8 Bore Greylag

[Manish]

Gents (and any ladies for the sake of sodding inclusion),

Has anyone ever owned one or had any experience with the beast?? I understand they started life as a 10 then got bored out to an 8 is there any truth to this?? Would it be OK to put steel through it and use it for its true purpose in life?

 

Thanks as ever

 

Edited November 17, 2020 by Manish

[Saltings]

from what i remember you are right a bored out 10g    however a tight 8g bore   to leave more meat in the barrels  dont know about using steel shot   have only used them with lead shot  

[enfieldspares]

Yes. They were a 10 bore re-chambered and re-bored to eight bore. I think Leicester's Ralph Grant sold such and possibly Elderkin's. 

[shakin stevens]

Plenty of folk have bulged and ringed the barrels firing plas wads through them over the years. 

 

[Pushandpull]

Geoff Grant (proprietor of Ralph Grants) came up with the idea. He also imported a small number of single fours at about the same time. Elderkins were quick to take up the idea.

A friend bought the very first from Grant and it is still going strong. Some indeed have been ring-bulged by G-wads - plus sometimes rather optimistic loads. I mean I once had a chap on the phone for an hour begging for help shoehorning 3 oz into one !  I am told they still shoot OK after this but couldn't comment ! Could be a bit of fun at the right price.

[theshootist]

I have just sold mine at auction (originally purchased from a gentleman on here). Mine was a Gunmark, but look identical. 32", wide top rib, fully choked. 

They are a heavily built 10 bore, but even so, launching 8 bore loads though a 10lb gun I found the recoil very heavy. An original 8 bore double would be what, 11 to 14 pounds? 

If you really want to try an 8 but can't afford an original (like me) then they are a good way to go. 

[Manish]

Thanks for the info gents. I think I might have to pass on the one I have found. That and I'm not too sure if the seller is serious as I have sent him a few questions but no response yet

[wigeon jim]

I have had one for years,usually use 2oz lead shot here in Scotland, that gun your looking at will handle 2oz bismuth fibre waded loads no problem ,  Jim.

[Manish]

46 minutes ago, wigeon jim said:

I have had one for years,usually use 2oz lead shot here in Scotland, that gun your looking at will handle 2oz bismuth fibre waded loads no problem ,  Jim.

I was thinking about something to put tss through. I doubt it will put up with that! 

[enfieldspares]

I'm wondering...and you guys will know....if in fact a low velocity similar payload weight of shot through a "10" or better if such could be fettled from a standard 10 bore to make a modern version of chamberless 10 bore on the Heath principle won't actually achieve the same result?

Here's one such original by the very highly reputable firm of Ford's:

https://www.christies.com/lotfinder/Lot/a-rare-10-bore-chamberless-double-barrelled-boxlock-non-ejector-5967412-details.aspx

Here's an American thread on these guns:

https://doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=276052&page=all

Edited November 18, 2020 by enfieldspares

[ratty1]

I've just found the one your looking at, on gun trader. I think it's a lot of money for what it is. Better off getting a greylag 10, will handle steel loads then. Mine does very well 

[Fil]

5 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

I'm wondering...and you guys will know....if in fact a low velocity similar payload weight of shot through a "10" or better if such could be fettled from a standard 10 bore to make a modern version of chamberless 10 bore on the Heath principle won't actually achieve the same result?

Here's one such original by the very highly reputable firm of Ford's:

https://www.christies.com/lotfinder/Lot/a-rare-10-bore-chamberless-double-barrelled-boxlock-non-ejector-5967412-details.aspx

Here's an American thread on these guns:

https://doublegunshop.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=276052&page=all

I worked on one of those Ford chamberless 12's. The chap brought it to me to get through proof. It was near 20 years ago. I prepped the barrels and gave it a tighten. I asked Geoff (at London proof house) what do we proof it for as it has no chambers. He said "for the biggest 12 bore load there is". A 3 1/2" proof load it was then! It passed. 

[enfieldspares]

William Ford were good makers. Yet of the Birmingham makers ignoring the top tier of Powell's and Westley's and the volume makers BSA, Webley and Greener are of the smaller Midland Gun, Thomas Wild, G E Lewis, Bonehill, Holloway & Naughton very little heard of. I've even seen Ford sidelocks certainly once I think. They are almost...and I'm sure some will correct me...now a forgotten maker. Very odd. 

Edited November 18, 2020 by enfieldspares

[Big Mat]

7 hours ago, Manish said:

I was thinking about something to put tss through. I doubt it will put up with that! 

If you're going to use TSS, you're better off going down to a 20 or 28 bore. You'd be throwing money into the air for no reason using a big gun with TSS.

Bismuth or ITM through a bored out 8, if you want to know more about them, ring Elderkins, they've bored a few out.

[Manish]

12 hours ago, ratty1 said:

I've just found the one your looking at, on gun trader. I think it's a lot of money for what it is. Better off getting a greylag 10, will handle steel loads then. Mine does very well 

I thought the same about the price tbh. How does itx stack up against tss though?

[Stonepark]

36 minutes ago, Manish said:

I thought the same about the price tbh. How does itx stack up against tss though?

ITX is 10g\cc to tss 18g\cc,

tss18 no 6 will roughly do the same in energy at 75 yards as No1 lead or BB ITX or steel BBB.

Pattern wise TSS holds a 30 inch pattern with light chokes at 50 yards, all of the others require heavy choke to do a 60 inch pattern at the same range.

[Manish]

1 hour ago, Stonepark said:

ITX is 10g\cc to tss 18g\cc,

tss18 no 6 will roughly do the same in energy at 75 yards as No1 lead or BB ITX or steel BBB.

Pattern wise TSS holds a 30 inch pattern with light chokes at 50 yards, all of the others require heavy choke to do a 60 inch pattern at the same range.

By the sounds of it  12 bore with tss will out shoot a 10 with itx. And a 10 with tss will be a game changer

[Fil]

12 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

William Ford were good makers. Yet of the Birmingham makers ignoring the top tier of Powell's and Westley's and the volume makers BSA, Webley and Greener are of the smaller Midland Gun, Thomas Wild, G E Lewis, Bonehill, Holloway & Naughton very little heard of. I've even seen Ford sidelocks certainly once I think. They are almost...and I'm sure some will correct me...now a forgotten maker. Very odd. 

William Ford guns I have come across were very well made. Yes an underated maker imo. As for Holloways, Gunman might know better but anything made by Holloway for the trade had a number stamped under the barrels prefixed with an H. (H*****) It will also have the "makers" (retailers) number on the guard and usual places. Any gun I've seen with this number was always a very well shaped up, engraved nicely and overall a nicely made gun. I had a beautiful Dickson BLE I believe was made by Holloway. Sold it. Doh!