's one of the points that the hardliners never seem able to grasp. No matter what happens in March, the UK will not be 'free of' the EU. It won't be the end, it will get the start. We'll just be at the start of an extremely long and tortuous journey of negotiation with a bigger and stronger neighbour who by dint of it's geographic location and power we will be forced into accomodating time and time again - because unfortunately that's just how the real world works. There are going to be a lot of very, very disillusioned people about. which is one of the reasons there should never have been a referendum in the first place. I believe the EU will fail, what's not clear if us being in or out assists or hinders that process, I guess only time will tell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rewulf Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 3 minutes ago, Retsdon said: a. bigger and stronger neighbour who by dint of it's geographic location and power we will be forced into accomodating saving time and time again - because unfortunately that's just how the real world works Youre not wrong there.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Raja Clavata Posted February 27, 2019 Report Share Posted February 27, 2019 Just now, Rewulf said: I dont need empathy, and you seem to fight the remain corner well, so if the cap fits... That is genuinely funny ! But could be a hate crime , watch yourself I'll take that, lol. Talking of hate crimes I'm off to terrorise some dear... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts