Gun fit for first gun

[Pigrenok]

Hello!

I used to shoot semi-auto more than 10 years ago (in different country) and since then did not shoot anything. So, I loose any muscle memory in mounting/moving with a shotgun.

I am now looking to buy an Over/Under shotgun. I have been to a local gun shop last week and tried about 15-20 guns. Some felt better than the others (overall, brownings and browning-like guns felt better than beretta and beretta-like ones), but the problem is that my mount is inconsistent, I find that I can mount a gun 5 times and get a good picture and good feel, then mount it 5 more times and get horrible feeling from it. So, after more than an hour I was not sure what actually fits and what not.

So, I am in a vicious circle... I cannot properly check the gun fit without consistent mount, but to get the consistent mount I need to train mounting (at least at home with a mirror) and for this I need to buy a gun (ideally, which will fit me at least relatively well).

I can see two (not necessarily mutually excluding) options:

1. Go to a local shooting ground and hire a gun from them (try different ones over several days/weeks) and see how they will behave in action. It will contribute to mounting consistency and muscle memory, but will not be enough to get good consistent mount.
2. Buy relatively cheap gun which feels OKish now, train with it at home in front of a mirror to get a consistent mount, then, decide whether it fits me well and either leave it or sell it and find one that properly fits me.

I would assume, it must be a common problem for people, who did not start shooting from early age, so, there should be some recommendations, but I failed to find any.

What do you think about the options that I listed above? Do you have any other ideas for what can be done to break the vicious circle?

Thank you very much in advance.

[Mr.C]

I'd go with option 2. You have the advantage of experience telling you you're not consistent. I like you am uncomfortable with Beretta but Browning feels better. After a cheapish "training" gun I settled with a Ceasar Guerini. And still have it. 

[Smokersmith]

Go to a good gun shop that can give good advice on gunfit.

[WalkedUp]

On 21/03/2022 at 16:06, Pigrenok said:

•  
• Buy relatively cheap gun which feels OKish now, train with it at home in front of a mirror to get a consistent mount, then, decide whether it fits me well and either leave it or sell it and find one that properly fits me.

This is the best plan. Not many people are given such good advice, and certainly fewer still come to it themselves!

Buy second hand, when you sell the gun it will have lost very little of its value. 

Slight note to say use the money you have saved to invest in some coaching. 

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Whereabouts are you, someone in your locality may help you.

Your second option would be a good starting point.

[Gunman]

Having done a lot of gun fitting and alterations may I add a few comments that might be helpful .

You can not fit a gun to a person who can not shot or is relatively inexperienced ,semi autos are very different to O/U's so its all about stating agian .

What may feel right now may not do so in 6 months time . As long as the overall measurements are OK then take the gun and shoot it ,Use the same chokes and the same cartridges so avoiding any variants  ,when you miss its you and nothing else .

After say 6 months when you have developed your " style " you can if needed look at gun fitting 

Until you get a consist ant stance and mount ,which is 75% of shooting IMHO you will never be able to shoot consistantly .

Any decent  gunshop should be able to show you the basics and advise on a suitable gun within your budget .If they cant go else ware .

What you need is not always what you may think you want .

By all means take some lessons but in my experience " shooting instructors " do vary so take your time and ask around . 

 

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, the only real way is to go to a RFD or shooting school with a good shooting instructor  who have a O/U try gun where the stock can be altered to suite your measurements , find a suitable shotgun that is the best fit or have the stock altered to the above, then it's down to you with lots of practice, this can be costly but maybe worth the spend, you maybe lucky that like most find a shotgun that fits out the box as I am sure most do, my Yildiz is ideal where I can alter stock length of pull 14.25 inches in winter, 14.50 inches in summer, this suites me fine, everyone is different, just find yours, good luck 

[Fellside]

You’ve identified the classic ‘catch 22’ challenge re entry in to shotgunning. That is: you can’t know what fits till your mount / method is established…….but you need a gun which fits to help you establish the correct mount / method. 

In the ideal world (which we don’t live in) you would have access to several different guns and try them out regularly - until one began to stand out as a winner. While this may not be possible, you can go somewhere towards this ideal, by trying different used guns at various shooting grounds and also getting some good reputable instruction as advised above. Eventually you will notice a particular gun you get on well with. The advice which others have given re buying a second hand version is sound. If you need to sell it as your shooting style develops further - you’ll loose the least money this way. 

Enjoy the journey - keep us posted re what you end up with. 

[Ultrastu]

Buy an adjustable gun .problem solved .

[Pigrenok]

4 hours ago, TIGHTCHOKE said:

Whereabouts are you, someone in your locality may help you.

I am from near Bedford. I know several shooting people, but they are way too far away and I do not know anybody here.

[enfieldspares]

This is true wisdom -

Quote

As long as the overall measurements are OK then take the gun and shoot it ,Use the same chokes and the same cartridges so avoiding any variants  ,when you miss its you and nothing else .

This. Option 1: 

1. Go to a local shooting ground and hire a gun from them (try different ones over several days/weeks) and see how they will behave in action. It will contribute to mounting consistency and muscle memory, but will not be enough to get good consistent mount.

If option 1 here's a tip. Shoot it on an English Skeet layout on the away bird from station 7 low house going away. That will give you an idea of if your cast is correct as you'll have three results. Bird hit on its left, bird hit on its right or bird centred and killed full on clean.

Then move to station 4 high house as a single crosser. Again you'll either (once you sorted yourself out for lead) be below the bird, over the bird or cleanly killed in the centre to lower 40% of the pattern. This will show the drop is correct.

As a check then try station 7 shooting the high house incomer. This will check the cast is correct and the drop. IMHO if you have the choice use a tight choke doing all of this and not a Skeet choke as a tight choke will help better illustrate the error which is good. And regardless always "gun down".

Whatever you do you do NOT want to shoot different birds with different guns. You want to shoot a bird that is like a MacDonald's sanwich. Yes using different guns but always the same bird. That is the same with no variation from week in to week out and wherever and whenever it is presented to you. If your club hasn't a Skeet set up then try a simple old school Down The Line bird that has no "wobble" on it. So a simple fixed straight going away.

If you can't get that get the nearest possible similar bid that may be a simple "springing teal" or straight overhead driven incomer.

Or get a proper fitting...treat yourself...at place that can do it properly. And that is not one that levers off butt plates or recoil pads and puts in shims. It is a place with a proper adjustable over/under try gun. I'd suggest Holland's at Northwood and get there an hour before so as to relax. Worst time to do a gun fit is after a long drive or a long train ride sat in a narrow seat. Do it right. Do it once. Then in ten years time do it again as you'll likely be a bit slimmer, fatter, wider and etc., etc..

Edited March 23, 2022 by enfieldspares

[Pigrenok]

17 hours ago, Mr.C said:

I'd go with option 2. You have the advantage of experience telling you you're not consistent. I like you am uncomfortable with Beretta but Browning feels better. After a cheapish "training" gun I settled with a Ceasar Guerini. And still have it. 

That is a good compromise

[Pigrenok]

9 hours ago, enfieldspares said:

If option 1 here's a tip. Shoot it on an English Skeet layout on the away bird from station 7 low house going away. That will give you an idea of if your cast is correct as you'll have three results. Bird hit on its left, bird hit on its right or bird centred and killed full on clean.

Then move to station 4 high house as a single crosser. Again you'll either (once you sorted yourself out for lead) be below the bird, over the bird or cleanly killed in the centre to lower 40% of the pattern. This will show the drop is correct.

As a check then try station 7 shooting the high house incomer. This will check the cast is correct and the drop. IMHO if you have the choice use a tight choke doing all of this and not a Skeet choke as a tight choke will help better illustrate the error which is good. And regardless always "gun down".

Whatever you do you do NOT want to shoot different birds with different guns. You want to shoot a bird that is like a MacDonald's sanwich. Yes using different guns but always the same bird. That is the same with no variation from week in to week out and wherever and whenever it is presented to you. If your club hasn't a Skeet set up then try a simple old school Down The Line bird that has no "wobble" on it. So a simple fixed straight going away.

Thank you very much for such a detailed plan of action.

I had English Skeet in mind actually myself. And my shooting ground has one (if not two) layouts for skeet, so, I should be OK.

[Pigrenok]

For some reason, approval of my messages takes ages...

OK, it seems, I am not the only one in this and it is (as expected) common problem.

It is interesting that the opinions split between two options.

I guess, I would go with a mix. Luckily, my local ground has several hire guns, which I can borrow and try. I will go with this option for several visits and try to shoot simple stable targets, but with tight chokes (as @enfieldspares suggested).

I do not know why I did not think of it before, but I have a pcp air rifle and I can practice mounting it at home. It is different from shotgun in many ways, but one thing is common is how and where on the face and shoulder you mount a gun. I was almost always used it from bipod/tripod and a lot with night kit with a screen, so, I did not properly mount it before. So, the last couple of days I actually got to know my air rifle so much better.

So, home practice (with what I have) to get more consistent mount and stock feel, a couple of sessions with hire guns at shooting ground and then buying a second-hand gun for further practice.

Again, many-many thanks to everybody who took their time and actually gave fantastic suggestions and ideas for practice.

If any of you local (Bedfordshire), I would love to meet at a shooting ground and have a round (I do not expect any tuition or help, just to meet more like minded people).