Following on from the Budget, why shouldn't Farmers pay inheritance tax like the rest of us?

[oldypigeonpopper]

On 10/11/2024 at 09:52, ehb102 said:

The thing that no one wants to talk about is that farmers do us the favour. The population needs to eat. We can't always rely on cheap imports of food and if we relied wholey on them we would starve. What happens if something happens and imports are no longer possible? War, environmental changes, anything out of a John Wyndham book. 

Then again farmers are being slightly disingenuous. If you set your farm up in a trust so it may only be a farm and it is protected so you may never sell any part of the land, it must always remain a farm then you can't just sell off a few acres for a couple of houses every time you want to marry off a daughter or buy a new milking parlour. They want that autonomy. And that would mean having it both ways. 

Hello, My friends farm gave up milking years ago, Sold the Quota and now Parlour redundant as they could not make it pay ??

[Agriv8]

My parents are in that nice house category John bought a house we never had much growing up but were clothed and fed !

A nice farming analogy that I don’t think our new Labour gov have grasped

Taxation, gentlemen, is very much like dairy farming. The task is to extract the maximum amount of milk with the minimum amount of moo.

Terry Pratchett, Jingo (Discworld, #21; City Watch, #4)

Agriv8

[old man]

20 hours ago, Agriv8 said:

My parents are in that nice house category John bought a house we never had much growing up but were clothed and fed !

A nice farming analogy that I don’t think our new Labour gov have grasped

 

Taxation, gentlemen, is very much like dairy farming. The task is to extract the maximum amount of milk with the minimum amount of moo.

Terry Pratchett, Jingo (Discworld, #21; City Watch, #4)

Agriv8

Mm, as a leveller. Maybe the biggest mistake any voter can make is to think that the receiving politician is legal, decent and honest?

Most are not and respond avidly to their masters whims without a care for the voters original wish? 

Politics is just a well paid play group?

[oldypigeonpopper]

Hello, Like Thatcher, Starmers not for turning, 🤔

[TIGHTCHOKE]

Well fancy that........................................................

Two Tier Kier ran away.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/starmer-budget-family-farm-tax-b2648253.html

[Dave-G]

To be fair though, how many PM's address protesters during and at their protest location?

[KPV4]

There are two things that are certain in life - death and taxes…!!

With the latter it has to be fair, everyone is working to benefit their family in death and farming is no different, so should be subject to the same taxes as the rest of the hard working population… farming is a business, so must be subject to the taxes in death that other business owners and the general public are subject to, and always should have been, as it would have given more opportunity for the younger generation.

Those who have purchased large farms, or bought extra land to evade the tax system, then they will now have to pay their taxes like the rest of us. The new proposals are still more favourable to farmers than everyone else.! So why keep complaining, you didn’t have these exceptions before 1984…. I know many farmers, yes it’s hard work 365 days a year, but there are many benefits, as has been posted before, lots of new £60k plus vehicles floating around, all in the tax reclaim system…. Jo blogs doesn’t have these benefits… perhaps it’s time farmers actually looked how well off the majority are, there are lots of benefits and tax breaks they get, just like other business owners that jo blogs on the street doesn’t get. I’ve no problem with that, but lets stop moaning about the new changes.

Everyone is talking about £1M threshold, if the farm is in joint ownership with a spouse it moves to a £3M threshold, if it’s only in one name or isn’t being transferred to family under the 7 year rule which applies to us all,  I have to ask why..? Is there little trust issue between farmers and their families.?. if so why…? I know a solicitor very well who informs me he hasn’t had time to sleep since the budget… the phones are red hot in the office, with farmers trying to find ways around the new tax rules..!!!! That tells me a lot… The old saying is right - “have always wants more”……!!

Maybe the chickens (in those large sheds) are now coming home to roost..! 

[TOPGUN749]

On 09/11/2024 at 20:56, 39TDS said:

Still means the end of the business and livelihood but I think more importantly means the end of that family farm. As Kier said "It can't come back", I really do think that should be a national concern but nobody seems to care.

 

That £350k is £500k if left to offspring.

£325,000 threshold if no wife or children.

[JohnfromUK]

57 minutes ago, TOPGUN749 said:

£325,000 threshold if no wife or children.

The other key issue is that IF the farm owner chooses to give away the property and (hope to) live for7 years to remove the Inheritance Tax (IHT) liability - there is another tax that does apply.

If someone 'gives' away any property, there is (unless it is the prime dwelling house) Capital Gains Tax (CGT) due.  Note that this applies on gifts as well as sales, because the tax is levied on a 'disposal'.

If the farm in question is a long held family farm, the CGT is probably chargeable on the change in value from when the current owner inherited it from his predecessor to the date of the gift (and also includes inflation!). CGT is currently 18% or 28%.

Hence this idea that a farm can easily be given away tax free under the "7 year rule" is NOT TRUE.  It is true that it can be free of IHT, but it is very far from tax free as both CGT and Stamp Duty are probably payable.  Potentially, that could well be over the 20% of IHT that would be due.

In addition, there is the risk that if the owner transfers the farm to use the 7 year rule, and pays the CGT and Stamp duty, then dies before 7 years has passed, IHT will be payable AS WELL ........ so it ius a very risky thing to do for an older person.

[TOPGUN749]

Some farmers have said they can get cheaper cartridges for their clay shooting by reclaiming the vat. So while most of us pay £300 a thousand, they pay £250.

[Scully]

1 hour ago, TOPGUN749 said:

Some farmers have said they can get cheaper cartridges for their clay shooting by reclaiming the vat. So while most of us pay £300 a thousand, they pay £250.

Which farmers are these then? 
I knew a haulage company owner who would buy his cartridges ( both clay and game ) from a local agricultural supplier which went down on the receipt as ‘detergent’, so what does that prove?