Symbols on deeds / railway maps

[PeterHenry]

Reaching out to the collective knowledge of Pigeon Watch

Does anyone know what the circled symbols mean on the attached picture?

Unfortunately it doesn't have a key accompanying it....

I'm hoping it has something to do with a water connection.

[ditchman]

does the "H" stand for hydrant ?

[oldypigeonpopper]

16 minutes ago, ditchman said:

does the "H" stand for hydrant ?

Hello, Simon maybe right, sometimes your find the cast iron tops painted yellow by the fire service , 

[oowee]

I don't think it is a symbol but an annotation. It looks like it indicates a service. What water authority area is it or railway provider (at the date of the drawing / plan). It looks to be the initials of the provider rather than a aymbol. 

Are there any more on the plan? 

[Agriv8]

Might help to have a bit more of map ?

Agriv8

[old'un]

Is the area shaded blue a canal?

[PeterHenry]

4 hours ago, ditchman said:

does the "H" stand for hydrant ?

Good thought - I was not sure if it was a 'H' or a 'W' though.

4 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, Simon maybe right, sometimes your find the cast iron tops painted yellow by the fire service , 

👍

2 hours ago, oowee said:

I don't think it is a symbol but an annotation. It looks like it indicates a service. What water authority area is it or railway provider (at the date of the drawing / plan). It looks to be the initials of the provider rather than a aymbol. 

Are there any more on the plan? 

👍 - that hadn't occurred to me. It was originally part of the North Staffordshire Railway, before successive mergers. No idea about the water authority - the line closed in 1971.

1 hour ago, Agriv8 said:

Might help to have a bit more of map ?

Agriv8

👍

1 hour ago, old'un said:

Is the area shaded blue a canal?

The blue bit is part of the disused railway yard that my family own.

 

------

 

So, to beef things out a little more, there is a prexisting water connection located in exactly the same place the three letters indicate. One of my neighbours who has lived opposite long enough to remember railway being in operation, remembers there being a signal box in that spot, and remembers it having a water connection because he use to go in there and have cups of tea occasionally.

The problem is that the fact that this is a legitimate water supply was been lost to the mists of time.... its not recognised by United Utilities, and so despite the fact that it is there, I can't pay them to use it. Being a law abiding type, I would like to pay them for its use - but the nearest they will come is a new connection at around £10,000 - because they will have to close a footpath / bus stop / lane of the road / set up temporary traffic lights.

I think it's unreasonable to pay £10,000 for something I already have....

[ShootingEgg]

What is where it says SMH on the map. Also it's not 100% clear what the letters you circled say, TH* what is the * ??

[PeterHenry]

1 minute ago, ShootingEgg said:

What is where it says SMH on the map. Also it's not 100% clear what the letters you circled say, TH* what is the * ??

SMH = 'Station Masters House' I presume 

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, it would most likely come from a mains supply to a signal box if there was a level crossing or like you said a station masters house, have you looked for the stop tap , if it crosses your land dig out a trench and find the pipe

Edited August 27, 2022 by oldypigeonpopper

[PeterHenry]

1 minute ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, it would most likely come from a mains supply to a signal box if there was a level crossing

It does, infuriatingly. It's really obvious - but I need someway to prove to United Utilities that its not one I have put in myself. Because as its not on their system, it could be made with sub standard materials.....

[oldypigeonpopper]

1 minute ago, PeterHenry said:

It does, infuriatingly. It's really obvious - but I need someway to prove to United Utilities that its not one I have put in myself. Because as its not on their system, it could be made with sub standard materials.....

Hello, its most likely galvanised steel pipe and brass tap 

[PeterHenry]

1 hour ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, its most likely galvanised steel pipe and brass tap 

It's just proving it without digging up the connection - which is right on the footpath and close to a lot of other utilities. I was reckoning on the best way being identifying it on a map or deed.

[oldypigeonpopper]

1 hour ago, PeterHenry said:

It's just proving it without digging up the connection - which is right on the footpath and close to a lot of other utilities. I was reckoning on the best way being identifying it on a map or deed.

Hello, if it was railroad property and if they built the station masters house they may have not thought to put the services on the house plans, working on TWA we come across this quite often 

[PeterHenry]

2 minutes ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

Hello, if it was railroad property and if they built the station masters house they may have not thought to put the services on the house plans, working on TWA we come across this quite often 

Possibly a daft question - but what do you mean by TWA?

[oldypigeonpopper]

10 minutes ago, PeterHenry said:

Possibly a daft question - but what do you mean by TWA?

I worked for many years on Thames Water laying new pipes up to 6 inch  and fixing leaks , fitting meters, new property connections, we tapped the mains with out switching off the water, burst water mains in winter 🤔🙄

Edited August 27, 2022 by oldypigeonpopper

[mel b3]

This may be wrong for all sorts of reasons,  but , can't you just use it , and say nothing. 

It's your water supply , and it's on your property. If the water company won't take your money , stuff em.

[Walker570]

The line seems to indicate a point beneath the railway line. You can see the mark looks like a tunnel entrance but obviously much smaller is that the location of the connection If so it's on your property anyway. I don't think the location is where the lettering is.

[Agriv8]

So I think that’s a line to allow TLA ( three letter acronym) for points switch leaver or signal. As the line for the signal that goes through the No1.

no water is shown for station masters house and that would be of same supply ?

Agriv8 

 

[PeterHenry]

23 hours ago, oldypigeonpopper said:

I worked for many years on Thames Water laying new pipes up to 6 inch  and fixing leaks , fitting meters, new property connections, we tapped the mains with out switching off the water, burst water mains in winter 🤔🙄

👍

14 hours ago, mel b3 said:

This may be wrong for all sorts of reasons,  but , can't you just use it , and say nothing. 

It's your water supply , and it's on your property. If the water company won't take your money , stuff em.

Your not the first person to suggest that - but one of my jobs holds me to a standard re honesty, both inside and outside work. Basically, it's just not worth running the risk.

14 hours ago, Walker570 said:

The line seems to indicate a point beneath the railway line. You can see the mark looks like a tunnel entrance but obviously much smaller is that the location of the connection If so it's on your property anyway. I don't think the location is where the lettering is.

Good point cheers

10 hours ago, Agriv8 said:

So I think that’s a line to allow TLA ( three letter acronym) for points switch leaver or signal. As the line for the signal that goes through the No1.

no water is shown for station masters house and that would be of same supply ?

Agriv8 

 

True - I didn't think about that 👍