Minky Posted January 14 Report Share Posted January 14 (edited) I need a 1oz load for lead 20 gauge. This is for standing on fox drives. Since the wildfowl/ lead ban no one makes lead heavies. Don't need many, well you wouldn't. Another reason that no one makes or sells lead heavies. I've got numerous powders and types of wads plastic and fibre. Edited January 14 by Minky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Stonepark Posted January 14 Report Share Posted January 14 Please state what hulls and their length, primers, powders and wads you have and then someone can intelligently suggest what loads would be feasible? If you already have a 1oz load for game this would work for heavies though you might need to alter the column height slightly. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahamch Posted January 14 Report Share Posted January 14 Fiocchi make 3 inch lead heavy loads in 20 bore Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 14 Author Report Share Posted January 14 25 minutes ago, grahamch said: Fiocchi make 3 inch lead heavy loads in 20 bore I need a loading which is for 70mm Fiocci cases. 209 winchester primers wads ... ( I have various fibre and plastics available). And various powders available. I'd just like a few suggestions if people load 1oz of BB to investigate the merits and safety Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enfieldspares Posted January 14 Report Share Posted January 14 (edited) I think that in one ounce that BB is too few pellets. From my limited experience my advice would be #3 size. Many many years ago I indeed had Eley 20 Bore Alphamax #3 and at fifteen yards they'd penetrate though the rib bones of a sheep carcass. Given that they'll easily penetrate through the ribs or skull of a fox. If #2 were available they might be best but in one ounce BB or #1 is too few pellets. SIZE DIA mm Pellets per 1 ounce BB 4.0mm 70 1 3.8mm 90 2 3.6mm 100 3 3.3mm 140 Edited January 14 by enfieldspares Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave at kelton Posted January 16 Report Share Posted January 16 Could you not remove the lead from an existing and replace with larger allowing for volume issues? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 16 Author Report Share Posted January 16 (edited) On 14/01/2024 at 15:47, enfieldspares said: I think that in one ounce that BB is too few pellets. From my limited experience my advice would be #3 size. Many many years ago I indeed had Eley 20 Bore Alphamax #3 and at fifteen yards they'd penetrate though the rib bones of a sheep carcass. Given that they'll easily penetrate through the ribs or skull of a fox. If #2 were available they might be best but in one ounce BB or #1 is too few pellets. SIZE DIA mm Pellets per 1 ounce BB 4.0mm 70 1 3.8mm 90 2 3.6mm 100 3 3.3mm 140 Generally when I stand forward I use a 12 with 1-1/4 of #3in rh barrel and 1-1/4 of BB in left for the longer shot. But in a lot of cases in woodland and general drives the object target is CLOSE. AND in a high proportion i could use standard birds shot loads because the pattern hasn't opened and it is like being hit by a loose Breneke. I did have one drive where one jumped a fence and took the #3 and did a sort of forward roll in mid air. A few minutes later I saw another in the wood in front of me, then it disappeared. Suddenly it shoved its way under the fence in between my feet.? This one caught another charge of #3 right between its shoulder blades. both were instinct shots. There seems to be two sorts of flush with Charlie's. One where the drivers put a foot in the drive to hear a shot and Charlie bolts out the other end of the wood to present a shot. The other scenario is that the drivers almost get to the standing guns when Charlie will either slip out the side, go back through the line or find a standing gun who is not paying attention and is either watering a tree, lighting a fag or left his position to chat to the next gun. Then there are the situations of bang, bang or bang, bang....bang bang bang and you instinctively know that Charlie has slipped away. I want a 20 load that will do the job when on the sewlin line or ona side ditch or similar. Edit .. as long as the load is put on the target it will do the job. Humpteen Charlie's have been taken around whe chicken house with a 410 . Edited January 16 by Minky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
enfieldspares Posted January 16 Report Share Posted January 16 1 hour ago, Minky said: It is like being hit by a loose Breneke. This is correct. Fifty plus years ago met a friend of my late father known to all as "Tiger" Chapman. He'd shot a tiger or two in India back in the past. I asked how what with as at that age I was reading Jim Corbett. He told me that he used a 12 bore side by side shotgun when "following up". I had all sorts of ideas about slug, round ball, lethal ball, LG, SSG or whatever. So I asked him what shot he used. "Number 6. It hold's together remarkably well at close ranges." Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 16 Author Report Share Posted January 16 Yes. Some years ago we were going to shift up any duck that might be resting on a pond just out in the field out from a flowing ditch. I was with the dog coming into the ditch and the dog and I were headed to the pond. Suddenly there was a call CHARLIE.:! and right next to the dog and I about 5..6 paces away, it burst out onto the field and I swung round with my Berreta 20 loaded with #6 and it fell. It looked as if it had taken every pellet in the pattern. Many times when we were out on walked up we would bolt a Charlie from anywhere being totally un prepared for the encounter as we were expectin something like a rabbit, pigeon or a pheasant. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
London Best Posted January 17 Report Share Posted January 17 The last Fox I killed with a shotgun fell dead to 25 grams No.5 from a 20 bore. It was 25 good paces away. A standard game load will kill foxes at this range. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 17 Author Report Share Posted January 17 (edited) So what load combos have reloading people got.? The current availability situation regarding reloading components is difficult and sometimes its not what would be the best fit it is what you can get. So come on guys let's have the 1oz loads. Edited January 17 by Minky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
30-6 Posted January 19 Report Share Posted January 19 Probably not available any more, I have a box each of Eley in BB's and AAA's in 20g. The BB are RTO but the AAA are crimped. I have in the past as suggested above, opened up some 1oz loads and sacrificed a couple of 12g cartridges to swap shot size. I used to swap Sellior and Bellot no 7's with a RTO, probably not available any more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted January 20 Report Share Posted January 20 On 14/01/2024 at 00:57, Minky said: I need a 1oz load for lead 20 gauge. This is for standing on fox drives. Since the wildfowl/ lead ban no one makes lead heavies. Don't need many, well you wouldn't. Another reason that no one makes or sells lead heavies. I've got numerous powders and types of wads plastic and fibre. blue dot is ok for 1oz 20g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 20 Author Report Share Posted January 20 Good ole blue dot. But have you got a load recipe preferably for use with fibre loads or plaswad. A lot of places don't like you using plastic nowadays. Its not about stock Its more about littering wads that are still there years later. For the small amount that I would use there is no urgent need. I could easily use stock of 12s that I have but it's just something to have / know about. I can experiment but it would be helpful to have the wadding column structure. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Windswept Posted January 20 Report Share Posted January 20 There's some heavy 20 fibre and plastic loads here: http://www.gualandi.it/en/tables.html I've not tried them and use at your own risk etc, etc... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 20 Author Report Share Posted January 20 On 19/01/2024 at 13:18, 30-6 said: Probably not available any more, I have a box each of Eley in BB's and AAA's in 20g. The BB are RTO but the AAA are crimped. I have in the past as suggested above, opened up some 1oz loads and sacrificed a couple of 12g cartridges to swap shot size. I used to swap Sellior and Bellot no 7's with a RTO, probably not available any more. This mirrors when a friend wanted a few for his son to use in his 20. He had been to Potters and told no one made cartridges of that type since non toxic rules. So he presented me with a box of 3" ...1oz #5 shot 20s and a box of 12s BB that he had obtained somewhere and he said make me something out of that lot. Seeing as the 20s were factory 1oz it was just a case of load swap and a roll turnover. Somewhere I have the load empty 12g cases of the donor box of 12bbs that if I could find them I could re fashion to a new cartridge loaded with something like #7. It's just a fun exercise to blast off at clays. Just for fun. 24 minutes ago, Windswept said: There's some heavy 20 fibre and plastic loads here: http://www.gualandi.it/en/tables.html I've not tried them and use at your own risk etc, etc... Thanks for the consideration. Loads to examine and understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted January 22 Report Share Posted January 22 On 20/01/2024 at 20:21, hawkfanz said: blue dot is ok for 1oz 20g. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 24 Author Report Share Posted January 24 (edited) Thanks for those pages. Is it possible to re post them again ... in focus. Perhaps as single images because the information is quite blured. OR. Does anyone know where that data can be found online. Thanks Edited January 24 by Minky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 24 Author Report Share Posted January 24 On 20/01/2024 at 21:30, Windswept said: There's some heavy 20 fibre and plastic loads here: http://www.gualandi.it/en/tables.html I've not tried them and use at your own risk etc, etc... Thanks for these. I've had a look at the powder/ components and my 7/8 load uses less powder than their listing. My loading is quite a nice load and dusts clays if I put the load on the clay. The load on that list must be quite a cracker with that amount of powder. And IF I were to load a up a few I would be careful to reduce the list loading SLIGHTLY and do a few tests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted January 25 Report Share Posted January 25 On 24/01/2024 at 18:28, Minky said: Thanks for those pages. Is it possible to re post them again ... in focus. Perhaps as single images because the information is quite blured. OR. Does anyone know where that data can be found online. Thanks will rescan tomorow an post for you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 26 Author Report Share Posted January 26 (edited) Thanks very much for that. What is the source of that data,? Hogedon or Allianz etc. I could see the images but the blur was pretty bad. As with the information on the gualandi pages up there I look the data over and match to a load and powder that I might have and then load a few under the loading and see how they shoot and the speed over the chrono. as I wrote above my shoot loads are less than the published loads and they shoot very well with out any problem. it's cheaper on powders and it is less recoil for me so a win win. ps. with the current situation with reloading components its not what you would like to reload with it is what is available and you can get your hands on. Edited January 26 by Minky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted January 26 Report Share Posted January 26 Just now, hawkfanz said: plenty more 1oz loads useing different cases. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minky Posted January 27 Author Report Share Posted January 27 (edited) Thanks again for taking the trouble to do that. Somewhere in all of the reloading sheets and handout pamphlets I have collected over the years I have that data. I thought that it looked familiar. Checking through that data, My Green Dot load with a win primer is half a grain less at 14 grains but with Fibre wadding to get the column height right. My load seems to be a very good load both in shooting and effect at the target. Edited January 27 by Minky Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hawkfanz Posted January 27 Report Share Posted January 27 i would gladly use green dot for the lighter 20g load if i could get it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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