Lead ban & BASC

[clangerman]

2 minutes ago, Scully said:

So he processes unwanted birds.  I asked for a link to the ‘stinky piles of unwanted game we have every season’? Can you provide one? 

sorry never had a reason to take pics of his truck when he comes by for my pigeons but will do so this year just to prove my point what shoots do with birds is none of my business i’m just stating a fact the man collects lots of unwanted birds and assured me it will continue this year using steel he’s been doing it long enough to know what he’s talking about i think 

[Scully]

12 minutes ago, clangerman said:

sorry never had a reason to take pics of his truck when he comes by for my pigeons but will do so this year just to prove my point what shoots do with birds is none of my business i’m just stating a fact the man collects lots of unwanted birds and assured me it will continue this year using steel he’s been doing it long enough to know what he’s talking about i think 

But you’re not ‘stating a fact ‘. You claimed there were ‘stinky piles of unwanted game we see every season’, but you can’t supply any evidence of this.

 

[8 shot]

I think very little game is dumped or wasted, maybe badly shot or damaged birds. But most will have something that is useable 

[lancer425]

41 minutes ago, enfieldspares said:

It is amazing the guff that has been written on here about how BASC has somehow prevented a total ban on lead shot being enacted imminently by is call for a voluntary lead ban. Absolute guff. This is nothing more nor less than an attempt to stop a ban on released game by arguing that even though the "big bag" boys saturate their environment with put down birds that it is all justified as what they sell is sold for food.

This is below is what New Zealand does:

https://fishandgame.org.nz/game-bird-hunting-in-new-zealand/hunting-regulations/non-toxic-shot-regulations/

 

NZ is a different mindset towards hunting, compared to us here. It is generally accepted and the out door  life promoted. In contrast we are given a very different set of circumstances to deal with here.

To claim the orgs did not buy us time claim. ?

It is possible you are correct. But given the speed at which this was mentioned, and the Averey /WJ  legal challenges who is to say we were not looking at a Legal challenge then or indeed now.

 Its possible , and given activity on Lead in Europe right now, having five years grace could come in very handy.

[8 shot]

8 minutes ago, lancer425 said:

NZ is a different mindset towards hunting, compared to us here. It is generally accepted and the out door  life promoted. In contrast we are given a very different set of circumstances to deal with here.

Your absolutely right. But that surely that is were the BASC etc. should be concentrating their efforts. Promotion of our way of like, not highlighting any of it’s small blemishes. 

[clangerman]

37 minutes ago, Scully said:

But you’re not ‘stating a fact ‘. You claimed there were ‘stinky piles of unwanted game we see every season’, but you can’t supply any evidence of this.

 

are you calling me a liar? i seen the game in his truck for MYSELF 

[lancer425]

12 minutes ago, 8 shot said:

Your absolutely right. But that surely that is were the BASC etc. should be concentrating their efforts. Promotion of our way of like, not highlighting any of it’s small blemishes. 

If BASC had the political influence of FISH & GAME we would have nothing to be concerned about.  Like BASC DEFRA  all rolled into one and the Government listening intently. DOC is like their NE / Parts of defra.

Not without fault but not without influence either.

[8 shot]

At the moment I’m glad about that, in the next 5 years the BASC and the other orgs have got a lot of hard work to do for there membership and the shooting industry in general. The very people they have backed in to a corner, will be the ones that dig them out of this very deep hole they’ve created. 

[Scully]

8 hours ago, clangerman said:

are you calling me a liar? i seen the game in his truck for MYSELF 

Regarding the ‘stinky piles of game we see every season’ then yes, I am. You made the statement as a generic ‘we’, inferring that stinky piles of game were endemic throughout the shooting season. You didn’t claim ‘you’ personally until I asked you to verify your claim. 
I am sick and tired of people slandering the shooting industry with claims they cannot back up. As regards your old boy, he is taking a surplus of shot game, very much like the surplus we sometimes create on our small driven syndicate, ( highest ever bag 48 ) when some of the guns decide they have enough for their personal use. These birds are given away, to there’s who want them, so just like the birds you claim are ‘unwanted’ they are wanted and used by someone. None of ours are stinking however, and I can’t see why your old boy would want stinking birds either! 
You claim you’re going to take photos to this season of the offending piles, but never thought  to do so in the past. I wonder why. I suspect it’s because there are no ‘stinky piles of unwanted game’. 
Either back up your claims, report it to the relevant body, ( like you should have already done ) or stop making allegations you can’t back up. 

[oldypigeonpopper]

hello, i was told a game company destroyed 30,000 pheasants last season, from shoots across the south,

[lancer425]

42 minutes ago, 8 shot said:

At the moment I’m glad about that, in the next 5 years the BASC and the other orgs have got a lot of hard work to do for there membership and the shooting industry in general. The very people they have backed in to a corner, will be the ones that dig them out of this very deep hole they’ve created. 

The orgs can only represent support and advise us and of course advise the government erc. Much of any changes needs to come from our own efforts and of course taking their advise. This i feel will need a change of heart from all of us to stand any chance of any meaningful results in our favour"

 

[stagboy]

You almost have to laugh at those few silly old buffers on here who are still in compete denial about the problems of lead.

Move over, and let the younger generation have a chance, before you spoil it for all of us. Lead is going. That's obvious. Oudated pro-lead arguments are redundant in the face of social change. Get over it, and stop doing the antis' job for them.

The demise of lead is not due to the BGA, or whatever other idiotic theory the keyboard warriors come up with. Those of us who think shooting has a future know that it is one without lead. Almost every shooting person I have spoken to recently accepts that this is the case. We've seen it coming for years. The organisations are fundamentally right - we need to take the initiative and sort own way forward over the next five years, or somebody else will do it for  us.

The tiny number of lead-Taliban keyboard warriors are utterly unrepresentative of the pragmatic and sensible majority. There is no point debating with leadists - their addled  minds are fixed; they are also totally selfish.

(I'm now off to self-isolate...).

 

Edited March 15, 2020 by stagboy
accuracy

[lancer425]

11 minutes ago, stagboy said:

You almost have to laugh at those few silly old buffers on here who are still in compete denial about the problems of lead.

Move over, and let the younger generation have a chance, before you spoil it for all of us. Lead is going. That's obvious. Oudated pro-lead arguments are redundant in the face of social change. Get over it, and stop doing the antis' job for them.

The demise of lead is not due to the BGA, or whatever other idiotic theory the keyboard warriors come up with. Those of us who think shooting has a future know that it is one without lead. Almost every shooting person I have spoken to recently accepts that this is the case. We've seen it coming for years. The organisations are fundamentally right - we need to take the initiative and sort own way forward over the next five years, or somebody else will do it for  us.

The tiny number of lead-Taliban keyboard warriors are utterly unrepresentative of the pragmatic and sensible majority. There is no point debating with leadists - their addled  minds are fixed; they are also totally selfish.

(I'm now off to self-isolate...).

 

[8 shot]

57 minutes ago, stagboy said:

(I'm now off to self-isolate...

😂 that sums it up, this virus will / has killed more than lead in our food has or ever will, and look at the massive over reaction to just a common cold !!!!

I will not be self isolating from lead........ but I am now panic buying my favourite black golds and eley pigeon HV

 

 

Edited March 15, 2020 by 8 shot

[lancer425]

13 minutes ago, 8 shot said:

😂 that sums it up, this virus will / has killed more than lead in our food has or ever will, and look at the massive over reaction to just a common cold !!!!

I will not be self isolating from lead........ but I am now panic buying my favourite black golds and eley pigeon HV

 

 

Phew! what post is silly, did you compose that or just move a little too fast perhaps. All bran perhaps. .

[Scully]

3 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, i was told a game company destroyed 30,000 pheasants last season, from shoots across the south,

I’ve been told all manner of things; none of which makes it fact. 

[oldypigeonpopper]

4 minutes ago, Scully said:

I’ve been told all manner of things; none of which makes it fact. 

hello, it does bear a rather large amount for one game dealer but the farmer who told me had about 100 partridge in his pick up shot the day before and not wanted by the local shoot/guns/or beaters,

Edited March 15, 2020 by oldypigeonpopper

[wymberley]

1 hour ago, stagboy said:

You almost have to laugh at those few silly old buffers on here who are still in compete denial about the problems of lead.

Move over, and let the younger generation have a chance, before you spoil it for all of us. Lead is going. That's obvious. Oudated pro-lead arguments are redundant in the face of social change. Get over it, and stop doing the antis' job for them.

The demise of lead is not due to the BGA, or whatever other idiotic theory the keyboard warriors come up with. Those of us who think shooting has a future know that it is one without lead. Almost every shooting person I have spoken to recently accepts that this is the case. We've seen it coming for years. The organisations are fundamentally right - we need to take the initiative and sort own way forward over the next five years, or somebody else will do it for  us.

The tiny number of lead-Taliban keyboard warriors are utterly unrepresentative of the pragmatic and sensible majority. There is no point debating with leadists - their addled  minds are fixed; they are also totally selfish.

(I'm now off to self-isolate...).

 

Nov 28 2017

"I am a mild mannered chap"

So what's happened since then?

[Farmboy91]

14 minutes ago, wymberley said:

Nov 28 2017

"I am a mild mannered chap"

So what's happened since then?

This whole fiasco has brought out the worst in more than a few.

@8 shot 's post summed it up pretty well.

[rbrowning2]

14 hours ago, Scully said:

About fifteen years too late I’m afraid; that bridge has already been crossed. Dealers could possibly still sell them back then as no one complained, but I’m assuming they are now, as ( according to our shooting orgs ) people will not buy lead shot game. 
We are where we are. 

Eh? Seriously? How on earth are police going to discover which individual was using lead instead of steel unless they were there at the time? Please, think it through. 

I did think it through that’s why I concluded revoke all who shot, that way peer pressure would ensure all complied.
I no it will never happen, but how else will everybody ever comply? As clearly not all who should legally be using non toxic shot are.

[rbrowning2]

1 hour ago, stagboy said:

You almost have to laugh at those few silly old buffers on here who are still in compete denial about the problems of lead.

Move over, and let the younger generation have a chance, before you spoil it for all of us. Lead is going. That's obvious. Oudated pro-lead arguments are redundant in the face of social change. Get over it, and stop doing the antis' job for them.

The demise of lead is not due to the BGA, or whatever other idiotic theory the keyboard warriors come up with. Those of us who think shooting has a future know that it is one without lead. Almost every shooting person I have spoken to recently accepts that this is the case. We've seen it coming for years. The organisations are fundamentally right - we need to take the initiative and sort own way forward over the next five years, or somebody else will do it for  us.

The tiny number of lead-Taliban keyboard warriors are utterly unrepresentative of the pragmatic and sensible majority. There is no point debating with leadists - their addled  minds are fixed; they are also totally selfish.

(I'm now off to self-isolate...).

 

Tiny number don’t make me laugh even the legal ban is being ignored. Yes if asked you know lead will go one day, most will reply  yes but when they need to buy cartridges and their choice is then a 1000 cartridges with lead at £240 and the steel are £440 which do you think they will buy? When I see steel shot cartridges with biodegradable wads selling for less than lead,  then may be we will see a move away from lead.
 

[clangerman]

4 hours ago, Scully said:

Regarding the ‘stinky piles of game we see every season’ then yes, I am. You made the statement as a generic ‘we’, inferring that stinky piles of game were endemic throughout the shooting season. You didn’t claim ‘you’ personally until I asked you to verify your claim. 
I am sick and tired of people slandering the shooting industry with claims they cannot back up. As regards your old boy, he is taking a surplus of shot game, very much like the surplus we sometimes create on our small driven syndicate, ( highest ever bag 48 ) when some of the guns decide they have enough for their personal use. These birds are given away, to there’s who want them, so just like the birds you claim are ‘unwanted’ they are wanted and used by someone. None of ours are stinking however, and I can’t see why your old boy would want stinking birds either! 
You claim you’re going to take photos to this season of the offending piles, but never thought  to do so in the past. I wonder why. I suspect it’s because there are no ‘stinky piles of unwanted game’. 
Either back up your claims, report it to the relevant body, ( like you should have already done ) or stop making allegations you can’t back up. 

as you can see mush i’m not the only one who is aware of unwanted game so maybe mr game shooter we should discuss shoots like chucking down dead birds early morning to con the guns they are part of the bag or having to run ducks of ponds waving bags because they stick like glue let alone fly i make it my business to see everything that goes on in shooting so if you want to get personal calling me a liar i can get personal on shoots son you protest so much i’m starting to think the chaps who claim this is about saving shoots at others expense are right maybe i should look at it closer 

[Scully]

24 minutes ago, clangerman said:

as you can see mush i’m not the only one who is aware of unwanted game so maybe mr game shooter we should discuss shoots like chucking down dead birds early morning to con the guns they are part of the bag or having to run ducks of ponds waving bags because they stick like glue let alone fly i make it my business to see everything that goes on in shooting so if you want to get personal calling me a liar i can get personal on shoots son you protest so much i’m starting to think the chaps who claim this is about saving shoots at others expense are right maybe i should look at it closer 

😂 Is that all you have; calling me names? Show me the proof, not something you’ve heard from a friend or a friend who knows a bloke down the pub who’s second cousins brothers sister says she swears on her kids lives! Get a grip and grow up, and stop trying to discredit other types of shooting to justify your own. 

[clangerman]

1 minute ago, Scully said:

😂 Is that all you have; calling me names? Show me the proof, not something you’ve heard from a friend or a friend who knows a bloke down the pub who’s second cousins brothers sister says she swears on her kids lives! Get a grip and grow up, and stop trying to discredit other types of shooting to justify your own. 

people can read your the one calling me a liar people raising birds in rat infested pens are none of my business until i’m called a liar unlike you i can justify my sport farmers ask for the pigeons to go i get rid of them no raising birds in rat infested pens for me our biggest problem with the public is game shooting i put up with your sport causing me problems you need me i don’t need you 

[Scully]

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

hello, it does bear a rather large amount for one game dealer but the farmer who told me had about 100 partridge in his pick up shot the day before and not wanted by the local shoot/guns/or beaters,

We shot 47 hares in one day on one farm many years ago. Nobody wanted them so we took them to a local chicken processing plant and they were processed into pet food. They were unwanted by the landowner, unwanted by us, and basically unwanted by the processing plant unless we accepted a pittance, which we did. 
The annoying thing was, that the lad who had the job of taking them to the plant after we’d rung round, stopped for fags on his way and left them on display in the back of his pick up.  
It didn’t make the local rags thankfully, but the rumours that went round were rife and varied. I had many a long winded argument with various folk over a long period who had heard the rumours of hares being dumped from the backs of pick ups.

The truth of the matter is that many many shoots can’t handle ALL the game they’d shoot, that doesn’t mean ( as someone has stupidly implied ) that ‘we’ see stinking piles of unwanted game each season. Someone always wants it eventually, which they wouldn’t if in fact they were stinking.